Questions on Johnson Golden Ghost and Quietflite sleds

[BrianF]

So I have these two sleds sitting in my storage shed. My wife's grandfather bought them new in 1974. Golden Ghost and Evinrude Quietflite. They have been sitting for several years as they needed batteries, ignition switches and the fuel system cleaned out. Sleds are in good shape, 90% complete, straight and about 1500 clicks on the odometer. Engines turn over and have compression. I had the one out running 4 years ago but the carb was poorly tuned so it was flooding out. I placed them in storage as I have far too many projects so I decided to list them. I was asking 600$ apiece but am questioning that even as I cannot find comparables. I am no salesman, don't feel like ripping people off or haggling for top dollar but wondering what these things are really worth.

People have told me that vintage sleds are popular but again, things are 45 years old, need work and parts that are hard to source.

Thanks for any insight!

 

[AZjeff]

No help but photos mandatory.

 

[ragtoplvr]

When i was in my teens I had a quitetflight lawnboy mower made by OMC, owner of Johnson and Evenrude. No help but never knew they used the name on other stuff.

Rod

 

[Srt20]

Pics are needed.

 

[BrianF]

Thanks guys, ya I will try and upload some pics tonight.

 

[BrianF]

pics or it didn't happen.

 

[Srt20]

Wow those are nice.

IDK about your area but around here, vintage sleds bring top dollar. And seeing that you are in Canada, its probably even 50% more, lol.

In my area, and in USD, those are easy $600 each not running.

 

[BrianF]

Thanks, ya they are pretty decent. I hate to part with them but someone should enjoy them. I pulled the ghost's fuel system apart. I flushed the tank and blew the main fuel line clear. The impulse pump works and I was able to prime it and get it to fire and even rev up. I hooked up my dying riding mower battery and found the electric start works great.

This week I will find time to start on the quietflite.

If I get some decent results I may just pull them and keep them.

 

[AZjeff]

Classics! They look like easy restorations. Those would be so cool to putt around on.

 

[BrianF]

Well another update. I played around with the quiet flite. It had 1/3 tank of heavily treated mix that was in there for a few years. Still smelled decent so I said to [censored] with it. Pulled fuel to the impulse. Pulled the impulse apart, which was in very good shape. Hooked up the battery, cranked it for a while and found it was pulling fuel to the carb. Primed it and it started running. I ended up taking both kids for a quick rip on the grass. The thing runs great!! Mechanical reverse, neutral work like a charm. Just have to test the cigarette lighter though.

My wife and I decided that they are no longer for sale. I need to source another ignition switch for the ghost and get the recoil handle back on the quiet flite. They both run Bendix carbs, so I might need to source a kit for one of them or begin with the base settings on the high/low.

Love these things!!

 

[BrianF]

Further update. I began some more tracing on the Ghost. Pulled the dirty carb, cleaned it and found it was overall great shape. The float was still set from last time I was in it. The needle valve operated as it should and the high/low needles were in great shape. I reset the base line settings. I replaced fuel line from the carb to the impulse, which appeared to have some slight air leaks. the line from the tank to the impulse was still in good shape and no leaks. The segment of line from the top of the tank to the weighted in tank filter was not leaking either.

I primed the carb, impulse and used clear line to a fuel bottle. The Ghost fired up, ran decently and there was a nice fuel draw. I hooked up the line to the tank and it eventually died out. I found the in tank line would allow air in but next to no fuel out. I realized that this would be extremely easy to fix. The metal fitting just unscrews from the tank. While this segment of clear fuel line was hard, it was in decent enough shape. Now the weight filter was well past its expiry date. The metal screen was damaged and the thing was full of deposits.

I snagged a new filter and hopefully today I will get it all buttoned back up and running. Stay tuned for more pictures.

 

[BrianF]

So further on this saga: The Evinrude fires up after 2-3 pulls of the recoil. Kill the cylinder decomp, open the choke and give it a few revs. It settles to a decent idle. I say decent because it seems like it loads up a bit, 4 stroking as they would say. I leaned out the low speed by 1/8th but realistically, I should wait until winter to play with it.

The Ghost has been having continual issues. It has spark, gets air but wont run correctly. I pulled, cleaned and set the baseline on the carb. The float, needle valve and high/low screws are in great shape and flow as needed. I find that the carb does not flood as bad now, no fuel stream out the mouth of it. But I cannot get it to catch, let alone fire decently. I recall when I had it running just long enough to rev up and drive a few feet, there was a nice amount of mouse house that blew out of the muffler. I will try and unbolt each exhaust pipe and see if there is some restriction. If that does not work, will try swapping the carb from the Evinrude on. I pulled fuel right to the carb and it flows great.

Last week I topped up the chain case as both were real low. I drained and refilled the reverse gear boxes as well. Unknown when or if it was ever done but it looked like old, worn out ATF as the manual called for Dexron. In went some C-op ATF SL, group 4 ATF. Same stuff that went in various transmissions and transfer cases.

 

[BrianF]

Old update. Last month I cracked the exhaust pipes off the mufflers, primed the carb and ran clear line to a jerry of mix. I got it running decently. Sounded out of tune as it seemed to be loading up under idle. It did respond well to throttle inputs though and a good steady flow of fuel to the pump. I ran it for a few minutes then shut it off. I hooked the exhaust back up and she roared back to life. A few minutes later and she died for good. No spark. I removed the ignition switch but it still was dead.

I have not had time in the last month to work on it due to everything else in life but next up: disconnect the kill switch, clean up and double check the CDI ground and if that is a no go, test for AC output to the CDI box when cranking.

This is what happened years ago, ignition just quit. I tried a couple of times post, to see if temperature was an issue but still no spark.

 

[BrianF]

Well I made some time today, maybe 40 minutes to look at the Ghost. Still no spark. Cleaned the ground wire and found a nearby terminal that I attached it too. A real nice clean bolt. Still no spark. Traced the kill switch and disconnected it. Now I got the brightest spark I have seen on those sleds.

I primed the carb and got her to fire. Now seems it is back to running briefly and then dying out. But I gots some spark!

 

[BrianF]

Spent more time today, much to my wife's dismay.. Had suspected an air leak it the fuel line. Hooked up my suction gun with a section of clear line. Not only did it have a garbage draw, you could hear the air leak under the cowl. Traced it to a cracked line at the primer. Cut the cracked end off and attached it. Primer now works as you can clearly hear and feel it moving fuel. Tested with the suction gun and there is a nice clean fuel draw. I primed her all up and got it started. It ran rough, revved and then died. Back to the usual as the plugs were wet. So she is back to flooding.

I had done some reading this summer and found that the Bendix Zenith carbs can have main jet O ring issues. As the O ring fails, it causes rich/flooding issues. I pulled the carb and removed the jet. Now the o ring appeared decent but I suspected it to be leaking. I found it was not plump and round as well as having a few small cracks. I will source one this week at the local hydraulics shop. I recall that the last time I had the carb apart, I installed the O ring with some thick white lithium grease. This time I had the sled running decently for several minutes before the kill switch shorted out. I suspect the grease temporarily sealed the O ring.

Anyway, I also set out to test the Evinrude to see if the rectifier is working. I tested the garbage battery (only on there to ensure I do not fry the CDI when its running). The thing was at about 7.5 volts. I got it running and found my digital, autoranging multimeter was giving me a blank screen. After some reading on the vintage sleds site, it appears the old plugs are not insulated and giving off a pile of interference. New plugs were the list anyway. But, I was able to test the battery after running the engine, which came back to 8.5 volts. So it appears the rectifier works and it is capable of charging the battery.

 

[BrianF]

As things kind of progress.... Evinrude is ready to go, other than my DC voltage question. Primer works, thing fires up and runs great. The Ghost got a new O ring, unbolted the mufflers but she is spitting fuel like it was cheap or something. Still flooding. Not a back pressure issue. I will tear the carb off again and set the float even lower. It currently sits parallel when inverted. The needle valve and float are in great shape and seal well when closed and blown into. So that's where I sit thus far.

 

[zrxkawboy]

Thanks for the updates! I like resurrecting old machines, so this is interesting to me.

 

[BrianF]

I made some progress today, some by some stroke of luck.

After lots of reading, it seams the old sleds with no regulator use high wattage light bulbs to absorb the excess created. What I knew but did not verify is that yes my lights work but they only work when the ignition switch is in place and on the run/lights setting. So when I was testing voltage, the ignition switch was off and I never paid attention to the lights as I don't see the taillight and the headlight points down when the hood is up. So.... with the engine running, lights on (taillight needed its contacts cleaned), the Evinrude gave 6 volts at 1500rpm idle and upwards of 18 volts when p1ss revved. Much better than the 30 but still a bit on the high side. I now realize I did not check to see if it was the bright or dim on when running. Either way, its on the right path.

Now for the Ghost. I ripped the carb off again, verified the float was slightly greater than parallel when inverted. I found the new O ring was too large and rolled off the recess where it sits when I stuffed in the discharge tube/main jet. I installed my other backup o ring and used an Xacto knife to carve it down to fit snug. I got it to fire and run on both cylinders a few times and rev a little bit. I then played with the hi/low needles and get it to rev a bit more. Then it just sprang to life. I think it had plenty of raw fuel to clear and needed some heat to do this. I removed the tools that were holding the exhaust pipes from the mufflers and it continued to run. I backed it out of the shed and listened to it idle (1500rpm) and how it revved. I played with the needles a bit more so that it wasn't loading up at idle and took it for a few spins in the yard. I leaned out the hi a bit as it was loading up under full throttle, not much but enough to clean it up some. I don't want to melt the pistons so final settings will be done when our bitter winter sets in. It restarted first pull of the recoil as well.

Its lights and rectifier work, was getting approx. 6 volts at idle and 15 when revved right up. Quite happy so far as it has some decent power when opened up. I will continue to run it a few times per week to ensure no further problems do not crop up prior to the cold.

So whats left on the list is to play around with the lighting, wiring (possibly getting a voltage regulator), get a fresh battery and ignition switch for the Evinrude. The Ghost needs a battery, plugs, reassembly of the exhaust, cowl bolts and a good cleaning.

 

[BrianF]

As things progress... A few days after that last post, the Ghost started good but promptly died and failed to restart. Looks like a fuel related issue. I was able to start it and run briefly on the primer only... until I found fuel leaking down the dash, which was traced to the primer diaphragm tearing. I removed the primer and plugged the lines. I installed some clear fuel line to watch the draw to the impulse and found it to be weak. I bypassed the impulse and tried to run right to the carb but found it would not accept fuel. I figured the float to be the issue.

I also received the ignition switch. It was a 7 pin Indak for some lawn mower applications. It dropped in and worked without any butchering.

Today I ripped the carb off and found it was bone dry and the needle valve stuck in place. It appears that some small debris/deposits are slowly cleaning out of the tank and lines, which caused the valve to stick. I knocked it free and put her back in place. I added the new resisted NGK plugs and cranked it over until the carb was primed. She fired up great and ran strong. I then noticed some fuel leaking out the cowl... great. I traced it to the fuel inlet at the carb. I had placed some new line from the impulse to the carb and realized it was slightly oversize. The line was not fully seated on the fuel inlet but really, it needs a clamp on it to be safe.

I also found this new fuel line to be kinking at the tight corner from the impulse outlet to the hole in the firewall. To get around this, I just used the clear line to loop from the impulse to the firewall. Not the safest but it works.... for now.

So other than a battery, I just need to sort out the fuel lines and get a tank of fresh fuel run through it. Things are looking up. Also a few of my farmer friends have vintage sleds so we are planning some rides this winter, so I picked up a trifold ramp for loading.

More pictures to come.

 

[BrianF]

I put in a good hour today on the sleds Both were hit with compressed air, which knocked out even more mouse [censored], dirt and that [censored] foam from the 70's that just crumbles. I mixed up 10 litres of 40:1 treated fuel (manual asks for 50:1 but I rather them run rich in the heat and while tuning) and put 5 in each sled to bring them to about half a tank.

I tucked in the loop of fuel line in the Ghost, buttoned down the battery and started her up. Starts really good considering there is no primer. I took her for some grass drag rips in the yard. I had to pull back the high needle as she loaded up way to quickly. In the end it was pulled back over half a turn, which really woke it up. I wonder if the clutch or belt need attention as it revs quite high in mid throttle compared to the Evinrude.

What I found with the Ghost is some sort of fuel starvation issue after a decent power run. It runs like a raped ape and when you stop (doesn't matter if you coast or apply the brakes) it will slowly power down and die. You give it a second to rest, a bit of choke and it fires up, sometimes dies but usually sputters to life and runs well again. Short full throttle bursts and abrupt braking do not cause this symptom. So this will take some more time to diagnose but overall I am happy, the thing does haul some [censored] though.

The Evinrude runs flat out awesome! It sets you back and gets rolling in a hurry, idles great and responds well to throttle input. It restarts great and just all around kicks [censored].

I still need one more battery as the lawn mower unit has the terminals offset a bit too much. The positive cables are on the shorter end, which requires the battery to sit cock eyed in the tray. This fine for testing and [censored] around the yard but very unsafe otherwise. Also the terminal on the negative cable on the Evinrude is cracked. There is plenty of cable length and it is easy to remove, so I might take it to town and see if they can crimp on another terminal.