Car Batteries in Consumer Reports

[Donald]

I will agree that Consumer Reports subscribers probably do not accurately represent the American population. Probably better educated and higher income. I mean if you are barely scraping by, you will not spend $27 on the magazine. But it's in the library.

The only thing they get from subscribers is reliability information. They do all the actual testing themselves or contracted to other labs possibly if a test required expensive equipment or extensive knowledge not available at Consumer Reports.

 

[maintenanceMan]

It would be useful it we had a graphic or chart showing who makes what on these batteries with maybe some insights on their rankings. If consumer reports was really on its game, it would include this type of information.

 

[Donald]

Originally Posted by maintenanceMan
It would be useful it we had a graphic or chart showing who makes what on these batteries with maybe some insights on their rankings. If consumer reports was really on its game, it would include this type of information.


I posted a link awhile ago to what looks like a world wide list of batteries and manufacturers that someone compiled. It's a long list and not straight forward. As some people has suggested companies like Walmart use different suppliers in different areas of the country.

The battery you will get at a CarQuest depends upon if the store was independently owned or owned by CarQuest before the AAP merger. Some get Deka and others get AAP.

 

[Dave9]

Originally Posted by bullwinkle
Not surprising that the best overall was an East Penn-and I've had decent luck with JC made WM EverStart Maxx & Interstate MTPs-but after having a couple JC batteries leak acid like sieves and not be warrantable for it, I'm never spending more than $50 on another JC made one!


What was their excuse for denying the warranty? Was it even denied by them or the seller? I've bought multiple JC made Maxx batteries from Walmart in recent years and they're pretty good about warranties.

Did they leak out at the terminals or a crack in the casing? Most common reason for casing cracks is letting charge get too low in freezing weather which greatly reduces the electrolyte freezing temperature. This will happen to any flooded lead acid battery.

 

[sxg6]

I'm looking at the results right now, and a napa battery is only the best in one single group category, and it doesn't even have the highest score out of all the batteries tested between the different groups.

 

[Hall]

Originally Posted by sxg6
I'm looking at the results right now, and a napa battery is only the best in one single group category, and it doesn't even have the highest score out of all the batteries tested between the different groups.

I remember reading their battery reports and do recall that they rank by group size, which I disagree with as that group size only helps a small subset of battery purchasers. Personally, I think they should take the "x" most common group sizes from each manufacturer and lump their results together and they can say "Across the board, brand "A" is the best overall". They could still provide the finer details of individual brands by group size.

To me, why would a group size 'z' battery from brand "A" be excellent, for example, while their group size 'y' sucks ?

 

[UG_Passat]

Originally Posted by y_p_w
Originally Posted by Donald
Originally Posted by Pelican
I've heard that CR has a bias toward those who "Contribute" to their research. I take their reports with a handful of salt.


People like me who wanted to be educated consumers contribute. Magazine subscription, sweepstakes, etc. They accept no advertising and will not let their reports be used by companies as part of advertising. You may disagree with their testing methods or criteria, but their integrity is beyond reproach.

Their testing methods are often junk. I'm pretty sure any testing engineer for an oil company or automaker would look at their testing procedures and conclude they do stuff that makes absolutely no sense. I remember years ago seeing their reviews on bicycles, where they had some oddball testing criteria for "coasting efficiency" where they had a rider sit on a bike and see how fast it took to descend. There were way too many variables that could affect it, and it basically ignored the issue of break in time with bearings, where new bearings generally need to be adjusted. Even then it was about the least scientific and worthless test I could imagine.

I don't think they can be bought, but their methods leave doubt to their conclusions.


It is valuable information to the pro-peloton. The riders often get brand new bikes, fresh from the factory, where their mechanics assemble them at the day before the race. There is no break-in time for bearings for riders go on their 1st stage with the bike.

Much of the bicycle hub bearings don't need adjustment, as there is no adjustment built in, with the exception of notably Shimano, who still uses loose bearings. I have always found in all of my Specialized bikes, the hub bearings have more drag on them, so they don't coast as well, which is why I have aftermarket wheels on my Mountain bike (Stan's Arch EX with SRAM X.7 hubs) and road bike (Mavic Ksyrium Elite, which have preload adjustment, which I never touched in 6 years). The preload adjustment is just for play in the hub. Too much preload, then yes, it restricts the bearings from rolling over the cones.

Road riders seek to find efficiencies where ever they can down to the bearings, to tires, though some of the old guard still insist on 22-23mm tires.

What do pro-riders have to do with this? The rules of road cycling are modeled off of pro riders.

 

[rshaw125]

FYI. Went by Costco and had a look at the batteries. They were the cheapest of what I need 36R at $79 but they did not have any. In fact they had about half the number of batteries they used to. All Interstate. The Duracell at Sam's is $99 but they do coupons several times a year for $20 0ff. Advance are well over $100 for a 36R. I'm going to buy the Duracell.

 

[Virtus_Probi]

Originally Posted by UG_Passat
Originally Posted by y_p_w
Originally Posted by Donald
Originally Posted by Pelican
I've heard that CR has a bias toward those who "Contribute" to their research. I take their reports with a handful of salt.

People like me who wanted to be educated consumers contribute. Magazine subscription, sweepstakes, etc. They accept no advertising and will not let their reports be used by companies as part of advertising. You may disagree with their testing methods or criteria, but their integrity is beyond reproach.

Their testing methods are often junk. I'm pretty sure any testing engineer for an oil company or automaker would look at their testing procedures and conclude they do stuff that makes absolutely no sense. I remember years ago seeing their reviews on bicycles, where they had some oddball testing criteria for "coasting efficiency" where they had a rider sit on a bike and see how fast it took to descend. There were way too many variables that could affect it, and it basically ignored the issue of break in time with bearings, where new bearings generally need to be adjusted. Even then it was about the least scientific and worthless test I could imagine.
I don't think they can be bought, but their methods leave doubt to their conclusions.

It is valuable information to the pro-peloton. The riders often get brand new bikes, fresh from the factory, where their mechanics assemble them at the day before the race. There is no break-in time for bearings for riders go on their 1st stage with the bike.
Much of the bicycle hub bearings don't need adjustment, as there is no adjustment built in, with the exception of notably Shimano, who still uses loose bearings. I have always found in all of my Specialized bikes, the hub bearings have more drag on them, so they don't coast as well, which is why I have aftermarket wheels on my Mountain bike (Stan's Arch EX with SRAM X.7 hubs) and road bike (Mavic Ksyrium Elite, which have preload adjustment, which I never touched in 6 years). The preload adjustment is just for play in the hub. Too much preload, then yes, it restricts the bearings from rolling over the cones.
Road riders seek to find efficiencies where ever they can down to the bearings, to tires, though some of the old guard still insist on 22-23mm tires.
What do pro-riders have to do with this? The rules of road cycling are modeled off of pro riders.

I road biked for about 10 years with coworkers and others from our building and I don't remember anybody talking about adjusting bearings after break in....I certainly never did it and one of the guys would usually ride morning, lunchtime, and evening on one of his 4 expensive bikes that he maintained and he never mentioned such a thing to us.
I did look at CR when I went to buy my first new road bike and noticed that they were high on a particular entry level Bianchi touring bike...I ended up buying an entry level Bianchi Campione racer (more compact frame than the tourer) and dearly loved the thing. My previous bike was bought used from a sketchy bike shop and the guy just wanted to sell me what he had...it didn't fit me right and the advice I got from the Bianchi dealer was invaluable in getting the right size. I probably would have been very happy with a decent bike from any brand that fit me properly, but that Bianchi was one of the best sporting purchases I ever made and I never had any trouble with it. I went from a back of the peloton guy just hanging on to having other guys try to draft off me and pass me at the very end of the ride, and I usually was able to hold them off (unless it was the guy who rode 3 times a day).
Not everything we have purchased based on CR articles has been a 100% winner, but I see them as being an excellent source of info...pretty discouraging to see similar mags selling ad space for the exact products they are reviewing.

 

[javacontour]

Are we now going to talk about "The Rules"



Originally Posted by UG_Passat

What do pro-riders have to do with this? The rules of road cycling are modeled off of pro riders.

 

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by UG_Passat
It is valuable information to the pro-peloton. The riders often get brand new bikes, fresh from the factory, where their mechanics assemble them at the day before the race. There is no break-in time for bearings for riders go on their 1st stage with the bike.

Much of the bicycle hub bearings don't need adjustment, as there is no adjustment built in, with the exception of notably Shimano, who still uses loose bearings. I have always found in all of my Specialized bikes, the hub bearings have more drag on them, so they don't coast as well, which is why I have aftermarket wheels on my Mountain bike (Stan's Arch EX with SRAM X.7 hubs) and road bike (Mavic Ksyrium Elite, which have preload adjustment, which I never touched in 6 years). The preload adjustment is just for play in the hub. Too much preload, then yes, it restricts the bearings from rolling over the cones.

Road riders seek to find efficiencies where ever they can down to the bearings, to tires, though some of the old guard still insist on 22-23mm tires.

What do pro-riders have to do with this? The rules of road cycling are modeled off of pro riders.

Well - what I remember about the CR reviews on these bikes was that this was in the late 80s before non-adjustable cartridge bearings kind of took off. My first hub with cartridge bearings was a 28 hole Mavic (I don't believe they sell hubs any more that aren't part of complete wheel) that I never ended up building. Now I did build my own wheel out of a 32-hole Record hub and MA2 rims, but that was for recreational riding. That hub was beautiful, but had the worst dust cap design in history. It required a special tool to remove. It could always be pried open with a screwdriver, but since it was aluminum it wasn't such a great idea. It require this tool, which served no other purpose than to remove dust caps from a hub made for only 3 years.

However, the CR review was for consumer-grade entry-level bikes and it wasn't like they came with Dura-Ace or Record hubs. I read something about their methodology, which was extremely crude and not likely to produce repeatable outcomes. There was just way too much of the human element in just allowing a bike to coast with a human rider to accurately measure. Also - the heavier bikes obviously came out better in this test, even though more weight is obviously not considered a benefit. I recall their top rating went to Lotus, which was a brand that I couldn't find at any local bike shop.

I've dealt with cup and cone bearings. I've rebuilt a few myself, and even threw away wheels after a lack of adjustment meant the cones were severely pitted. Every bike shop I remember at the time would do tune-ups where a bearing adjustment was part of the service.

 

[MCompact]

At least CR is no longer the Bottom- Feeders Gazette like it was up to the mid 80's. Back then they were wringing their hands wondering if a 225 hp Mustang GT was "too powerful." I also remember when they tested a Charger 2.2 and one tester complained that the rumbling exhaust made him "nervous."

 

[nthach]

Originally Posted by UG_Passat

What do pro-riders have to do with this? The rules of road cycling are modeled off of pro riders.

Tech for sure has trickled down from the pro peloton to the hoi polloi - when Shimano introduced Positron shifting to replace friction shifting on box store bikes, it was a flop. When they introduced index shifting into Dura-Ace in the 1980s, it was a hit and naturally Shimano trickled down SIS from Dura-Ace to box store grade Tourney. SRAM was a little bit of the opposite - they introduced Grip Shift at the box store level and it wasn't for SRAM buying out the bike business of Sachs from ZF, they would have languished.

Now, road cycling is starting to borrow tech from mountain bikes(disc brakes, through-axles) and the lines are blurred in gravel/adventure.

CR isn't infallible - they love Samsung appliances and Behr paint. The latter has improved quite a bit but still suffers from colorfastness issues.

 

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by UG_Passat

What do pro-riders have to do with this? The rules of road cycling are modeled off of pro riders.

Tech for sure has trickled down from the pro peloton to the hoi polloi - when Shimano introduced Positron shifting to replace friction shifting on box store bikes, it was a flop. When they introduced index shifting into Dura-Ace in the 1980s, it was a hit and naturally Shimano trickled down SIS from Dura-Ace to box store grade Tourney. SRAM was a little bit of the opposite - they introduced Grip Shift at the box store level and it wasn't for SRAM buying out the bike business of Sachs from ZF, they would have languished.

Now, road cycling is starting to borrow tech from mountain bikes(disc brakes, through-axles) and the lines are blurred in gravel/adventure.

CR isn't infallible - they love Samsung appliances and Behr paint. The latter has improved quite a bit but still suffers from colorfastness issues.

Well - didn't Bob Mionske use Grip Shift to his 4th place finish at the 1988 Olympics road race? At least that's what the Grip Shift ad said. That was back at a time when most bikes were still using downtube shifters, although a lot of basic bikes had stem mounted shifters. I guess he's the "bike attorney" now.

Also - I remember that Rock Shox was already making road forks in the early 90s. Apparently pretty popular for several cobblestone races like Paris-Roubaix.

 

[SubLGT]

Originally Posted by Donald
The summary: best overall was NAPA Legend Performance, good deal for cold climates was Walmart EverStart MAXX, and easy to check battery level was Interstate Mega-Tron Plus. The full review is online.


How did the Odyssey Extreme and Performance batteries test out in 2020?

I came across this poorly written article about CR testing. It says that the $260 Odyssey Performance 65-760 was "rated #1 overall" and the $300 Odyssey Extreme 35-PC1400T was "rated #3 overall". Does not say which battery was rated #2.

 

[UncleDave]

Not surprised Odyssey for the win.

That would mirror my experience as a consumer, a boat manufacturer, and a manufacturer of pet grooming vehicles that depend heavily on inverters.

I've never had better life or performance out any line of batteries.

Theres only one problem with the Odysseys- the price.


UD

 

[benjy]

Consumer Reports stinks looking at nutritional info in an xtra $$$ my sister gets, dont trust other recommendations as well!! as far as batteries johnson controls SOLD out to OVERSEAS, many batteries are just rebranded from the best bider, like OE oils!!