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Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5084967 04/24/19 04:20 PM
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ARCOgraphite Offline
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The cross camber in front axle looks too large to me 0.4 deg, 0.8 deg. That's basically -1 deg neg on one wheel and -1/2 deg on the other. And its on the wrong side of the road crown for a beneficial countersteer up the crown.

Last edited by ARCOgraphite; 04/24/19 04:26 PM.

2019 VW Jetta S 6MT OCI#1 5885mi-Castrol Edge Prof? VW508+VW Service Filter; '17 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#7 52665mi-Castrol GTX Magnatec 5W20 + SOA Filter
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5084970 04/24/19 04:22 PM
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DuckRyder Offline
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From a Kia Forum:

Quote

From the Kia Global Information System web site (all numbers are in degrees):

Front:
Toe-in (Individual) 0.05 +/- 0.05
Toe-in (Total) 0.1 +/- 0.1
Camber -0.5 +/- 0.5
Caster 4.60 +/- 0.5
King pin angle 13.96 +/- 0.5

Rear:
Toe-in (Individual) 0.1 +/- 0.1
Toe-in (Total) 0.2 +/- 0.2
Camber -1.0 +/- 0.5


The ? instead of a decimal is concerning (aside form the reading difficulty).

What kind of machine was this and was it actually set up on a rack and calibrated at the time of these pictures or was it one of those quick drive across set ups?

I agree that I would have installed the correct size tires, but depending on wheel size it might be fine...there is about .3 inches difference in height and 10 or so revs per mile. so its a small change.


Robert
  • 2019 Volkswagen Jetta R-Line
  • 2005 Honda Civic Sedan
  • 1972 F100 Ranger XLT (390/C6/9” 3.50 Truetrac)
  • 2002 Ford Ranger XLT 4D Supercab 3.0L
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5084988 04/24/19 04:34 PM
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ARCOgraphite Offline
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Have them check ride height too. I dintr understand the "leaning": issue. Is your car seat broken, maybe?

Or maybe you mean pulling to the right?

Last edited by ARCOgraphite; 04/24/19 04:57 PM.

2019 VW Jetta S 6MT OCI#1 5885mi-Castrol Edge Prof? VW508+VW Service Filter; '17 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#7 52665mi-Castrol GTX Magnatec 5W20 + SOA Filter
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: ARCOgraphite] #5085020 04/24/19 05:02 PM
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SlavaB Online Content OP
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Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Have them check ride height too. I dintr understand the "leaning": issue. Is your car seat broken, maybe?


Maybe I've used the wrong term, sorry.
To describe better: when going straight on a highway in the middle lane, after I'm releasing the steering wheel - the car doesnt go straight but pulling to the right by itself.
So in order to go straight I keep adjusting it while driving.

Last edited by SlavaB; 04/24/19 05:03 PM.

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Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5085027 04/24/19 05:07 PM
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ARCOgraphite Offline
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Ahh . yes I saw too much inward tilt on your driver side wheel.

Tilt wheels steer the direction they tilt ( think motorcycle) and that wheel is tilted right MUCH more than the right wheel is tilted left.


2019 VW Jetta S 6MT OCI#1 5885mi-Castrol Edge Prof? VW508+VW Service Filter; '17 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#7 52665mi-Castrol GTX Magnatec 5W20 + SOA Filter
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5085045 04/24/19 05:28 PM
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DuckRyder Offline
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Originally Posted by SlavaB
Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Have them check ride height too. I dintr understand the "leaning": issue. Is your car seat broken, maybe?


Maybe I've used the wrong term, sorry.
To describe better: when going straight on a highway in the middle lane, after I'm releasing the steering wheel - the car doesnt go straight but pulling to the right by itself.
So in order to go straight I keep adjusting it while driving.


Does it pull or lead...?

Pull = goes immediately
Lead = drifts after a short time.

The graphics and numbers on you report don’t make sense really, did they give you a printed report?


Robert
  • 2019 Volkswagen Jetta R-Line
  • 2005 Honda Civic Sedan
  • 1972 F100 Ranger XLT (390/C6/9” 3.50 Truetrac)
  • 2002 Ford Ranger XLT 4D Supercab 3.0L
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: ARCOgraphite] #5085046 04/24/19 05:29 PM
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SlavaB Online Content OP
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Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Ahh . yes I saw too much inward tilt on your driver side wheel.

Tilt wheels steer the direction they tilt ( think motorcycle) and that wheel is tilted right MUCH more than the right wheel is tilted left.


Now as you said it I see it too, somehow only paid attention to the fact it's in the green zone.
Will need to get it done properly somewhere else


17 Kia Sportage EX 2.4 GDI / RP HPS 5w30, CQ Premium 85334
15 MB GLA250 4Matic 2.0T / Mercedes OEM 5w40, OEM filter
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: DuckRyder] #5085050 04/24/19 05:32 PM
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SlavaB Online Content OP
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Originally Posted by DuckRyder
Originally Posted by SlavaB
Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Have them check ride height too. I dintr understand the "leaning": issue. Is your car seat broken, maybe?


Maybe I've used the wrong term, sorry.
To describe better: when going straight on a highway in the middle lane, after I'm releasing the steering wheel - the car doesnt go straight but pulling to the right by itself.
So in order to go straight I keep adjusting it while driving.


Does it pull or lead...?

Pull = goes immediately
Lead = drifts after a short time.

The graphics and numbers on you report don’t make sense really, did they give you a printed report?


1. Ok, I can't tell it jumps immediately into the right lane, but at the same time it's happening quickly.
2. I don't have any printed report, they only shared these pictures with me and a printed receipt


17 Kia Sportage EX 2.4 GDI / RP HPS 5w30, CQ Premium 85334
15 MB GLA250 4Matic 2.0T / Mercedes OEM 5w40, OEM filter
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5085056 04/24/19 05:39 PM
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eljefino Offline
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Could it be they haven't licensed and updated their alignment machine software recently?

Those guys suck.

Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5085060 04/24/19 05:43 PM
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Any shop that has a big fancy machine with a color screen that prints out colored pictures --- doesn't know how to do alignments. I'm not the least bit impressed with those machines or the fancy pictures. Usually it's the tire shops that pull that kind of crap.

And any shop that talks the customer into going with a non-factory size tire are a bunch of hacks.

Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: das_peikko] #5085073 04/24/19 06:01 PM
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MParr Offline
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Originally Posted by eljefino
Could it be they haven't licensed and updated their alignment machine software recently?

Those guys suck.

Originally Posted by das_peikko
Any shop that has a big fancy machine with a color screen that prints out colored pictures --- doesn't know how to do alignments. I'm not the least bit impressed with those machines or the fancy pictures. Usually it's the tire shops that pull that kind of crap.

And any shop that talks the customer into going with a non-factory size tire are a bunch of hacks.


What these guys said. Tire shops love to sell alignments, especially lifetime alignments and balances. That’s how they Hoover up lifetime customers. They get you in there and tell you this or that needs to be replaced or your tire or tires are wearing irregular and make another sale.


2019 VW Tiguan SE Now: Factory fill & OEM filter
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Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5085196 04/24/19 07:54 PM
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double vanos Offline
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Tire size visual difference [Linked Image]


Sabine Schmitz is the Queen of the 'Ring; Svetlana Kapanina is the Queen of the SKIES...
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: ARCOgraphite] #5085935 04/25/19 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
The cross camber in front axle looks too large to me 0.4 deg, 0.8 deg. That's basically -1 deg neg on one wheel and -1/2 deg on the other. And its on the wrong side of the road crown for a beneficial countersteer up the crown.


And it might not be easily adjustable ... on many cars, the only adjustment available is toe. Which is why techs often see green and move on ...


2011 SUBARU Impreza 5-door manual / 2016 HONDA Pilot / 2011 MAZDA 2 auto
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5085968 04/25/19 01:41 PM
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SHOZ Offline
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My Gen Coupe has always pulled to the right. The caster was off with the left leading the right and is not factory adjustable. I got some adjustable tension rods and can slightly adjust the camber, enough to cancel the pull almost. Who knows what it really reads as I always have to do it after an alignment. Tires wear nice and even.

And if your strut uses two bolts on the bottom to attach to the hub, there are camber adjustment bolts you can buy that are eccentric and can usually get 2* more camber.


2008 Hyundai Accent 1.6L 5 sp manual hatchback
2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe Track 2L Turbo 6sp manual
Re: Alignment problem - help me understand [Re: SlavaB] #5085975 04/25/19 01:50 PM
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Chris6391 Offline
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I have two sportages and do my own alignments as I saw the incompetence at Sears and Firestone. Not too hard. Mine are SM?? 05 and an 08. The wheel track is identical front and back.A straight level with a laser measured across the center of the tire shooting at a known distance target(ruler with a dot on it) from the center of the wheel hub mounted on a 2x4 does it for me. That's all the machines do. The only good thing they have is the tire plates. My way in the driveway I make an adjustment and pull it back and then forward to let the tires settle their footprint and take another measurement to see if I have it. Mine don't have camber bolts but my Sedona did and I just make sure I am on a level part of my driveway and use my level vertically up the tire away from the flex footprint area.

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