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Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant #5049426
03/21/19 12:03 AM
03/21/19 12:03 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 4,939
SF Bay Area
y_p_w Offline OP
y_p_w  Offline OP

Joined: May 2005
Posts: 4,939
SF Bay Area
I thought that basically all manufacturer's these days specified their own brand of coolant. However, I'm thinking of maybe a new Subaru and downloaded the owners manual for a 2018 BRZ. Now I'm not sure what to make of an oil change quantity of more than 5 quarts, but I guess that wouldn't be a deal breaker, especially if I could find the 6 quart boxes of Havoline DS 0W-20.

However, I noticed this in the section on coolant. Seems like they're basically saying it's OK to use something like Zerex Asian Vehicle Blue or maybe Prestone Asian. I guess there's also Pentafrost and Recochem. However, owners manuals I've seen before this always said "our coolant or nothing else" even though it's pretty well known that they all use a similar formula (no silicate, phosphates, and lots of sebacic acid). As far as I recall, it's not necessary to get everything exactly like the OEM, and often the OEM version would switch manufacturers with some inevitable changes.

Quote
https://cdn.subarunet.com/stis/doc/ownerManual/MSA5M1806A_STIS.pdf

Coolant type
Use either of the following.
• SUBARU Super Coolant
• Similar high-quality ethylene glycol-based non-
silicate, non-amine, non-nitrite, and non-borate coolant with long-life hybrid organic acid technology
Do not use plain water alone.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: y_p_w] #5049435
03/21/19 12:50 AM
03/21/19 12:50 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 660
WA
SnowDrifter Offline
SnowDrifter  Offline

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 660
WA
I mean... I run type 2 honda antifreeze in my Chevy. I think most if not all modern coolants work in all modern vehicles. It's just interactions between coolants ya don't want. It's all the same stuff in the heart of the beast. Nitrile gaskets, EDPM hoses, iron cylinder liners / block, aluminum heads, nylon radiator end caps, fittings, reservoir. Maybe some changes in water pump impeller design, whether it be nylon or stamped steel.


2005 Tahoe - 140k
2003 Forester(the swagger wagon) - Rehomed
1999 Passat - Rehomed
Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: y_p_w] #5049456
03/21/19 02:16 AM
03/21/19 02:16 AM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 5,388
California
nthach Offline
nthach  Offline

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 5,388
California
Since the term hybrid organic acid does paint a broad brush, rule out G-05/G-40/G-48. Subaru wants Japanese pHOAT - but Prestone did reformulate their namesake coolant quietly as a pHOAT. Cor-Guard is testing out to contain phosphorus. It uses 2-EHA and sodium neodeconate as the organic acids.

Depending on how you feel about 2-EHA, new Prestone does fit the Japanese definition of hybrid coolant.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: y_p_w] #5049478
03/21/19 03:43 AM
03/21/19 03:43 AM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 263
New Hampshire
Railrust Offline
Railrust  Offline

Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 263
New Hampshire
What I've personally found to be the key is, just don't mix coolants. That's the only time I've seen a problem...when someone mixed coolants.

I look at cooling systems like this...

A water pump is eventually going to leak. A hose clamp is eventually going to loosen up and need to be tightened or replaced. A side tank on a radiator is eventually going to leak, or the fins will corrode on the bottom. Coolant - if correct - is not going to be a problem. So just use the right kind.

And I'll tell you what, I'd hate to be in the cooling hose business. Unless a radiator is getting replaced and we change the hoses for preventive maintenance...I haven't seen a hose have to be replaced in 20 years. I haven't seen them burst, leak, nothing. Even the ones that are covered in oil. I don't know how they're making hoses nowadays but they seem to last a very very long time. I see cars with 250,000 miles with original hoses on them. Belts are a different story.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: y_p_w] #5049539
03/21/19 06:41 AM
03/21/19 06:41 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 13,142
The Motor City
Kestas Offline
Global Moderator
Kestas  Offline
Global Moderator

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 13,142
The Motor City
I used to replace all coolant hoses at the 50K mark to avoid problems on the road. Now I treat them as good-for-life. The last hose I replaced was on a 98 Ford ZX2 at the 180K mark.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: y_p_w] #5049568
03/21/19 07:19 AM
03/21/19 07:19 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 50
NY
Clarkbug Offline
Clarkbug  Offline

Joined: May 2012
Posts: 50
NY
I assumed that they listed the alternative coolant as part of the MM Warranty act. If they said only Subaru Coolant would be acceptable, they would have to provide it for you. Instead they can just give you the specifications, or say that theirs will be "optimal", but you can use something else that meets those specifications.

I have a jug of the Super Coolant, but also picked up a few bottles of the Pentafrost Blue when AutoZone had it for $10 a gallon.

Agree with the other posters that its just best to not mix.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: y_p_w] #5049590
03/21/19 07:47 AM
03/21/19 07:47 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 13,466
The Old North State
Sayjac Offline
Sayjac  Offline

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 13,466
The Old North State
Quote
…. Seems like they're basically saying it's OK to use something like Zerex Asian Vehicle Blue or maybe Prestone Asian.....
If having/using similar to true Asian PHoat type chemistry important, then ZAF, WM V/Z Asian Vehicle, Pentofrost A3/4 would be acceptable. Prestone faux Asian AF, not so much. No Asian oem AF or true Asian PHoat aftermarket currently uses 2eha as inhibitor found in Prestone. Wanna roll the dice with Prestone labeled for Toyota, for Honda, your call. I'll pass.

As for OM recs, while some like topic have gotten more specific over time, they have tended to be rather vague. Some like Hyun/Kia have (or used to) ethlene glycol based AF, which the majority AF are, no matter type.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: Railrust] #5049658
03/21/19 09:19 AM
03/21/19 09:19 AM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 4,939
SF Bay Area
y_p_w Offline OP
y_p_w  Offline OP

Joined: May 2005
Posts: 4,939
SF Bay Area
Originally Posted by Railrust
What I've personally found to be the key is, just don't mix coolants. That's the only time I've seen a problem...when someone mixed coolants.

I look at cooling systems like this...

A water pump is eventually going to leak. A hose clamp is eventually going to loosen up and need to be tightened or replaced. A side tank on a radiator is eventually going to leak, or the fins will corrode on the bottom. Coolant - if correct - is not going to be a problem. So just use the right kind.

And I'll tell you what, I'd hate to be in the cooling hose business. Unless a radiator is getting replaced and we change the hoses for preventive maintenance...I haven't seen a hose have to be replaced in 20 years. I haven't seen them burst, leak, nothing. Even the ones that are covered in oil. I don't know how they're making hoses nowadays but they seem to last a very very long time. I see cars with 250,000 miles with original hoses on them. Belts are a different story.

I’ve replaced a couple of hoses, or at least had a shop replace them. The first I saw steam rising out of the engine bay of my 1995 Integra GS-R. It was a fairly cool night and I limped it home. It was at about 7 years and maybe 110k miles. I took another car to get a replacement hose that night and replaced the upper hose, which had burst. I didn’t have a whole lot of Honda green, but did have a couple of bottles of Havoline Dex-Cool and distilled water. So yeah that’s what I used. Later the radiator cracked, but that was just the plastic tank.

The second time I was right at my destination and ready to park when steam started coming out if my WRX. I couldn’t see what it was, but apparently it was the lower hose. I actually finished shopping, called for a AAA tow, and my car was left at a shop where I’ve done business before. I think they used whatever universal coolant they had. And that radiator eventually cracked. I had that one replaced with a Mishimoto aluminum radiator and Subaru Long-Life.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: Railrust] #5049800
03/21/19 11:42 AM
03/21/19 11:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 5,388
California
nthach Offline
nthach  Offline

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 5,388
California
Originally Posted by Railrust


And I'll tell you what, I'd hate to be in the cooling hose business. Unless a radiator is getting replaced and we change the hoses for preventive maintenance...I haven't seen a hose have to be replaced in 20 years. I haven't seen them burst, leak, nothing. Even the ones that are covered in oil. I don't know how they're making hoses nowadays but they seem to last a very very long time. I see cars with 250,000 miles with original hoses on them. Belts are a different story.

OEM hoses are quite good these days. The Japanese spearheaded EPDM hoses as OEM years ago and except for small, PITA hoses do last a good, long time.

Re: Manufacturer with a generic recommendation for coolant [Re: y_p_w] #5058730
03/30/19 03:43 PM
03/30/19 03:43 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,302
Lexington, KY
BearZDefect Offline
BearZDefect  Offline

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,302
Lexington, KY
OEM coolant hoses are good, but I have seen the hot side hose feeding the radiator burst in late 1990s Japanese cars with less than 150k miles.

One was a 10 year old Honda Accord. The owner had only driven a few miles in town when he showed it to me, asking if he should continue driving it. I told him let's fix it now before the engine overheats, so we did. That car also developed transmission problems beyond our ability to fix.

The other was 15 year old Toyota Camry. The owner ignored the overheating light while driving down the highway after the hose burst, continued to drive it until it died. That engine had to be replaced. It was unfortunate because that car was otherwise in very good condition, but hoses degenerate with age.

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