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So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? #5111465
05/21/19 03:40 PM
05/21/19 03:40 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,165
St. Charles County, Missouri
csandste Offline OP
csandste  Offline OP

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,165
St. Charles County, Missouri
On several occasions I've posted the links to Mobil's sheet promoting EHC45 and 65 base stocks.

The take is that if a blender uses these Group II base stocks, they won't have to use Group III. If, not, then (about 50%) Group III is necessary for 5w20 and 5w30 SN/SN+ certification.

So my question is:

What blenders use these Exxon Mobil base stocks?

and

Are group II, EHC base stocks as good as other refiner's Group III base stocks?

I've done some Googling on this and can find no one stating that they use the EHC's. Since most people would think Group III is superior, it's probably not the kind of thing a vendor would promote.

I can post the link to EHC base stocks, but I've done that about four times in the last few months. If anyone wants to see it, I can repost again.

Last edited by csandste; 05/21/19 03:42 PM.

2017 Kia Soul Plus-- Super Tech Synthetic 5w30 59000 miles
Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: csandste] #5111474
05/21/19 03:52 PM
05/21/19 03:52 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 40,002
Ontario, Canada
OVERKILL Offline
OVERKILL  Offline

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 40,002
Ontario, Canada
I've posted it several times as well, including snaps from it. I would wager that the customer list would surprise most people on here, but I am sure it cannot be shared due to reasons of confidentiality.


2019 RAM 1500 Sport - Mobil 1 EP 0w-20, FRAM Ultra
2016 Grand Cherokee SRT - Ravenol SSL 0w-40, FRAM Ultra
Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: OVERKILL] #5111478
05/21/19 03:56 PM
05/21/19 03:56 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,165
St. Charles County, Missouri
csandste Offline OP
csandste  Offline OP

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,165
St. Charles County, Missouri
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
I've posted it several times as well, including snaps from it. I would wager that the customer list would surprise most people on here, but I am sure it cannot be shared due to reasons of confidentiality.


OK-- Then the second part of my question. It's every bit as good as Group III. It meets spec and it's all about a good ad pack, base oil counts for little, especially if it's SN+.

Agree or disagree?


2017 Kia Soul Plus-- Super Tech Synthetic 5w30 59000 miles
Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: csandste] #5111480
05/21/19 03:58 PM
05/21/19 03:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 40,002
Ontario, Canada
OVERKILL Offline
OVERKILL  Offline

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 40,002
Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by csandste
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
I've posted it several times as well, including snaps from it. I would wager that the customer list would surprise most people on here, but I am sure it cannot be shared due to reasons of confidentiality.


OK-- Then the second part of my question. It's every bit as good as Group III. It meets spec and it's all about a good ad pack, base oil counts for little, especially if it's SN+.

Agree or disagree?


It's close enough to Group III performance to allow it to stand-in for it in many (not all) applications. It's similar to how Group III can replace PAO in many (not all) applications. So while in both instances the product is not quite as good, it's "good enough" wink


2019 RAM 1500 Sport - Mobil 1 EP 0w-20, FRAM Ultra
2016 Grand Cherokee SRT - Ravenol SSL 0w-40, FRAM Ultra
Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: csandste] #5111488
05/21/19 04:06 PM
05/21/19 04:06 PM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,165
St. Charles County, Missouri
csandste Offline OP
csandste  Offline OP

Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,165
St. Charles County, Missouri
When I got on this board in 2002, there was much more of a belief that a stout add pack was more important than the base stocks. PYB was king. The post below this states just the opposite: that the base stock is everything and that stout add packs are nothing but harmful grit.

Constantly new things to provide befuddlement.


2017 Kia Soul Plus-- Super Tech Synthetic 5w30 59000 miles
Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: csandste] #5111497
05/21/19 04:19 PM
05/21/19 04:19 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 40,002
Ontario, Canada
OVERKILL Offline
OVERKILL  Offline

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 40,002
Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by csandste
When I got on this board in 2002, there was much more of a belief that a stout add pack was more important than the base stocks. PYB was king. The post below this states just the opposite: that the base stock is everything and that stout add packs are nothing but harmful grit.

Constantly new things to provide befuddlement.


It's a blend of traits and I don't think can be distilled out so easily, despite efforts to do so. Base stocks are a significant component of performance at the extremes, which, while additives help with, they can only help so much. This is why POE is used for jet turbine oil, regardless of additives, Group III or PAO aren't good enough. In a PCMO/HDEO, a properly formulated PAO-based lube will have better oxidation resistance than any of the lower groups. Cold temperature performance? Nothing in any of the groups below PAO can touch it for performance, even with all the PPD's in the world.

BUT

You can use the "best" base oil and still blend a mediocre product. "Every day" performance relies on a synergistic relationship between the bases and various additives to meet all the typical performance metrics for a lube from cold sump to spirited driving. The proper selection of bases of course plays a role, but it's the overall package that results in the performance.

So, personally, I tend to seek out an oil that's got PAO as a base (see signature) but blended by a well-known entity with access to current additive technology. And of course I also look at approvals.


2019 RAM 1500 Sport - Mobil 1 EP 0w-20, FRAM Ultra
2016 Grand Cherokee SRT - Ravenol SSL 0w-40, FRAM Ultra
Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: OVERKILL] #5111515
05/21/19 04:37 PM
05/21/19 04:37 PM
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 488
Upper midwest
Mainia Offline
Mainia  Offline

Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 488
Upper midwest

[/quote]

It's close enough to Group III performance to allow it to stand-in for it in many (not all) applications. It's similar to how Group III can replace PAO in many (not all) applications. So while in both instances the product is not quite as good, it's "good enough" wink [/quote]


And with that comment, I could easily see our top tier boutique oil companies being on that list too.

Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: Mainia] #5111788
05/21/19 09:15 PM
05/21/19 09:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 699
WY
sloinker Offline
sloinker  Offline

Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 699
WY
Originally Posted by Mainia



It's close enough to Group III performance to allow it to stand-in for it in many (not all) applications. It's similar to how Group III can replace PAO in many (not all) applications. So while in both instances the product is not quite as good, it's "good enough" wink [/quote]


And with that comment, I could easily see our top tier boutique oil companies being on that list too.[/quote]

So you are inferring that Driven,Red Line, Amsoil etc. are using group II base stocks and claiming they are group IV and V?

Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: csandste] #5111848
05/21/19 10:16 PM
05/21/19 10:16 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,238
Marshfield , MA
andyd Offline
andyd  Offline

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,238
Marshfield , MA
I like you guys who can discuss stuff like what is more important: Base stock or add pack.? Adds class to the discussion group. Camrys do fine on " meets or exceeds" Now that that is taken care of, let's fix something. grin2


'16 Camry LE STP synth 0w20 and STP filter. the Fridge

1994 Ranger ,the Rat, 5w30 dino, STP filter

'16 Camry SE, Valvoline HM 0w20 and OEM filter
Thick oil is better grin2
Re: So who uses Exxon-Mobil EHC basestocks? [Re: csandste] #5113983
05/23/19 08:56 PM
05/23/19 08:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,685
pa
benjy Offline
benjy  Offline

Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,685
pa
reading in the past i remember that within oil groups quality varies, so likely a top of line group II prolly compares to a bottom of line group III. oil blenders want to keep us in the dark as much as possible while advertising we are the best, instead of actually being so because advertising is cheaper than blending a better product + as usual its always about $$$$. big name oils that advertise + sponsor racing etc must recover $$$ hence higher pricing IMO

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