I am not happy. He looks it up, and can find no information on the c3, c4, c3p, c4p regarding any changes.
Fram is now making the 'p' version as pleated paper folds, versus the stacked plate paper design of the past, and the 'p' version no longer is enclosed in a perforated metal skin.
Decades ago, the pleated design was designed as full flow, the plate design was the bypass design originally from my experience with these filters going back decades of use.
Fram tech guy had no info on the change, and no info on any micron efficiency, beta ratios, absolutely nothing. Which contradicts the info they had when I had called them maybe 15 years ago and was told the stacked plate design filtered to 2 microns and was classed as a depth filter. Fram tech guy when I told him the info I gave them I got from them years ago, he stated that was not possible as they had no information and questioned if I knew how small a micron was and started talking about red blood cells and basically said it was ridiculous to worry about microns as they are so small. Then I said even Rock Auto listed the new C3P design at 5 microns, and he said well that did not come from us, maybe Rock Auto tested it themselves.???
So basically worthless tech support guy had no clue about anything. So since the c3 and c3p are now made the same way, I asked him what the difference between them is now, and he first said the c3 is stacked plate and the c3p is pleated folds, and when I said no way, he just said he knew nothing about the filters. I then suggested to him they are making them the same to save money. Fram guy also said both the c3-c4 and c3p-cp4 are bypass filters. And meet the engine manufacturers specs and are not inferior to the way they used to be made, they are better than how they were made before , and Fram would not make worse performing filters, and that was the end of the conversation.
Of course from what I know, they cant both by bypass filters!
The old look with plates and the new look with pleats for a C3p for example.
Last picture shows the original as specified design of stacked plates for these bypass filters.
Now if you go to WIX, it has the metal can, but microns are 32, so its a poor substitute for the original fram c3p-c4p.
Fram is now making the 'p' version as pleated paper folds, versus the stacked plate paper design of the past, and the 'p' version no longer is enclosed in a perforated metal skin.
Decades ago, the pleated design was designed as full flow, the plate design was the bypass design originally from my experience with these filters going back decades of use.
Fram tech guy had no info on the change, and no info on any micron efficiency, beta ratios, absolutely nothing. Which contradicts the info they had when I had called them maybe 15 years ago and was told the stacked plate design filtered to 2 microns and was classed as a depth filter. Fram tech guy when I told him the info I gave them I got from them years ago, he stated that was not possible as they had no information and questioned if I knew how small a micron was and started talking about red blood cells and basically said it was ridiculous to worry about microns as they are so small. Then I said even Rock Auto listed the new C3P design at 5 microns, and he said well that did not come from us, maybe Rock Auto tested it themselves.???
So basically worthless tech support guy had no clue about anything. So since the c3 and c3p are now made the same way, I asked him what the difference between them is now, and he first said the c3 is stacked plate and the c3p is pleated folds, and when I said no way, he just said he knew nothing about the filters. I then suggested to him they are making them the same to save money. Fram guy also said both the c3-c4 and c3p-cp4 are bypass filters. And meet the engine manufacturers specs and are not inferior to the way they used to be made, they are better than how they were made before , and Fram would not make worse performing filters, and that was the end of the conversation.
Of course from what I know, they cant both by bypass filters!
The old look with plates and the new look with pleats for a C3p for example.
Last picture shows the original as specified design of stacked plates for these bypass filters.
Now if you go to WIX, it has the metal can, but microns are 32, so its a poor substitute for the original fram c3p-c4p.
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