Transmission fluid drain & re-fill '97 Expedition

wavinwayne · Jan 29, 2005

Do any of you guys have experience doing a transmission fluid drain & re-fill on a 1997 Ford Expedition 4.6L V8? It has a automatic transmission w/overdrive. I don't think this vehicle has a tranny drain plug. I need a how-to.

About 3 years ago, I had a flush & fill done at a Precision Tune shop. Then about a 18 months ago, the Ford dealer replaced a shift solenoid in the transmission. I don't know if they had to drain the fluid to do that, but I dont think they did a complete drain & re-fill.

As soon as the weather warms a bit, I want to do this. If anybody can help me, I'd appreciate it.

rgl · Jan 29, 2005

If it has a 4R70W these are pretty good instructions.
I have both drained the torque converter and dropped the pan without raising my vehicle (F150). It is not at all hard. The only thing I would add is that it can be done without the assistant. Just make sure you have a large pan under the transmission and loosen one corner first, then progressively loosen/remove bolts away from that corner so that the fluid from the pan drains in a controlled manner into your drain pan. Support the pan with one hand when several bolts are off, eventually you will have to balance the still somewhat full pan on one palm while you get the last few bolts off. Definitely do it without an assistant if that assistant would be your wife or significant female. She will not be happy if she gets a Mercon V hair treatment. Remember the "doughnut" magnet comes off for cleaning - it is not glued on.
Transmission Fluid Change

srivett · Jan 29, 2005

Does Ford still leave toys inside the transmissions? When I changed the tranny fluid in my E-150 I found a spinning top in the C6 transmission. After a few hours of trying to find a spot to stick it in I tossed it on the dash and put everything back together. When my mechanic was working on the van later on he found the "spinning top" on the dash and told me it was a plug for the tranny dipstick. During vehicle assembly they put the tranny dipstick tube in and it forces the plug into the transmission for future owners to find...

Cheers, Steve

Kestas · Jan 29, 2005

I remember the first time I found the "toy" in our 70s Ford FMX transmission. I showed it to my dad. He immediately recognized it and told me it's used to keep the transmission sealed just immediately before an assembly process. It helps to have a dad who's a transmission engineer for Ford Mo.

wavinwayne · Jan 29, 2005

Thanks guys!. The link to the DIY is awesome!

I will be doing this in the spring.

QUESTION:
Have any of you guys ever drilled & tapped the tranny pan (with it off the vehicle of course) to install a magnetic drain plug/washer?

I understand why auto manufacturers DON'T put drain plugs on transmissions, but it sure would be easier to drain the fluid if the pan didn't have to be dropped.

rgl · Jan 30, 2005

quote:

Have any of you guys ever drilled & tapped the tranny pan

I was thinking of doing that, but instead I got a cast aluminum pan that had a drain - BAD IDEA. When I tried to put it in, the lip of the aluminum was much thicker and would not pivot into position without hitting a cross member. So I was kind of stuck and had to put the old pan back and return the aluminum pan as I could not go drain plug hunting with no transmission pan! My only concern on the do it yourself drain plug is if it is just tightened together you might unscrew the inner nut when you try to open it. I would try to weld or braze one on for security.

MolaKule · Jan 30, 2005

quote:

I understand why auto manufacturers DON'T put drain plugs on transmissions, but it sure would be easier to drain the fluid if the pan didn't have to be dropped.

Nissan has drain and fill plugs on major components, even Automatic Transmissions.

This way, you have no excuse for not chnaging fluids often.

JustinH · Jan 31, 2005

Well heres the deal. If you put a drainplug on your tranny pan then you aren't doing two things.

You aren't removing the pan and cleaning up the friction material at the bottom of the pan, and you aren't cleaning up the pan magnet.

Secondly you aren't replacing the pan filter, which should be done. Lastly you aren't re-torqueing the valve body bolts which should be done.

Well thats four reasons actually, so just spend the extra ten minutes, and clean up the pan. The gasket on the pan is reusable, and it has about 20 bolts on it.

That 97 will have a drainplug on the torque converter, later model trucks will not. Orient the converter so that you can remove the plug, and drain the converter also.

Use merconV and nothing else.

robbobster · Jan 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by JustinH:

That 97 will have a drainplug on the torque converter, later model trucks will not. Orient the converter so that you can remove the plug, and drain the converter also.

Yup, that's the way it is on my E4OD. Got almost 14 quarts out of it in about 30 minutes, if memory serves correctly...

wavinwayne · Jan 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by JustinH:
Well heres the deal. If you put a drainplug on your tranny pan then you aren't doing two things.

You aren't removing the pan and cleaning up the friction material at the bottom of the pan, and you aren't cleaning up the pan magnet.

Secondly you aren't replacing the pan filter, which should be done. Lastly you aren't re-torqueing the valve body bolts which should be done.

Well thats four reasons actually, so just spend the extra ten minutes, and clean up the pan. The gasket on the pan is reusable, and it has about 20 bolts on it.

That 97 will have a drainplug on the torque converter, later model trucks will not. Orient the converter so that you can remove the plug, and drain the converter also.

Use merconV and nothing else.

I will

to all of your points, except the last one.

My '97 Expedition specifies Mercon, not Mercon V.

wavinwayne · Jan 31, 2005

I finally OWN this '97 Expedition. I made the last payment today & I'm picking up the title tomorrow.

Hip Hip, Hooray for me!!!

darkdan · Jan 31, 2005

All 4R70Ws were back-speced to Mercon V.

Mercon V was the solution to the TC shudder problem caused by the CSTCC or whatever it's called.

Basically...use Mercon V and you'll be much happier.

wavinwayne · Jan 31, 2005

According to the info found here: http://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/supplier/quickref.asp using Mercon V in a Mercon application is a big

What say you on the subject, darkdan?

jagabom · Jan 31, 2005

Secondly you aren't replacing the pan filter, which should be done. Lastly you aren't re-torqueing the valve body bolts which should be done.

Wavinwayne, how is this done? Wny idea what the torque would be on a 99 GMC 4.3 auto 2wd with a basic autotrans.
Jim
CYWG

Big Jim · Jan 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by JustinH:
Well heres the deal. If you put a drainplug on your tranny pan then you aren't doing two things.

You aren't removing the pan and cleaning up the friction material at the bottom of the pan, and you aren't cleaning up the pan magnet.

Secondly you aren't replacing the pan filter, which should be done. Lastly you aren't re-torqueing the valve body bolts which should be done.

Well thats four reasons actually, so just spend the extra ten minutes, and clean up the pan. The gasket on the pan is reusable, and it has about 20 bolts on it.

That 97 will have a drainplug on the torque converter, later model trucks will not. Orient the converter so that you can remove the plug, and drain the converter also.

Use merconV and nothing else.

It sure is easier to remove an empty pan that you drained with a drain plug. Not nearly as messy either.

wavinwayne · Jan 31, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by jagabom:
Wavinwayne, any idea what the torque would be on a 99 GMC 4.3 auto 2wd with a basic autotrans.
Jim

Jim, I have no clue....sorry

darkdan · Feb 1, 2005

quote:

Originally posted by wavinwayne:
According to the info found here: http://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/supplier/quickref.asp using Mercon V in a Mercon application is a big

What say you on the subject, darkdan?

I say I got a 1000 friends with 1000 fords and I have two myself.

Mercon V in any year 4R70W is a good thing and I can find a lot of F150/Expy/Crown Vic owners to back me up.

While it's true they're not backwards compatable the Windstar transmission and the 4R100 (e4od family) are the ones you can't put V into that come to mind.

To my knowledge nothing changed internally between 97 and 98 in the 4R70W to make it so the 97s can't use it.

wavinwayne · Feb 2, 2005

Is there an easy, idiot friendly way to tell if my '97 Expedition's tranny fluid really needs to be changed? When I checked it the other day, it was still a bright red color & didn't look dirty at all.

Schmoe · Feb 2, 2005

The "toy" you guys are referring to is actually a dust plug that is put into the transmission when it is made to keep "junk" from getting into the transmission prior to the assembly line. Won't hurt anything. The 4R70W is a specific beast. Have read from other members that to prolong the life of this trans, you need to change the fluid at least every 30K miles, not the 100K the manual calls for and put in a shift kit. These transmissions "slip" a lot and the shift kit firms up these points. I'm not talking about the programmable chip shift changes, they will increase pressure to your solenoids and burn them out. It has to be a physical shift kit. And don't use nothing but Mercon V.

FazerZ · Feb 3, 2005

Just to add a little more infomation,

The front oil seals on some early and current production FORD transaxles (AX4S/AX4NCD4E) and transmissions (A4LD, E4OD. 4R100) cause most of the fluid incompatibility. The seal material will not play nice with Mercon V and can cause fluid leaks and seal failure. Since this is a terrible place to have a leak (requires removal of trans), the recommendation against is well founded.

All AOD-Es and 4R70W have used a viton front pump seal from inception, therefore the ability to use the later fluid in all years for this model.

Thankfully, the aftermarket has improved front seals for all Ford units and if the rebuilder/reman company are using the improved viton seals, the units could use the later fluid without trouble.

DH

Transmission fluid drain & re-fill '97 Expedition

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