Oil jet piston cooling and its effects on oil?
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Originally Posted by ofelas
Wow. People actually remove piston squirters ?
Only if they don't have enough oil pressure elsewhere and don't want to go thicker or go for a bigger oil pump. Race engine doesn't need to last 250k miles like OEM does, OEM doesn't like to add expensive parts that doesn't do anything.
On Honda's B series engine only the VTEC ones have them, i.e. the 170hp or so B18C has but the 140 or so hp B18B doesn't.
Wow. People actually remove piston squirters ?
Only if they don't have enough oil pressure elsewhere and don't want to go thicker or go for a bigger oil pump. Race engine doesn't need to last 250k miles like OEM does, OEM doesn't like to add expensive parts that doesn't do anything.
On Honda's B series engine only the VTEC ones have them, i.e. the 170hp or so B18C has but the 140 or so hp B18B doesn't.
https://youtu.be/Px0_6-Btx3Y
My R18 got oil cooling jets on it. I think honda started on type-r cars and NSX first kinda like vtec.
My R18 got oil cooling jets on it. I think honda started on type-r cars and NSX first kinda like vtec.
I find it somewhat laughable that some folks remove factory piston cooling nozzles on sub 300hp engines with imagined caveats such as "high HP/output" or "track use" or "pro engine builders for important spots".
Funnily enough, 2000HP/3500 ft-lb sled pulling diesels still run cooling squirters. At 6000rpm with a 30gph oil pump, no less.
The most that happens is an upgrade from 25 year old brittle/cracked plastic nozzles to replacement billet nozzles, with a similar bore size.
Funnily enough, 2000HP/3500 ft-lb sled pulling diesels still run cooling squirters. At 6000rpm with a 30gph oil pump, no less.
The most that happens is an upgrade from 25 year old brittle/cracked plastic nozzles to replacement billet nozzles, with a similar bore size.
My Scion Xb with the 2.4l engine has oil squirters. I was surprised that the plebeian 2.4 used in the Camry, Rav4 and various others got that feature, but I figure it has something to do with emissions or fuel economy or a combination of the two.
Originally Posted by Shannow
Just to add something (a little), here's a piston out of a 3L Toyota diesel "D4D" that had an kijection problem and ate a piston (piston is on my desk).
![[Linked Image]](http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b42/akashafamily/Lube%20Stuff/IMG_20151019_225944.jpg "[Linked Image]")
What you are looking down into is the crown cooling passage.
The squirters are arranged such that they direct the oil at a port in the piston underside, and it circulates/sloshes in this gallery for some time before running out holes on the other side.
Can you post a picture of the undercrown?
Edit: Oops. Never mind. Your text makes it clear that it is a gallery-cooled piston.
Just to add something (a little), here's a piston out of a 3L Toyota diesel "D4D" that had an kijection problem and ate a piston (piston is on my desk).
What you are looking down into is the crown cooling passage.
The squirters are arranged such that they direct the oil at a port in the piston underside, and it circulates/sloshes in this gallery for some time before running out holes on the other side.
Can you post a picture of the undercrown?
Edit: Oops. Never mind. Your text makes it clear that it is a gallery-cooled piston.
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Honda's use oil squirters was very strategic. They were able to get away with a lighter piston.
Fun fact: Many V8 racing engines have the oil squirters built into the oil pan, rather than the block.
Fun fact: Many V8 racing engines have the oil squirters built into the oil pan, rather than the block.
Originally Posted by DoubleWasp
Honda's use oil squirters was very strategic. They were able to get away with a lighter piston.
Fun fact: Many V8 racing engines have the oil squirters built into the oil pan, rather than the block.
And have squirters spraying the valvetrain.
Honda's use oil squirters was very strategic. They were able to get away with a lighter piston.
Fun fact: Many V8 racing engines have the oil squirters built into the oil pan, rather than the block.
And have squirters spraying the valvetrain.
Great read.
Most (if not all) Japanese turbo engines from the late 80's onwards have been fitted with under piston oil squirters. So this is far from ' new cutting edge technology.' Engine include CA18DET, SR20DET, RB20/25/26/30, 7MGTE, 4g63, 1/2JZGTE, 3SGTE, BP18, B16/18 + lots of other Honda stuff, in addition to more modern engines less familiar to the 'performance crowd.'
The cooling performance reduces 'hot-spots' on pistons and as another member mentioned.
"As it's a continuous flow, the piston never gets 'hot-enough' to cause problems. The inside of a turbo or 1st compression ring are far more violent and demanding conditions. Especially if it's only an 'oil-cooled' turbocharger."
Generally speaking it's a good idea to leave them in. I unfortunately had to remove them from my CA18DET as the Wiseco piston skirt was designed in such a way that they made contact. So
.
Regards
Jordan
Most (if not all) Japanese turbo engines from the late 80's onwards have been fitted with under piston oil squirters. So this is far from ' new cutting edge technology.' Engine include CA18DET, SR20DET, RB20/25/26/30, 7MGTE, 4g63, 1/2JZGTE, 3SGTE, BP18, B16/18 + lots of other Honda stuff, in addition to more modern engines less familiar to the 'performance crowd.'
The cooling performance reduces 'hot-spots' on pistons and as another member mentioned.
"As it's a continuous flow, the piston never gets 'hot-enough' to cause problems. The inside of a turbo or 1st compression ring are far more violent and demanding conditions. Especially if it's only an 'oil-cooled' turbocharger."
Generally speaking it's a good idea to leave them in. I unfortunately had to remove them from my CA18DET as the Wiseco piston skirt was designed in such a way that they made contact. So
Regards
Jordan
Didn't oil cooling jets start with Ferrari long ago??
Oil cooled pistons are done to stabilize the dissimilar expansion of aluminum (piston) and iron (bore and rings). If the piston gets too hot, it'll seize. Or, it has to be run too loose at cold temps, so it rocks and can crack skirts. It's all about controlling thermal expansion ...
Originally Posted by Marco620
Didn't oil cooling jets start with Ferrari long ago??
A lot of good technology comes from them. I'm a big fan of F1 racing.
Didn't oil cooling jets start with Ferrari long ago??
A lot of good technology comes from them. I'm a big fan of F1 racing.
Originally Posted by Marco620
Didn't oil cooling jets start with Ferrari long ago??
How long ago? The 2 cycle Detroit Diesel designed in 1933 had them.
Didn't oil cooling jets start with Ferrari long ago??
How long ago? The 2 cycle Detroit Diesel designed in 1933 had them.
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