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Project Farm tests 2 more oils
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Thanks! Have been wondering if he'd get to Schaeffer's.
Unfortunately, while the M1 5W-30 flavors are otherwise great oils, they are made from exceptionally thin base oils, which increases their iron wear (boundary-lubrication wear). In fact, the M1 AP 5W-30 is one of their worst flavors in that respect, having one of the thinnest base oils.
The Schaeffer's Supreme 9000 has an unusually thick base oil (very high HTFSV) as well as a very high HTHSV; so, there is no competition there with the other ILSAC GF-5 5W-30 oils for wear protection in either the boundary- or the hydrodynamic-lubrication regime as well as in between (mixed-lubrication regime).
Here is my base-oil viscosity (what I call high-temperature, full-shear viscosity HTFSV) list, which also lists the HTHSV:
![[Linked Image]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/FlXRcOjxAPWMbFRxfbuVAd-t961bmQ_IeKDtCBAD5R3596oXQnzdorRxNsUlg_kgzIL6Udr8hES3mfQ7_5woxkweX-j2iO9AzhjPZq_ON2YO9hIhxZWB_DNsShod02aMLstERjrGt7czmjbxMBcaQM-rEplMahD6hdZ_rlCHhiyMsPILYXJt2rNt30HtlaflBY7xaCgg52fpwXSbbIfLxFMvo_L-DSBc-WEGaggmW0qXnbsNyRqnE2ZA-SSer45osb-odL73l0ecBllNRIgsrQXTZ80AU4n23y_A9JFKgHysA9ne_cvQkb1Xfe9sXK6Rik4tfv8dj3ZzJnabiUevXDudult2x0hrkUO8HdHDTKAC4yzuPud0zfbrBuMV5aED0atxzkYljWN6ViOmvN8mU0from0zmcMWPBmgDd7rENyy8Lia1nySh28w4BgBbUapqfE8R9jHNszbkp5lu7z_ZWMcfOPtDgvtPw7WEqdshCnTPOiS3eiv3R3h__RzQPTpPhF0JfsbgD-Mf-ASn2URLb5MygcA1yyATZN5rL2I_C0GAau-3m4ERpfXmNL3V0o70sMrGNj0_cnroJxGaB9LNJWcUuolndvqW5gnArfACTv8BoGdbnYHWIZTN4jlIetiaToDUhXusTM5zp7YqXGECzSznBcYAthy=w1091-h1702-no?.png "[Linked Image]")
The Schaeffer's Supreme 9000 has an unusually thick base oil (very high HTFSV) as well as a very high HTHSV; so, there is no competition there with the other ILSAC GF-5 5W-30 oils for wear protection in either the boundary- or the hydrodynamic-lubrication regime as well as in between (mixed-lubrication regime).
Here is my base-oil viscosity (what I call high-temperature, full-shear viscosity HTFSV) list, which also lists the HTHSV:
Originally Posted by Gokhan
The Schaeffer's Supreme 9000 has an unusually thick base oil (very high HTFSV) as well as a very high HTHSV; so, there is no competition there with the other ILSAC GF-5 5W-30 oils for wear protection in either the boundary- or the hydrodynamic-lubrication regime as well as in between (mixed-lubrication regime).
Correction, after using the midpoint of the KV100 in the PDS (for some reason, they gave a range) instead of the older PQIA data:
The Schaeffer's Supreme 9000 has a thicker base oil (higher HTFSV) as well as a higher HTHSV than most other ILSAC GF-5 5W-30 oils; so, it may do well for fresh-oil wear protection in either the boundary- or the hydrodynamic-lubrication regime as well as in between (mixed-lubrication regime), assuming the AW/EP/FM additives are good and well-balanced with other additives. Used-oil wear performance also depends on the base-oil quality, detergents, and antioxidants.
Correction, after using the midpoint of the KV100 in the PDS (for some reason, they gave a range) instead of the older PQIA data:
The Schaeffer's Supreme 9000 has a thicker base oil (higher HTFSV) as well as a higher HTHSV than most other ILSAC GF-5 5W-30 oils; so, it may do well for fresh-oil wear protection in either the boundary- or the hydrodynamic-lubrication regime as well as in between (mixed-lubrication regime), assuming the AW/EP/FM additives are good and well-balanced with other additives. Used-oil wear performance also depends on the base-oil quality, detergents, and antioxidants.
Gokhan- that is a ton of useful data. Thanks !
Thank you Gokhan for the interesting data!
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Patman
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Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
OVERKILL
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Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Nailed it.
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Nailed it.
You guys are just jealous he figured it out before you did.
I wish this guy knew that Mobil is actually one of the descendants of Standard Oil, which traces its roots back to 1863. Mobil was created as a splintered offshoot in 1911. Schaeffers may be older and a very good if expensive product, but Exxon-Mobil certainly has a larger budget for R&D...
And while I think some of these videos are interesting, it's nonsense to take any of these results conclusively. I mean this is a guy that puts Lucas Oil Crapilizer in his old farm truck with syn oil, so it's hard to take any of this seriously...
And while I think some of these videos are interesting, it's nonsense to take any of these results conclusively. I mean this is a guy that puts Lucas Oil Crapilizer in his old farm truck with syn oil, so it's hard to take any of this seriously...
Originally Posted by Nickdfresh
I wish this guy knew that Mobil is actually one of the descendants of Standard Oil, which traces its roots back to 1863. Mobil was created as a splintered offshoot in 1911. Schaeffers may be older and a very good if expensive product, but Exxon-Mobil certainly has a larger budget for R&D...
And while I think some of these videos are interesting, it's nonsense to take any of these results conclusively. I mean this is a guy that puts Lucas Oil Crapilizer in his old farm truck with syn oil, so it's hard to take any of this seriously...
+1
Couldn't agree more.
I wish this guy knew that Mobil is actually one of the descendants of Standard Oil, which traces its roots back to 1863. Mobil was created as a splintered offshoot in 1911. Schaeffers may be older and a very good if expensive product, but Exxon-Mobil certainly has a larger budget for R&D...
And while I think some of these videos are interesting, it's nonsense to take any of these results conclusively. I mean this is a guy that puts Lucas Oil Crapilizer in his old farm truck with syn oil, so it's hard to take any of this seriously...
+1
Couldn't agree more.
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would be nice if the tests were done with a beater car vs a beater lawnmower. People watch the videos mostly applying the information to automobiles and not OPE.
Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Quoted for truth!
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Quoted for truth!
Originally Posted by Patman
Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
I really think this Project Farm guy could become the next Billy Mays of infomercial salesmen if he pursued that venue. ... Those "tests" -Ughhhh
...so flawed! A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing!
Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
I really think this Project Farm guy could become the next Billy Mays of infomercial salesmen if he pursued that venue. ... Those "tests" -Ughhhh
Originally Posted by RayCJ
Originally Posted by Patman
Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
I really think this Project Farm guy could become the next Billy Mays of infomercial salesmen if he pursued that venue. ... Those "tests" -Ughhhh
...so flawed! A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing!
Naw, he totally lacks the showman personality for it...
Originally Posted by Patman
Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
I really think this Project Farm guy could become the next Billy Mays of infomercial salesmen if he pursued that venue. ... Those "tests" -Ughhhh
Naw, he totally lacks the showman personality for it...
Originally Posted by Nickdfresh
Originally Posted by RayCJ
Originally Posted by Patman
Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
I really think this Project Farm guy could become the next Billy Mays of infomercial salesmen if he pursued that venue. ... Those "tests" -Ughhhh
...so flawed! A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing!
Naw, he totally lacks the showman personality for it...
But he's got the attention-grabbing voice and the clean-cut credible look. C'mon, be imaginative... With some lessons, he could do it. He could be selling wood chippers and miracle fold-up garden hoses like hotcakes.
Originally Posted by RayCJ
Originally Posted by Patman
Originally Posted by kschachn
Proper title should be "Project Farm posts another technically useless video to make money on hits and clicks"
Bingo! And they fool a lot of people! I had someone on the Corvette Forum tell me that Amazon Basics is a better oil than Mobil 1 because of one of these kinds of videos (using the one armed bandit no less!) The general public is easily fooled
I really think this Project Farm guy could become the next Billy Mays of infomercial salesmen if he pursued that venue. ... Those "tests" -Ughhhh
Naw, he totally lacks the showman personality for it...
But he's got the attention-grabbing voice and the clean-cut credible look. C'mon, be imaginative... With some lessons, he could do it. He could be selling wood chippers and miracle fold-up garden hoses like hotcakes.
Originally Posted by Gokhan
Unfortunately, while the M1 5W-30 flavors are otherwise great oils, they are made from exceptionally thin base oils, which increases their iron wear (boundary-lubrication wear). In fact, the M1 AP 5W-30 is one of their worst flavors in that respect, having one of the thinnest base oils.
The Schaeffer's Supreme 9000 has an unusually thick base oil (very high HTFSV) as well as a very high HTHSV; so, there is no competition there with the other ILSAC GF-5 5W-30 oils for wear protection in either the boundary- or the hydrodynamic-lubrication regime as well as in between (mixed-lubrication regime).
Here is my base-oil viscosity (what I call high-temperature, full-shear viscosity HTFSV) list, which also lists the HTHSV:
Gokhan- How dare you state facts about M1 and how it causes high iron and high wear numbers!!! The M1 clan on here will burn you at the stake!
Oh so many folks have seen this over the past several years and it also shows up as increased noise, rattles and other obvious signs the oil is not doing its job. This is why I vowed to never use an M1 product again. I gave it the benefit of the doubt and tried it years ago in 3 different vehicles and got the same, poor results and my father- a long time Mobil user also stopped using it when his Brand new 2016 Civic began ticking and rattling on startup. All noises went away upon switching to Pennzoil oils.
Unfortunately, while the M1 5W-30 flavors are otherwise great oils, they are made from exceptionally thin base oils, which increases their iron wear (boundary-lubrication wear). In fact, the M1 AP 5W-30 is one of their worst flavors in that respect, having one of the thinnest base oils.
The Schaeffer's Supreme 9000 has an unusually thick base oil (very high HTFSV) as well as a very high HTHSV; so, there is no competition there with the other ILSAC GF-5 5W-30 oils for wear protection in either the boundary- or the hydrodynamic-lubrication regime as well as in between (mixed-lubrication regime).
Here is my base-oil viscosity (what I call high-temperature, full-shear viscosity HTFSV) list, which also lists the HTHSV:
Gokhan- How dare you state facts about M1 and how it causes high iron and high wear numbers!!! The M1 clan on here will burn you at the stake!
Oh so many folks have seen this over the past several years and it also shows up as increased noise, rattles and other obvious signs the oil is not doing its job. This is why I vowed to never use an M1 product again. I gave it the benefit of the doubt and tried it years ago in 3 different vehicles and got the same, poor results and my father- a long time Mobil user also stopped using it when his Brand new 2016 Civic began ticking and rattling on startup. All noises went away upon switching to Pennzoil oils.
Originally Posted by racin4ds
Oh so many folks have seen this over the past several years and it also shows up as increased noise, rattles and other obvious signs the oil is not doing its job. This is why I vowed to never use an M1 product again. I gave it the benefit of the doubt and tried it years ago in 3 different vehicles and got the same, poor results and my father- a long time Mobil user also stopped using it when his Brand new 2016 Civic began ticking and rattling on startup. All noises went away upon switching to Pennzoil oils.
Sure, but let's not get ahead of ourselves and reach to conclusions here and bash one oil against another. Moreover, that infuriates people.
M1 and PP are both great oils, each with strengths and shortcomings.
Regarding high iron, it was more a problem in the SM days; so, it could have to do with the base-stocks types back then, such as generous use of esters perhaps, which is not the case today.
The thinner base oil only applies to M1 5W-30 flavors. Other M1 SAE viscosities are fine. If there is no wear issue in an engine, 10 ppm vs. 15 ppm iron won't make much difference. If the engine wears badly, then one can experiment with different oils and find something with a thicker base oil, even a 10W-30 or 15W-40 instead of a 5W-30.
Regarding noise, it's almost entirely subjective and doesn't mean anything.
The PAO-and-AN-based M1 EP 0W-20 SN PLUS is absolutely the best oil by far I have run in my engine in terms of how it sounds and feels, even though that sounds subjective as well. We will see how the UOA will also be good or not.
Oh so many folks have seen this over the past several years and it also shows up as increased noise, rattles and other obvious signs the oil is not doing its job. This is why I vowed to never use an M1 product again. I gave it the benefit of the doubt and tried it years ago in 3 different vehicles and got the same, poor results and my father- a long time Mobil user also stopped using it when his Brand new 2016 Civic began ticking and rattling on startup. All noises went away upon switching to Pennzoil oils.
Sure, but let's not get ahead of ourselves and reach to conclusions here and bash one oil against another. Moreover, that infuriates people.
M1 and PP are both great oils, each with strengths and shortcomings.
Regarding high iron, it was more a problem in the SM days; so, it could have to do with the base-stocks types back then, such as generous use of esters perhaps, which is not the case today.
The thinner base oil only applies to M1 5W-30 flavors. Other M1 SAE viscosities are fine. If there is no wear issue in an engine, 10 ppm vs. 15 ppm iron won't make much difference. If the engine wears badly, then one can experiment with different oils and find something with a thicker base oil, even a 10W-30 or 15W-40 instead of a 5W-30.
Regarding noise, it's almost entirely subjective and doesn't mean anything.
The PAO-and-AN-based M1 EP 0W-20 SN PLUS is absolutely the best oil by far I have run in my engine in terms of how it sounds and feels, even though that sounds subjective as well. We will see how the UOA will also be good or not.
Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by racin4ds
Oh so many folks have seen this over the past several years and it also shows up as increased noise, rattles and other obvious signs the oil is not doing its job. This is why I vowed to never use an M1 product again. I gave it the benefit of the doubt and tried it years ago in 3 different vehicles and got the same, poor results and my father- a long time Mobil user also stopped using it when his Brand new 2016 Civic began ticking and rattling on startup. All noises went away upon switching to Pennzoil oils.
Sure, but let's not get ahead of ourselves and reach to conclusions here and bash one oil against another. Moreover, that infuriates people.
M1 and PP are both great oils, each with strengths and shortcomings.
Regarding high iron, it was more a problem in the SM days; so, it could have to do with the base-stocks types back then, such as generous use of esters perhaps, which is not the case today.
The thinner base oil only applies to M1 5W-30 flavors. Other M1 SAE viscosities are fine. If there is no wear issue in an engine, 10 ppm vs. 15 ppm iron won't make much difference. If the engine wears badly, then one can experiment with different oils and find something with a thicker base oil, even a 10W-30 or 15W-40 instead of a 5W-30.
Regarding noise, it's almost entirely subjective and doesn't mean anything.
The PAO-and-AN-based M1 EP 0W-20 SN PLUS is absolutely the best oil by far I have run in my engine in terms of how it sounds and feels, even though that sounds subjective as well. We will see how the UOA will also be good or not.
I hear that all the time that mobil1 is thin and is not a good oil but there has to be something more if they are such a large company and factory fills for many OE
Originally Posted by racin4ds
Oh so many folks have seen this over the past several years and it also shows up as increased noise, rattles and other obvious signs the oil is not doing its job. This is why I vowed to never use an M1 product again. I gave it the benefit of the doubt and tried it years ago in 3 different vehicles and got the same, poor results and my father- a long time Mobil user also stopped using it when his Brand new 2016 Civic began ticking and rattling on startup. All noises went away upon switching to Pennzoil oils.
Sure, but let's not get ahead of ourselves and reach to conclusions here and bash one oil against another. Moreover, that infuriates people.
M1 and PP are both great oils, each with strengths and shortcomings.
Regarding high iron, it was more a problem in the SM days; so, it could have to do with the base-stocks types back then, such as generous use of esters perhaps, which is not the case today.
The thinner base oil only applies to M1 5W-30 flavors. Other M1 SAE viscosities are fine. If there is no wear issue in an engine, 10 ppm vs. 15 ppm iron won't make much difference. If the engine wears badly, then one can experiment with different oils and find something with a thicker base oil, even a 10W-30 or 15W-40 instead of a 5W-30.
Regarding noise, it's almost entirely subjective and doesn't mean anything.
The PAO-and-AN-based M1 EP 0W-20 SN PLUS is absolutely the best oil by far I have run in my engine in terms of how it sounds and feels, even though that sounds subjective as well. We will see how the UOA will also be good or not.
I hear that all the time that mobil1 is thin and is not a good oil but there has to be something more if they are such a large company and factory fills for many OE
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