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Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Fitz98] #5132674
06/12/19 08:53 PM
06/12/19 08:53 PM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,245
Fort Worth, Texas
clinebarger Offline
clinebarger  Offline

Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,245
Fort Worth, Texas
Helicoil makes inserts for plug thread repair as well, They still kinda suck compared to the more expensive alternatives!!


2001 Chevy Camaro L92/4L80E
2006 Chevy 2500HD LBZ/Allison 1000
2010 Toyota Corolla 2ZR-FE/U341E
2000 Toyota Avalon 1MZ-FE/A541E
Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: atikovi] #5132696
06/12/19 09:20 PM
06/12/19 09:20 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 622
Cincinnati, USA
Dave9 Offline
Dave9  Offline

Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 622
Cincinnati, USA
Originally Posted by atikovi
Originally Posted by Fitz98
Originally Posted by fdcg27
An Expy of that age is not exactly destined for a long future life.
Why didn't you just leave the plugs alone, especially given the known problems these engines have with inadequate threads?

Believe me, I hesitated for a moment and considered this, but then I thought about what a PITA it is to change the plugs on these when the intake is on, now it is all open and accessible. This spark plug hole in question was loose when I took it out. If I just left it, I would have been stuck on the side of the road sometime in the future with a blown out plug. I would rather deal with it in a controlled circumstance now.


Why would a blown out plug leave you on the side of the road? I've driven V8's with seven and even six working cylinders. Not ideal but will get you home. And is there something special about this truck that you want to spend so much money and effort on? You can buy them on Craigslist for under $2000 all day long.


I was with you until you wrote under $2k. Try $4K for anything in decent shape with low enough miles to bother with, or else be in the same boat soon enough.... granted you might negotiate down closer to $3k.

Anything under $2k for a full sized SUV is a mechanic's special at best unless you live in BFE or get lucky at an auction.

Last edited by Dave9; 06/12/19 09:22 PM.
Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Dave9] #5132714
06/12/19 09:49 PM
06/12/19 09:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,932
VW Fanboy Island
maxdustington Offline
maxdustington  Offline

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,932
VW Fanboy Island
Originally Posted by Dave9
I was with you until you wrote under $2k. Try $4K for anything in decent shape with low enough miles to bother with, or else be in the same boat soon enough.... granted you might negotiate down closer to $3k.

Anything under $2k for a full sized SUV is a mechanic's special at best unless you live in BFE or get lucky at an auction.
Yep. It has to be REALLY bad on gas to go for that cheap, usually early-mid 90s throttle body injected OHV V8. Anything with port injection is going to be JUST fuel efficient enough for a young kid with no bills.

A low mileage, low rust SUV is going to have awesome resale near any large city.


03 Jetta AWP/09A 210k kms
Edge 0W40 + Mann 719/30
Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Fitz98] #5132825
06/13/19 01:09 AM
06/13/19 01:09 AM
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 433
Florida
Fitz98 Offline OP
Fitz98  Offline OP

Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 433
Florida
Just to clear the confusion regarding why repair vs get another, I like my truck when it works. I know what it is, I have maintained it, I have serviced it, I have repaired it, I know the repairs that I have done and I feel like once I have this behind me, I will have a good running, relatively dependable vehicle back in service. I can't imagine why I would go from a vehicle that I have had for 10 years and know it's history, into a different used vehicle that I don't know the history. If I have these issues with my truck, what's to say a different vehicle wouldn't have the same issues coming down the road.
I fix it as it needs fixed and will continue to do so until I could afford to get into a newer vehicle.
As stated before, I thank those who have contributed awesome support to help guide me through my repairs and to help me make good educated decisions and repairs.

Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: clinebarger] #5132866
06/13/19 05:35 AM
06/13/19 05:35 AM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 21,935
MA, Mittelfranken.de
Trav Offline
Trav  Offline

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 21,935
MA, Mittelfranken.de
Originally Posted by clinebarger
Helicoil makes inserts for plug thread repair as well, They still kinda suck compared to the more expensive alternatives!!


I didn't know that, is it one of these cheap under $50 kits that doesn't cut the seat just a reamer tap?


ASE L1, Master. Deutsch Meisterbrief.
Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Fitz98] #5132901
06/13/19 06:45 AM
06/13/19 06:45 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,396
Texas
wag123 Offline
wag123  Offline

Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,396
Texas
Originally Posted by Fitz98
I feel like once I have this behind me, I will have a good running, relatively dependable vehicle back in service.
This is the "black hole" of owning an old vehicle on it's last legs that many of us have experienced. One keeps throwing more and more money and time at it with the thinking that "once I have fixed this problem, since I have already fixed almost everything else that can go wrong, it will be good for awhile". This is almost never the case with an old worn-out vehicle. Vehicles are far more complicated than many people think and something else will ALWAYS go wrong. There is a point in every vehicle's life where it is time to stop pouring good money into it and put your hard-earned money into a newer vehicle instead. I have been following your saga with this rusty old Expedition for awhile now and IMO this truck has reached the point of "time to replace". I know what you are thinking, "I have already spent so much time and money on it that I hate to give up on it now", just consider this experience a "lesson learned" going forward.

Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: wag123] #5132910
06/13/19 07:00 AM
06/13/19 07:00 AM
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 1,086
Brittany / Canada
Popsy Online content
Popsy  Online Content

Joined: May 2015
Posts: 1,086
Brittany / Canada
+1

Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time (or money) making it, they say.

Been there, done that, the Barchetta in my sig, used to have two...it started as a project vehicle, and the engine is running so well I spent a lot of time and money trying to make the body and interior decent. Now after a while I'm just fed up with it...and I must have spent 3 times what the car is worth.

Sometimes it's hard to draw a line and stop.


96 Barchetta, 300V 5W40 | Forfour 95, SHU 0W40
Mazda 6 2.3, M1 AFE 0W20 | Colt Ralliart, 300V 0W40
Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Popsy] #5132916
06/13/19 07:06 AM
06/13/19 07:06 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,396
Texas
wag123 Offline
wag123  Offline

Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,396
Texas
Originally Posted by Popsy
Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time (or money) making it, they say.
I like this adage!

Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Fitz98] #5132920
06/13/19 07:08 AM
06/13/19 07:08 AM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 1,519
New York City
SeaJay Offline
SeaJay  Offline

Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 1,519
New York City
As has been suggested by a few posters, you either double down and go into the rabbit hole once again, or say enough is enough.

If enough money in labor and parts is spent, most vehicles can live on practically forever.

Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Popsy] #5132922
06/13/19 07:11 AM
06/13/19 07:11 AM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 21,935
MA, Mittelfranken.de
Trav Offline
Trav  Offline

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 21,935
MA, Mittelfranken.de
I don't know, I kept my old 930 going for 20 some odd years and never thought about the money I had in it. It was super reliable for the whole time. You are right though, dealing with old cars long term can be frustrating but somehow rewarding in some ways. I wouldn't consider getting rid of my old Beetle even if I had to rebuild it, I just like it.


ASE L1, Master. Deutsch Meisterbrief.
Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Fitz98] #5132953
06/13/19 07:54 AM
06/13/19 07:54 AM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,388
Suburban Washington DC
atikovi Offline
atikovi  Offline

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,388
Suburban Washington DC

Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Fitz98] #5132965
06/13/19 08:07 AM
06/13/19 08:07 AM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 135
VA
thastinger Offline
thastinger  Offline

Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 135
VA
Originally Posted by Fitz98
98 Expedition 5.4 4x4.
Here is where I am at.
Intake is off, all surrounding everything is also off.
Changing spark plugs and one (2nd from front on passenger side) is stripped out.
Timesert and locknstitch seem a little expensive (450-500.00) for one plug.
I saw one that bdCardinal recommended as well for 250.00.
These could potentially be done with heads on.
I could have someone who has Timesert kit do it for less than 100.00 if I could get him the head.
Question is, how much more work is it from here to get the head off and back on (in my driveway). And would I be needing any special tools?
Trying to decide which way to go with this.
I do plan to keep the vehicle.
[Linked Image]


I have a 98 F150 4x4 with the 2V 5.4
Although I never tossed a plug in 150K, I pulled the motor out of mine with the body still on, it kinda sucked to do. I bought a FRPP short block and built a Lightning motor for mine.

I was able to find some 8 thread (spark plug hole) heads to do my swap with, they were only made in 03/04 but you can still find them. Your heads are NPI and anything 99 and up will be PI heads, you could swap on some PI heads and intake and pick up about 30 HP...or just timecert the one hole and be done with it. I'd but a cheap borescope to ensure the cylinder is cleaned of metal following the repair.

Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Fitz98] #5132975
06/13/19 08:24 AM
06/13/19 08:24 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,936
N.H, U.S.A.
ARCOgraphite Offline
ARCOgraphite  Offline

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,936
N.H, U.S.A.
Even when I was a kid working on cars 50 years ago - Pull heads -and off to the machine shop they go. They'll give you a good guy price - or have your in-town mechanic send them there for the good guy price.


2019 VW Jetta S,6M OCI#0 3107mi-Castrol Edge Prof? VW508+OE Filter; '17 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#6 43467mi-Valvoline Adv 0w20 + SOA Filter
Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: Trav] #5132988
06/13/19 08:38 AM
06/13/19 08:38 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,640
stl
MarkM66 Offline
MarkM66  Offline

Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,640
stl
Originally Posted by Trav
Originally Posted by clinebarger
Helicoil makes inserts for plug thread repair as well, They still kinda suck compared to the more expensive alternatives!!


I didn't know that, is it one of these cheap under $50 kits that doesn't cut the seat just a reamer tap?


Something like this maybe?

https://www.amazon.com/Helicoil-5334-14-Thread-Thread-Repair/dp/B0002SRF4O

Re: 98 Expedition - Pull Head or Not? [Re: atikovi] #5133040
06/13/19 09:38 AM
06/13/19 09:38 AM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 21,935
MA, Mittelfranken.de
Trav Offline
Trav  Offline

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 21,935
MA, Mittelfranken.de


Who is comparing it? Just saying if someone wants to keep it and repair it so what they will all need repairs at some point.


ASE L1, Master. Deutsch Meisterbrief.
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