PP Euro 5W-40 reformulated; now SN+, no more Ferrari

[1JZ_E46]

The legendary "Ferrari" oil, PP Euro 5W-40 has been reformulated. It now meets SN+ and specifically states it's suitable for modern TGDIs and provides LSPI protection. It has however lost Ferrari/Maserati approval, and the specs have changed a little.

New PDS:
https://shell-livedocs.com/data/published/en/89db797b-d00c-4b95-8e28-cb5ffd24705f.pdf

Old PDS (still available for now):
https://shell-livedocs.com/data/published/en-US/0e00e77c-82e8-4754-a5d8-996047cd951b.pdf

We'll see if the 12 quarts I just purchased are the new or old formula. Both are LL-01 approved so I don't care much one way or the other.

 

[dlundblad]

Darn, the Ferrari cert was the only reason I ran the stuff in my Lawn Boy.

 

[Bjornviken]

Dont worry, Shell Helix Ultra do still have it

 

[1JZ_E46]

I'm interested to see how the additive formula has changed. This is the first A3/B4 "euro" oil that meets SN+ and could be a game changer for those with high HP TGDI engines that want something thicker than what your typical GF-5 oil offers.

 

[KCJeep]

Wow I hope that is a trend we will see more of. I would use that in my Passat in a heartbeat. The KV100 is very low for a 40 grade. Interesting.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted by KCJeep
Wow I hope that is a trend we will see more of. I would use that in my Passat in a heartbeat. The KV100 is very low for a 40 grade. Interesting.


Same. This would be perfect for our small TGDI that requires LL-01 but suffers from LSPI.

 

[edyvw]

Wait, GTL and Pour Point is -36???? [censored]?

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted by edyvw
Wait, GTL and Pour Point is -36???? [censored]?


They're using a heavier GTL basestock with less VII. Assuming similar HTHS, this is evidenced by the higher density and higher A_Harman index.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted by edyvw
Wait, GTL and Pour Point is -36???? [censored]?


They're using a heavier GTL basestock with less VII.

This to me looks like pushing boundaries of how cheap they can get away with.

 

[RooflessVW]

Has anyone seen this SN+ 5W-40 yet? I've still been getting the silver bottles up until this last week, where I finally got some yellow bottles. They're SN with the Ferrari badge on the front.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Has anyone seen this SN+ 5W-40 yet? I've still been getting the silver bottles up until this last week, where I finally got some yellow bottles. They're SN with the Ferrari badge on the front.


It'll probably take time. It's not a very fast moving product.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted by edyvw

This to me looks like pushing boundaries of how cheap they can get away with.


It still has LL-01, 229.5 and A40 approval. I wouldn't make a sweeping statement like that based on a single number.

 

[RooflessVW]

Originally Posted by 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Has anyone seen this SN+ 5W-40 yet? I've still been getting the silver bottles up until this last week, where I finally got some yellow bottles. They're SN with the Ferrari badge on the front.

It'll probably take time. It's not a very fast moving product.

Suspect you're right. How long have the silver bottles been discontinued? And I just bought some last fall.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted by edyvw

This to me looks like pushing boundaries of how cheap they can get away with.


It still has LL-01, 229.5 and A40 approval. I wouldn't make a sweeping statement like that based on a single number.

Their cst went down to 12.8, and they are not posting HTHS, which I highly doubt is above 3.6, if that.
There was Ultra GTL version for short period of time with HTHS of 3.88 (which they proudly posted back then) and NOACK of 6% (which they also proudly posted).
Now? Both numbers are gone.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by edyvw
Wait, GTL and Pour Point is -36???? [censored]?


It's PAO that has the wickedly low pour point due to it having no wax in it. Since GTL is still a waxy base it requires PPD's to prevent crystal formation, so if they are using a heavier GTL base, as posited by another member, the less than stellar pour point (1C below the MRV temperature for the 5w-xx designation) then makes sense.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by OVERKILL
Originally Posted by edyvw
Wait, GTL and Pour Point is -36???? [censored]?


It's PAO that has the wickedly low pour point due to it having no wax in it. Since GTL is still a waxy base it requires PPD's to prevent crystal formation, so if they are using a heavier GTL base, as posited by another member, the less than stellar pour point (1C below the MRV temperature for the 5w-xx designation) then makes sense.

Sure, not disputing that, but why? Numbers are on par with 5W30, and wondering about NOACK. PP Euro L has 11%. Not something to brag about.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted by edyvw

Sure, not disputing that, but why? Numbers are on par with 5W30, and wondering about NOACK. PP Euro L has 11%. Not something to brag about.


MB 229.51 (and 229.5 and 229.52) has Noack limit of 10%

https://www.aftonchemical.com/Afton/media/PdfFiles/Specification_Handbook.pdf

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted by edyvw

Sure, not disputing that, but why? Numbers are on par with 5W30, and wondering about NOACK. PP Euro L has 11%. Not something to brag about.


MB 229.51 (and 229.5 and 229.52) has Noack limit of 10%

https://www.aftonchemical.com/Afton/media/PdfFiles/Specification_Handbook.pdf

I know, PP Euro L pds at one point was showing 11%, and had MB229.51. How? Beats me. But, granted, Pennzoil and accurate pds is not something that goes together in sentence. It could be also that that -36 should have designation "min." Like Castrol, that puts on pds HTHS: 3.5 min.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
Originally Posted by edyvw
Wait, GTL and Pour Point is -36???? [censored]?


It's PAO that has the wickedly low pour point due to it having no wax in it. Since GTL is still a waxy base it requires PPD's to prevent crystal formation, so if they are using a heavier GTL base, as posited by another member, the less than stellar pour point (1C below the MRV temperature for the 5w-xx designation) then makes sense.

Sure, not disputing that, but why? Numbers are on par with 5W30, and wondering about NOACK. PP Euro L has 11%. Not something to brag about.


This happened to a number of product when the original Pennzoil Ultra product line was transformed into "Ultra Platinum"

I don't know why, as it certainly didn't seem to be something one could describe as "progress".

 

[oil_film_movies]

I like the new SN+ cert, and the fact that its kv100 is so close to being a thick 5w30 (hths about 3.5 here), I think you can use it in about any 5w30 application around, either German or non-German engines out there. I'd probably only recommend it for 5w30 hths 3.0 applications when fuel dilution is suspected or towing-hauling happens. Rotella Gas Truck is a recent good one too, yet this Pennz 5w40 is better for severe duty.