Interesting observation Hyundai Tuscon

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I think it was established early in the thread that Alfred was actually talking about his preference vs. a direct comparison between the two vehicles...but a BITOG "second wind" gives us more personal preference as "appliance vehicle" or incredulity that someone would buy a Camry and not a Euro make...while inferring that VAG products are somehow closer to the reliability / bulletproof qualities of Toyotas than most people think. I've seen this movie before....
 
Originally Posted by supton
Originally Posted by edyvw
For example, I will never understand why would someone buy Toyota Camry and not good used Audi for example? Should I draw conclusion that they a. do not have clue about cars (as driving Camry is same as driving in public transportation) and b. they are too cheap, so they must ship aways from their kids too? Should we assume that?

I'm not even sure what you are asking...

Question: what has a lower TCO, Camry or Audi? Make sure to toss in roads with potholes and then road salt also.

Sorry, chip away from kids. Plus, driving kids in Audi, is FAR safer.
Potholes? Audi. Toyota and potholes is like observing car being split in half (I am waiting something to fall off of my Toyota from potholes. Inside, already happened). On top of that, it is Toyota, it WILL RUST! There is NO Asian manufacturer that has even close rust protection like ANY German vehicle.
So, you can spend money on brand new microwave or actual vehicle. It could be argued same way it is argued about purchasing that BMW.
My Tiguan with 77k, looks inside out 10 times better than Sienna, and BMW I traded in for Sienna (due to family needs) with some 116k looked like brand new vehicle and drove like brand new vehicle. In SIenna with 57k, I am waiting windows to drop any moment, there is ghost in my dashboard as of last few weeks, and there is something resembling suspension, but it should not be called that way.
 
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Originally Posted by Vuflanovsky
I think it was established early in the thread that Alfred was actually talking about his preference vs. a direct comparison between the two vehicles...but a BITOG "second wind" gives us more personal preference as "appliance vehicle" or incredulity that someone would buy a Camry and not a Euro make...while inferring that VAG products are somehow closer to the reliability / bulletproof qualities of Toyotas than most people think. I've seen this movie before....

The second wind brought selfishness and regular testimonies of boyfriends of second cousin friend. Buying BMW is selfish, I guess buying Camry is ignorance.
 
As long as you don't say that the average VAG product approaches the average Toyota product in terms of "issues" then I have no problem in letting everybody have their preferences to run with...Convincing somebody that Toyotas are X and BMW/VAG are Y is fine as long as someone can accept that the context might not really apply. Is driving a BMW somewhere between self-conscious and self-congratulatory and driving a Camry is a totally soul-sucking, ubiquitous experience?? I don't know...but if you don't care it doesn't really matter and convincing somebody who still doesn't want to care is a tough row to hoe.

I drove a Mk IV Golf for 10 years as a second car and while it wasn't terrible, I think there's a "truism" with the idea that the window regulator, coil pack, bulb, etc. issues with that era car don't really happen in the same niggling ( sometimes called "overengineered" ) way with the average Toyota. On that front, I guess my personal experience and that of others I know don't need boyfriends and second cousin's friends to confirm. Personally, I think the EA211 1.4T is a great engine and I wouldn't mind having it in my current commuter car but I might be engaging in some thread drift...
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Potholes? Audi. Toyota and potholes is like observing car being split in half (I am waiting something to fall off of my Toyota from potholes. Inside, already happened). On top of that, it is Toyota, it WILL RUST! There is NO Asian manufacturer that has even close rust protection like ANY German vehicle.
So, you can spend money on brand new microwave or actual vehicle. It could be argued same way it is argued about purchasing that BMW.
My Tiguan with 77k, looks inside out 10 times better than Sienna, and BMW I traded in for Sienna (due to family needs) with some 116k looked like brand new vehicle and drove like brand new vehicle. In SIenna with 57k, I am waiting windows to drop any moment, there is ghost in my dashboard as of last few weeks, and there is something resembling suspension, but it should not be called that way.

Who cares what it looks like, how does it go and what's the TCO? It sounds like you think the Toyota will fail sooner, require more repairs, and ultimately require replacement more often than the Audi.

I agree, Toyota's rust quite nicely. Unfortunately so did my VW. I'm still waiting to see if my Toyota's outlast my VW, the VW did make 314k before I decided the amount of repairs it needed was too much.
 
Originally Posted by Vuflanovsky
As long as you don't say that the average VAG product approaches the average Toyota product in terms of "issues" then I have no problem in letting everybody have their preferences to run with...Convincing somebody that Toyotas are X and BMW/VAG are Y is fine as long as someone can accept that the context might not really apply. Is driving a BMW somewhere between self-conscious and self-congratulatory and driving a Camry is a totally soul-sucking, ubiquitous experience?? I don't know...but if you don't care it doesn't really matter and convincing somebody who still doesn't want to care is a tough row to hoe.

I drove a Mk IV Golf for 10 years as a second car and while it wasn't terrible, I think there's a "truism" with the idea that the window regulator, coil pack, bulb, etc. issues with that era car don't really happen in the same niggling ( sometimes called "overengineered" ) way with the average Toyota. On that front, I guess my personal experience and that of others I know don't need boyfriends and second cousin's friends to confirm. Personally, I think the EA211 1.4T is a great engine and I wouldn't mind having it in my current commuter car but I might be engaging in some thread drift...

Light bulb will go away in Golf IV or V, bcs you are running H7 light bulbs. In Toyota you will run pair of candles called H11, which project same amount of light as my cell phone screen. So, VW can easily make bulb last "forever" by putting same light bulb as Toyota. In the end, Toyota also installs OSRAM light bulbs as OE.
Coil pack better does not fail on my Sienna for example (and they do) since it will take half a day to replace it, unlike any VW product. I just changed coil packs in Tiguan at 76k, took exactly 7.5 minutes to put them in.
But, I am not saying somehow VW is more reliable than Toyota (in the US, in Europe, they probably are due to the fact that Toyota has to offer smaller more complex engines). Toyota is, and it would be astonishing if it is not, considering how "under engineered" they are. But, problem is that that comes at other expense, They are poorly assembled (my SIenna is by far the worst assembled vehicle I owned in the last 20 years), brakes are undersized (rear pads on this minivan are smaller than what I had on 1996 Opel Vectra, and that thing was like 2000lbs lighter), simple suspension that tests integrity of your jaw over potholes, while providing much worse handling than any European vehicle, small or big, the quality of materials (BMW E61 525d that I sold with 425k km in Europe looked better than what this Toyota looks now, and it is in garage).
So far when it comes to expenses, I spent on VW Tiguan since I bought it in 2013 with 36k, less than what I spent on SIenna I bought in 2018 in September with 42k. Difference is, VW feels like one block of steel on the road, and Sienna feels like box assembled by cheapest bidder.
 
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Every weekend comes and the Toyota hate expert appears with more rants.


The thread is about Hyundai Tucson. Please move on and create your own thread.
 
Originally Posted by PimTac
Every weekend comes and the Toyota hate expert appears with more rants.


The thread is about Hyundai Tucson. Please move on and create your own thread.

SO you indicate that Hyundai Tucson is better than Toyota? Could be, would not be big feat.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by PimTac
Every weekend comes and the Toyota hate expert appears with more rants.


The thread is about Hyundai Tucson. Please move on and create your own thread.

SO you indicate that Hyundai Tucson is better than Toyota? Could be, would not be big feat.



Did I say that? You are just trolling for effect. Too bad the ignore function here is weak.
 
My wife's Camry was $20k new and has needed only a set of brakes over 183k (along with tires and fluids). Maybe I had it aligned once.

My Camry... got me there, it's far from the paradigm of reliability lately. But on the flip side, it's so simple that even I can work on it (albeit often). Over 67k I'm at $1,700 in repairs, which is probably like double that if I paid anyone to work on it--maybe 3x.

My beloved VW was $25k new but needed $11k of work over its 314k that I owned it. And when I got rid of it, it needed a rear axle as it had bent over the years, so that cost isn't included. Anyhow, not too far off from my Camry, so maybe you have a point (once one either subtracts labor from the VW or adds it to the Camry).

Still miss that car, sure was a joy to drive.
 
Originally Posted by supton
My wife's Camry was $20k new and has needed only a set of brakes over 183k (along with tires and fluids). Maybe I had it aligned once.

My Camry... got me there, it's far from the paradigm of reliability lately. But on the flip side, it's so simple that even I can work on it (albeit often). Over 67k I'm at $1,700 in repairs, which is probably like double that if I paid anyone to work on it--maybe 3x.

My beloved VW was $25k new but needed $11k of work over its 314k that I owned it. And when I got rid of it, it needed a rear axle as it had bent over the years, so that cost isn't included. Anyhow, not too far off from my Camry, so maybe you have a point (once one either subtracts labor from the VW or adds it to the Camry).

Still miss that car, sure was a joy to drive.

It comes down to approximately same thing. But let's say you actually save some money on appliance vehicles, the problem is around fundamentals: brakes, lights, handling. What I found seriously problematic is lack of ANY kind of steering feedback (I did not expect one too, but did not expect it will turn in actual problem). And it is not a problem bcs I need to carve through curves or whatever. Problem is driving with kids. Two kids in the back, and I need to turn back to look why my 7 week old is crying or what 3 year old "terrorist" did this time. As soon as I move eyes from the road to check, that is it. Small imperfection on the road will move car in either direction and I have no clue what is going on holding steering wheel with my left hand. I look back, and car is going toward ditch or another lane. I always considered those lane departure warnings ridiculous, but I can see why vehicles like Toyota (or some others) need them. That is not happening in VW, Audi and especially BMW.
 
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