My daily is now totaled

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I doubt that was controllable given the speed and conditions so I'm not going to go holier than thou on your driving prowess. My take is you were caught out on the law of percentages on something that you've gotten away with before - something all of us can fall victim to whatever the endeavour. In your case: different car, weight, type and width of tires. Does that make you a bad driver? NO. Does that make you more conscious of the implications going forward? Absolutely.

Glad you're OK.
 
I'm happy to hear you are ok and that nobody else was hurt. Cars can always be replaced and that's why we all carry an insurance policy.

I have to admit that I too had several close calls in my driving career, but only one ended up being an accident and it involved black ice. In retrospect I probably followed a bit too closely, but who knows if that would've prevented anything.

It's easy to cast stones, just make sure you don't live in a glass house.
 
Yeah that's not an accident, that's negligence. Too fast for conditions at the minimum.

I'd consider myself lucky that I didn't hit anyone else.
 
Originally Posted by MrWideTires

Some Goodyear eagle sports all seasons.. horrible, they only had 11k on them.

Goes to show you...I had these tires on my FXT and miss them. Much more fun than the RT43s I have now.
As I mentioned above, though, I did find that they did tend to break loose in the wet whereas the RT43s will get squirmy but hang on...but I didn't think the Eagles had a low wet threshold.
That was the biggest thing that TireRack mentioned in their testing of the tire, IIRC...they said it was lacking in wet traction compared to other tires in the class.
The customer ratings didn't reflect that, though, so I bought them anyway and liked them.

Different strokes for different folks...
 
Originally Posted by Danno
Originally Posted by gathermewool


None of us can tell from the video whether he was driving too fast. Visibility looked good, so why would he have reason to slow down on a straight road?
IMO, it's either the driver's fault, IF he had experienced any sort of hydro-planing prior to accident prior to the accident and didn't slow down, OR
it's the tires fault for being at the limit and not giving any indication, OR
it was a freak accident, with the perfect combination of road surface, rain, wind and drainage flow.


Nothing freak about it.
I could tell he was driving too fast because he crashed. No lack of evidence there.
And the OP stated he felt the tires had sub-standard grip from prior experience. Corroborating evidence.
OP was over driving conditions and equipment.




Possibly; HOWEVER, it's not a certainty.

1. The OP just wrecked his car and is looking for things to blame. He also implies that a Subaru would have saved the day, which is not a certainty. Based on this, the tires may have been fine. Just because the OP says they have substandard grip (in a spin-happy, sporty FWD vehicle, no less) doesn't make it true.

2. I've had close calls while driving below the speed limit and with appropriate tires.

3. Again, the road ran straight with no obvious indications of impending doom...that we can see.

4. It's not a perfect video and we weren't there, so me saying it MIGHT HAVE BEEN a freak accident seem more likely than you saying it was definitely user error. No one should be so certain when it comes to things like this.
 
Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by zorobabel
Why were doing 70 when you knew your tires sucked?
He was bored of the car, so he wanted it gone.
smile.gif



At least OP is being truthful.

I was in a similar situation years ago with a 1990 Mazda Protege.
I got the car for a VERY good price (and that was the only reason why I bought it).
After I realized my mistake-and had sold my much more enjoyable 84 Rabbit, I despised the auto trans Mazda.
Up to that point I insisted I'd only driven-and enjoyed- manual transmission vehicles.

A short while later while running late for class, I totaled it off in a parking lot when I hit an oncoming driver in another car.
Insurance paid me out better than what I paid for the car a month prior.

Boy was I glad to be rid of the car!
banana2.gif

After that I insisted I needed a car that was manual and made me happy-while on a student's budget.
Got myself into my first BMW 3 series and never looked at motoring the same way again.

I recall another forum member's signature stating "buy what makes you smile".
Not only will you be a safer driver (by protecting your investment), you'll also be saving the lives of those around you.
 
Quote
…... It's not a perfect video and we weren't there, so me saying it MIGHT HAVE BEEN a freak accident seem more likely than you saying it was definitely user error. No one should be so certain when it comes to things like this.....
This much is certain, in addition to the video the OP said he was going 70mph as he left road. Everyone can see how hard it was raining when he lost control and the vehicle left the road. Safe to infer that the speed was too fast for the conditions shown. And speed is a major factor in hydroplaning incidents. Further, the OP says he never liked the tires, so 70 mph in a downpour with them at the least, poor judgement. As noted by others, thankfully no one injured including any other innocent driver. Could have been far worse.

I do appreciate the OP posting the yt as it shows just what hydroplaning can do. When I think of what might have been, I prefer to think if driving even ~10 mph less perhaps the incident avoided. In the end, a costly lesson but only in terms of dollars, not human life. That is the positive here.
 
Originally Posted by Ws6
This thread really makes me feel good about driving, knowing how everyone is so perfect at it.


I realize that is heavy sarcasm...

The problem is the OP made a mistake, and is blaming factors (the tires) other than himself.

Lots of people seem to have a problem accepting responsibility for their own actions. It sort of seems like that is becoming the new normal.
 
Originally Posted by madRiver
Apparently you drove too fast for conditions and your recovery skills. So glad you are not hurt.



Yep but it's the tires fault. Sorry OP but this is a case of personal irresponsibility nothing but best wishes for you in the future. The tires are not the problem.
 
I had a couple of youthful moments that shaped my driving habits as an adult. I'd never consider going that speed in the rain, because I've experienced how quickly things go wrong.

Driving in the snow was a great way to experience the physics below 20 mph, and I learned just how little control you have once traction is compromised. A couple of 20 mph handbrake turns on wet pavement taught me how quickly a vehicle can "snap-turn" where there's just no way to bring it back. As a prior MTB sport-class rider, I also saw how fragile our "meat stick" bodies are against solid objects. My dad taught me to go to big open parking lots in the snow to figure out snow steering/braking when I was learning to drive. I was dedicated enough in my 20s, to, when it snowed, go out at 2 am when the roads were empty to figure out where the traction limits were in our vehicles at the time.

fortunately for me, that cautious approach amounted to 2 bent rims while learning the limits of handling the vehicle in slick stuff.

Recently, In the '18 F150, I was quite surprised that with the highly-reviewed Hankook tires on it, the steering felt very light at 55 mph in medium rain. I was being passed repeatedly by other traffic while I pulled back to 50. I really couldn't figure it out - either my vehicle/tire combination was not optimal, or other folks were more comfortable with reduced control. I kept to the right....
 
Originally Posted by Sayjac
Quote
…... It's not a perfect video and we weren't there, so me saying it MIGHT HAVE BEEN a freak accident seem more likely than you saying it was definitely user error. No one should be so certain when it comes to things like this.....
This much is certain, in addition to the video the OP said he was going 70mph as he left road. Everyone can see how hard it was raining when he lost control and the vehicle left the road. Safe to infer that the speed was too fast for the conditions shown. And speed is a major factor in hydroplaning incidents. Further, the OP says he never liked the tires, so 70 mph in a downpour with them at the least, poor judgement. As noted by others, thankfully no one injured including any other innocent driver. Could have been far worse.

I do appreciate the OP posting the yt as it shows just what hydroplaning can do. When I think of what might have been, I prefer to think if driving even ~10 mph less perhaps the incident avoided. In the end, a costly lesson but only in terms of dollars, not human life. That is the positive here.


At what speed or lower could he have left the road and crashed before we'd lay off him?

60

50

What if he lied and said he was doing 45 (and no one did the marker math)?


We all make judgement calls and sometimes they turn out to be faulty.

I once slid sideways doing 20MPH. The rise and fall of the road wasn't visible prior to creating the mini hill and I was luckily able to regain control. I wonder if what would be said if f I had continued to slide into the guard rail, if I shared my story.

I also, stupidly maybe, drove 65 MPH past everyone else doing 45 MPH in my FXT during along drive with brand new snow tires. I occasionally brake checked and steering checked while driving through the slush and felt confident in my speed. The only time I slowed down was while passing large groups of vehicles, in case one of them decided to cut me off...which DID happen
 
Even with good tires I wouldn't be hauling donkey butt on a rainy road. The basic speed law - drive no faster than that is safe for given conditions. Tires, AWD, ABS/ASR(traction control)/ESP(stability control) can't override the laws of physics.
 
Originally Posted by MrWideTires
Originally Posted by zorobabel
Why were doing 70 when you knew your tires sucked?


Because I'm an idiot



First step is acknowledging reality. I don't think you are an idiot just made a poor and likely expensive decision.

Hydroplaning is scary as I can imagine it akin to hitting sheer ice.
 
Originally Posted by Danno
Excessive speed for conditions and equipment.


I'm also thinking driver error.
I've used plenty of Goodyear tires, even the cheap Integrity tires, and never had this problem. This is on front wheel drive cars.
 
Originally Posted by 02SE
Originally Posted by Ws6
This thread really makes me feel good about driving, knowing how everyone is so perfect at it.


I realize that is heavy sarcasm...

The problem is the OP made a mistake, and is blaming factors (the tires) other than himself.

Lots of people seem to have a problem accepting responsibility for their own actions. It sort of seems like that is becoming the new normal.

I out drove my tires once. I changed tires and could then drive the speed I got in trouble at, in rain etc. I blame myself for not knowing my tires had horrible limits. It was my fault, but the tires were amazingly [censored] for new $300+/ea tires.
 
Originally Posted by Ws6
Originally Posted by 02SE
Originally Posted by Ws6
This thread really makes me feel good about driving, knowing how everyone is so perfect at it.


I realize that is heavy sarcasm...

The problem is the OP made a mistake, and is blaming factors (the tires) other than himself.

Lots of people seem to have a problem accepting responsibility for their own actions. It sort of seems like that is becoming the new normal.

I out drove my tires once. I changed tires and could then drive the speed I got in trouble at, in rain etc. I blame myself for not knowing my tires had horrible limits. It was my fault, but the tires were amazingly [censored] for new $300+/ea tires.


I've outdriven and outridden the traction limits of certain tires too. It was also my fault, just as it was the OP's fault. Which was my point.
 
Originally Posted by 02SE
Originally Posted by Ws6
Originally Posted by 02SE
Originally Posted by Ws6
This thread really makes me feel good about driving, knowing how everyone is so perfect at it.


I realize that is heavy sarcasm...

The problem is the OP made a mistake, and is blaming factors (the tires) other than himself.

Lots of people seem to have a problem accepting responsibility for their own actions. It sort of seems like that is becoming the new normal.

I out drove my tires once. I changed tires and could then drive the speed I got in trouble at, in rain etc. I blame myself for not knowing my tires had horrible limits. It was my fault, but the tires were amazingly [censored] for new $300+/ea tires.


I've outdriven and outridden the traction limits of certain tires too. It was also my fault, just as it was the OP's fault. Which was my point.

Yes, I agree it is the fault of the driver, but again, my experience driving multiple vehicles with similar characteristics and tire sizes PRIOR to the incident led me to believe that the tires should have had much more hydroplaning resistance than they did, so while I am still at fault, I refuse to buy Potenza's ever again.
 
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