Is ford admitting to their filters tearing?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Jan 17, 2012
Messages
364
Location
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
https://youtu.be/FmRCw4DnvFM

Recent video from ford and they specifically show their motorcraft oil filter being cut open and say to look for bits of filter paper in the oiling system. Sorry y'all... but it's just too good. It's like they know they have a problem. One day maybe they will change from purolator to fram!
 
Last edited:
I interpreted the filter section of the video as: look for signs of poor maintenance that might affect the filter in negative ways, one being breakdown of the filter media. I don't see anywhere in the video that states to look for poor quality control/ filter media tears that might affect the vct problem. There is a difference of cause and effect.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by doitmyself
I interpreted the filter section of the video as: look for signs of poor maintenance that might affect the filter in negative ways, one being breakdown of the filter media. I don't see anywhere in the video that states to look for filter media breakdown from poor quality control that might affect the vct problem. There is a difference.


+1
That's what I got out of it also.
 
Sorry guys. Just trying to read behind the lines here. They are talking about the modular line of engines which uses the fl-820s - arguably the most common motorcraft to tear. Also I meant for this to be posted in the oil filter section... need more coffee today...
 
Neat idea adding wire mesh filters to the VVT switch passages. The Toyota and Subaru ones I've seen don't have these on the oil feed passages.
 
The filter tears it doen't. come apart as we have seen on the cut and posts. I avoid the Motorcraft 820
 
Originally Posted by crainholio
Neat idea adding wire mesh filters to the VVT switch passages. The Toyota and Subaru ones I've seen don't have these on the oil feed passages.




Like everything there are pros and cons. If those get plugged how easy is it to clean or replace?
 
Originally Posted by crainholio
Neat idea adding wire mesh filters to the VVT switch passages. The Toyota and Subaru ones I've seen don't have these on the oil feed passages.


The Toyota 1mz-fe has had fine mesh filters for this since VVTi was introduced on it 1999. They are located in the oil inlet passeges cast into the heads, downstream of the incoming oil to the oil control valves for the VVT system. They do not have a problem with clogging, and are very easy to inspect and clean.

I haven't looked at ALL Toyota engines, thought it was pretty standard to the design for them.
 
Last edited:
I would not interpret that video as any admission on Ford's part about MC filter tears.
it's a catch-all concern to look for signs of neglect.
The point they were making is that if the oil is sludged from overly long OCIs, it's likely that the filter was also neglected and may have degraded.
 
Last edited:
They show a filter with a big hole/tear in the media at time 0:54.

And they mention the possibility of filter media causing issues at times 0:48, 1:40 and 1:56 as possibly getting into the VTC system and clogging the screens. Only way that could happen is if media tears and goes into the engine. So they are basically saying that can happen ... with any filter if the filter is neglected and in bypass a lot (sludged up).

So yeah, failing filter media certainly is a concern and mentioned many times in this video.
 
Originally Posted by dnewton3
I would not interpret that video as any admission on Ford's part about MC filter tears.
it's a catch-all concern to look for signs of neglect.
The point they were making is that if the oil is sludged from overly long OCIs, it's likely that the filter was also neglected and may have degraded.

You may run your TG's out to 15k, yet I don't think Fram is making any stipulations. In other words I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be worried about TG's tearing at 15k even though they may be only 10k rated. Also you're probably using conventional oil which at 15k would be more prone to sludging but you still have confidence in that filter.
 
Ideally, an oil filter's media should be able to take the delta-p level all day long that the bypass opens up at. If the manufacturer's have actually tested that or not on their filters is unknown. If they did, then I'd say those filters will be pretty reliable in terms of media integrity. Come to think about it, I do believe the ISO 4548 has a section or two about testing the bypass valve function and maybe the media integrity. Of course if a few test filters pass that test, it's not a guarantee that every filter coming off the line will pass to because of manufacturing variables and QA.

OIL FILTER TESTS PER ISO-4548
Part 1: Differential pressure/flow characteristics.
Part 2: Element by-pass valve characteristics.
Part 3: Resistance to high differential pressure and to elevated temperature.
Part 4: Initial particle retention efficiency, life and cumulative efficiency (gravimetric method).
Part 5: Cold start simulation and hydraulic pulse durability test.
Part 6: Static burst pressure test.
Part 7: Vibration fatigue test.
Part 8: Inlet anti-drain valve test - withdrawn, covered in Part 9.
Part 9: Inlet and outlet anti-drain valve tests.
Part 10: Life and cumulative efficiency in the presence of water in oil.
Part 11: Self-cleaning filters.
Part 12: Filtration efficiency using particle counting, and contaminant retention capacity.
 
Now if only they would drop Purolator as a supplier
smirk2.gif
27.gif
 
Originally Posted by madeej11
Thanks for the explanation Zee.


Anytime ... thanks.
 
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
.. Of course if a few test filters pass that test, it's not a guarantee that every filter coming off the line will pass to because of manufacturing variables and QA.

Zee is so very right on point here.

This is the challenge today, from a quality control perspective. I've worked in manufacturing my entire adult life, in roles from supervision to maintenance to engineering. As market pricing pressures drive ever tighter engineering challenges, it comes down not only to what can be designed, but made. Variation in production capability (machining, assembly, raw materials, sub-assemblies, etc) all make this a larger issue. Thus the topic of process controls comes into view. (My recent role for 10 years was that of a statistical process quality control engineer. I now do VAVE.)
 
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
So yeah, failing filter media certainly is a concern and mentioned many times in this video.
At some point, maybe Ford will require wire-backed synthetic (non-paper) oil filter media? Hey, I can dream. Fram Ultra should prevent any chunks from getting loose. Makes the case for them.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top