DieselGate part 2!

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That's a specious argument that failure to "compete" to introduce new technologies is collusion.

But that's the way of things these days...Orwell got newspeak right
 
Originally Posted by Shannow
That's a specious argument that failure to "compete" to introduce new technologies is collusion.

But that's the way of things these days...Orwell got newspeak right


Actually further down the article states that they colluded to hinder the utilization of cleaner technologies. An example would be them both agreeing to not use more efficient SCR catalysts due to cost. Now of course BMW/Daimler will probably counter that the technology they decided to utilize met the emissions targets at the time which is all they're obligated to do.
 
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by Shannow
That's a specious argument that failure to "compete" to introduce new technologies is collusion.

But that's the way of things these days...Orwell got newspeak right


Actually further down the article states that they colluded to hinder the utilization of cleaner technologies. An example would be them both agreeing to not use more efficient SCR catalysts due to cost. Now of course BMW/Daimler will probably counter that the technology they decided to utilize met the emissions targets at the time which is all they're obligated to do.


No, as I stated...

Collusion is you and I sitting together and agreeing to do, not do, price fix, whatever to an end.

No meeting, no collusion.

The fact that US car companies have plans and product roll outs to meet future CAFE, and don't introduce them today simply because they have them is not collusion.
 
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Uh oh. Looks like the EU isn't done kicking the German auto industry around yet.

I can't help but see the writing on wall and know they're going to leverage this against the ICE again, and beat the drums of electric cars even harder.

DieselGate 2?


That's all it is, its so obvious, look at Norway. The EU is saturated with environmental nut jobs and it has nothing to do with clean air.
 
Originally Posted by Trav
The EU is saturated with environmental nut jobs and it has nothing to do with clean air.

So is this country. Political involvement with the environment has nothing to do with saving or cleaning anything.
 
Originally Posted by Shannow
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by Shannow
That's a specious argument that failure to "compete" to introduce new technologies is collusion.

But that's the way of things these days...Orwell got newspeak right


Actually further down the article states that they colluded to hinder the utilization of cleaner technologies. An example would be them both agreeing to not use more efficient SCR catalysts due to cost. Now of course BMW/Daimler will probably counter that the technology they decided to utilize met the emissions targets at the time which is all they're obligated to do.


No, as I stated...

Collusion is you and I sitting together and agreeing to do, not do, price fix, whatever to an end.

No meeting, no collusion.

The fact that US car companies have plans and product roll outs to meet future CAFE, and don't introduce them today simply because they have them is not collusion.



Collusion isn't always defined as price fixing. BMW, Daimler and I think Bosch spent a lot of time co-developing SCR technology. They were working towards standardizing in order to reduce material costs. It could something such as agreeing to standardized size of the SCR catalyst itself. It should surprise nobody that that size was the smallest possible which would allow them to meet EURO 5 or whatever diesel emissions requirements.
 
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You do not have to sit together. Just communicate.

However, sitting and talking under the (Maxwell Smart) dome of silence is how collusion is normally done.

Rod
 
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl

Collusion isn't always defined as price fixing. .


I NEVER once said that it was.

Reading and comprehension are clearly not your strong point.........
 
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by Trav
The EU is saturated with environmental nut jobs and it has nothing to do with clean air.

So is this country. Political involvement with the environment has nothing to do with saving or cleaning anything.


AKA social manipulation through regulation and legislation.
 
...€oh boy!!! 🤠. FOOD FIGHT. ðŸ¿ðŸ¿ðŸ¿I'm gonna pull up a chair and watch this descend to the lowest common denominator .ðŸ». I knew this was gonna rock when the dreaded C word surfaced.
 
Originally Posted by Shannow


No, as I stated...

Collusion is you and I sitting together and agreeing to do, not do, price fix, whatever to an end.

No meeting, no collusion.

The fact that US car companies have plans and product roll outs to meet future CAFE, and don't introduce them today simply because they have them is not collusion.


Originally Posted by Shannow
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl

Collusion isn't always defined as price fixing. .


I NEVER once said that it was.

Reading and comprehension are clearly not your strong point.........



Huh? You just mentioned "price fix".
 
Originally Posted by Trav
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by Trav
The EU is saturated with environmental nut jobs and it has nothing to do with clean air.

So is this country. Political involvement with the environment has nothing to do with saving or cleaning anything.


AKA social manipulation through regulation and legislation.


Kinda like laws revolving around smoking/drinking.
28.gif
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by Shannow


No, as I stated...

Collusion is you and I sitting together and agreeing to do, not do, price fix, whatever to an end.

No meeting, no collusion.

The fact that US car companies have plans and product roll outs to meet future CAFE, and don't introduce them today simply because they have them is not collusion.


Huh? You just mentioned "price fix".


JUST ???

I mentioned to do
to not do
price fix
whatever to an end...

not JUST price fix.

The allegation is that they colluded to withhold technology...and that failure to wheel out new technologies is proof.

Now it's up the the companies to prove their innocence, not the regulators to prove their alleged confusion.

And I'll stand by my reading and comprehension statement.
 
Originally Posted by skyactiv
Is Mueller heading the investigation?

O if he is it's going to be a long and expensive one !
 
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by Trav
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by Trav
The EU is saturated with environmental nut jobs and it has nothing to do with clean air.

So is this country. Political involvement with the environment has nothing to do with saving or cleaning anything.


AKA social manipulation through regulation and legislation.


Kinda like laws revolving around smoking/drinking.
28.gif



The problem is once the camel gets his nose under the tent you cant get him out.
 
Originally Posted by Shannow
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by Shannow


No, as I stated...

Collusion is you and I sitting together and agreeing to do, not do, price fix, whatever to an end.

No meeting, no collusion.

The fact that US car companies have plans and product roll outs to meet future CAFE, and don't introduce them today simply because they have them is not collusion.


Huh? You just mentioned "price fix".


JUST ???

I mentioned to do
to not do
price fix
whatever to an end...

not JUST price fix.

The allegation is that they colluded to withhold technology...and that failure to wheel out new technologies is proof.

Now it's up the the companies to prove their innocence, not the regulators to prove their alleged confusion.

And I'll stand by my reading and comprehension statement.


I meant "just" as in "very recently".
 
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