can oil cause detonation?

[1978elcamino]

So in the f150 with the gen 3 5.0 I have noticed more detonation lately. This is after my recent switch from Pen syn 5w30 to 5w40 T6 Rotella. . Any chance the oil typ is causing this or just unlucky with fuel. I really dont remember where I gassed up, its always different stations.

 

[Env1ous]

Are you talking about knock?
I just filled up my 13 3.5 with shell, I normally always go there and get good gas, but this time I got some bad gas. Definitely an increase in knock and lower OAR. Had to put some e85 in it to help even it out. I was hitting +8 on my knock and my OAR was down to -.08 which is the lowest it has been in two years. I think you use the copperhead ECU it measure knock and adjusts timing for how good the gas is. Possible you got some bad gas

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Thats what been saying. The Calcium compound.

I found just using too thick an oil in my Nissan increased pinging too.

But Maybe it was just a bad tank of under-octane. Was it E10?

 

[1978elcamino]

Yes, knock. I usually fill up here in Florida with 87 which usually contains 10% ethanol. I plan on keeping an eye on it next fill up, well an ear on it anyway. Sunday I just happen to have my window down driving against a wall and was like [censored], thats more than usual.

 

[MParr]

The Rotella T6 5W40 isn't an ideal oil for the 5.0. The Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 is a pretty light oil. Personally, I wouldn't run Rotella T6 5W40 in a modern V-8 engine. Shell Rotella T6 5w40 has a viscosity of 14.9 at 100C. Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 has a viscosity of 10.3 at 100C. However, the gas is most likely the cause.

 

[1978elcamino]

Originally Posted by MParr
The Rotella T6 5W40 isn't an ideal oil for the 5.0. The Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 is a pretty light oil. Shell Rotella T6 5w40 has a viscosity of 14.9 at 100C. Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 has a viscosity of 10.3 at 100C. However, the gas is most likely the cause.


can you please give me the short cliff notes version of what that means, thanks.

 

[Env1ous]

Originally Posted by MParr
The Rotella T6 5W40 isn't an ideal oil for the 5.0. The Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 is a pretty light oil. Shell Rotella T6 5w40 has a viscosity of 14.9 at 100C. Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 has a viscosity of 10.3 at 100C. However, the gas is most likely the cause.


Still within error or margin. But Pennzoil play and UP are a lot thinner than that.

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...latinum-full-synthetic-5w-30#Post5055658

 

[MParr]

5W40 oil is too thick for your F-150. Ford requirement is 5W20 Motorcraft blend. You can get by with 5W30.
FLUIDS AND CAPACITIES
Engine oil: SAE 5W-30 synthetic blend (2.7L, 3.5L), SAE 5W-30 diesel motor oil (3.0L diesel), 5W-20 synthetic blend (3.3L, 5.0L); capacity is 6.0 quarts (5.7 liters) - 2.7L, 3.3L, 3.5L; 6.5 quarts (6.15 liters) - 3.0L diesel; 8.8 quarts (8.3 liters) - 5.0L
Coolant: Motorcraft Orange; capacity is 15.1 quarts (14.3 liters) - 2.7L; 13.7 quarts (13.0 liters) - 3.0L diesel; 13.6 quarts (12.86 liters) - 3.3L; 15.2 quarts (14.35 liters) - 3.5L; 13.9 quarts (13.2 liters) - 5.0L
Brake fluid: DOT 4 LV High Performance Motor Vehicle Brake Fluid
Automatic transmission fluid: Mercon LV - 2.7L, 5.0L; Mercon ULV - 3.0L diesel, 3.3L, 3.5L; capacity is 13.1 quarts (12.4 liters)
Diesel exhaust fluid: Capacity is 22.5 quarts (21.3 liters)
Also, 87 octane gas containing 10% ethanol isn't that great. It may be okay for a 1987 Oldsmobile beater with 8.5:1 compression ratio.

 

[Env1ous]

I actually use T6 5w-40 and my engine likes it with the 3.5. No complaints here. I do want to switch to a SN Plus cert oil for the benefits of lspi.

 

[LoneRanger]

Coincidental this thread coincides with mine on LSPI. From what I understand, yes oil can cause detonation. While LSPI isn't an issue for your engine, oil is def a factor in starting the premature ignition process in all these new small displacement direct injection turbo motors. But then I would doubt a naturally aspirated engine would generate the heat that is behind low speed premature ignition that can occur in the small gdi turbo'd jobs.

 

[1978elcamino]

Im def going to take notes on this one. Engine has less thank 9k miles. I will do a dump and fill at 15k and after about 1k on a different oil I will post back. Maybe I will have closure maybe I wont, time will tell.

 

[Env1ous]

Originally Posted by 1978elcamino
Im def going to take notes on this one. Engine has less thank 9k miles. I will do a dump and fill at 15k and after about 1k on a different oil I will post back. Maybe I will have closure maybe I wont, time will tell.


I know on the ecoboost it can run 87 but it is best on 91. I would see what the next tank of gas feels like. It could purely be gas.

 

[MParr]

1978elcamino
No need to overthink it. The owners manual specs 5W20 Motorcraft Synthetic Blend. You could use a 5W20 synthetic or a 5W30 blend or synthetic. I know it gets hot in Florida. Stay away from xW40 oils. Ford and Phillips 66 work closely in developing Motorcraft lubricants. They have figured out what works with your engine.
https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubrica...d%20Motor%20Oil&category=Motor%20Oil

 

[benjy]

the sensor should adjust accordingly + only if you are getting blowby with oil in the gas mix should it be an issue. i like thicker oils for their xtra protection as the watery xxW20 oils 1/4 mpg mean little to me. in florida a 10W30 synthetic should do better as it needs less viscosity improvers + generally is a better noack

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Originally Posted by Env1ous
Originally Posted by MParr
The Rotella T6 5W40 isn't an ideal oil for the 5.0. The Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 is a pretty light oil. Shell Rotella T6 5w40 has a viscosity of 14.9 at 100C. Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 has a viscosity of 10.3 at 100C. However, the gas is most likely the cause.


Still within error or margin. But Pennzoil play and UP are a lot thinner than that.

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...latinum-full-synthetic-5w-30#Post5055658

I would argue that .an HD 40 is a whole 'nother animal than an ILSAC 5w30. HTHS.

Def NOT for modern gas engines. Get it out.

 

[Env1ous]

Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Originally Posted by Env1ous
Originally Posted by MParr
The Rotella T6 5W40 isn't an ideal oil for the 5.0. The Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 is a pretty light oil. Shell Rotella T6 5w40 has a viscosity of 14.9 at 100C. Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 has a viscosity of 10.3 at 100C. However, the gas is most likely the cause.


Still within error or margin. But Pennzoil play and UP are a lot thinner than that.

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...latinum-full-synthetic-5w-30#Post5055658

I would argue that .an HD 40 is a whole 'nother animal than an ILSAC 5w30. HTHS.

Def NOT for modern gas engines. Get it out.


I couldn't find a thicker 5w-30 so I went with a 40. I am tuned in my ecoboost and running around 20-22psi on the small turbos and want/feel more comfortable with a thicker oil.
Been looking at Castrol Edge 5w-30

 

[ARCOgraphite]

I see. Hows the transmission? I always loose a trans or 3 rd member when my engines get fiesty and I dont attend to the stuff behind
them.

ACEA w/ Porsche A40 spec; You play the game you pays the money, Honey.

HTHS real synthetic. That's where its at..

 

[Env1ous]

Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
I see. Hows the transmission? I always loose a trans or 3 rd member when my engines get fiesty and I dont attend to the stuff behind
them.

ACEA w/ Porsche A40 spec; You play the game you pays the money, Honey.

HTHS real synthetic. That's where its at..


Trans is fine and feels good. A little clunky, but that is lack of TC and it is a truck lol.

Let me look into the A40 spec.

 

[racin4ds]

OP- your pinging is most definitely the gas.. I'm in Florida as well and seem to find junk gas on more than one occasion. Stay with top tier fuel stations that move a lot of fuel. The T6 you're using is fine, that 5.0 will not mind it one bit especially in the Florida heat and even more so if you work the truck or run it hard.

 

[1978elcamino]

Originally Posted by racin4ds
OP- your pinging is most definitely the gas.. I'm in Florida as well and seem to find junk gas on more than one occasion. Stay with top tier fuel stations that move a lot of fuel. The T6 you're using is fine, that 5.0 will not mind it one bit especially in the Florida heat and even more so if you work the truck or run it hard.


For anyone wondering the use of the truck. Daily commute monday through friday is 2 country miles to a toll road, ten miles on the toll road highway speeds, three miles bumper to bumper to the parkiing lot at work. Weekends I tow saturday and sunday with a boat or toyhauler, or have the bed loaded down with motorcycles, people and gear, mix highway and city or tools and equipment. Lots of dirt roads with dust, I dont offroad or "go wheelin". I probably use my truck as a truck more than most people.