What happened to the 3,000 Mile OCI?

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Originally Posted by DGXR
Yes the quality of oil is much better, plus engines are cleaner and more efficient with tighter tolerances and better combustion sealing, so the oil doesn't get loaded up so quickly. Also, oil filter design has improved a bit since then, with slightly better efficiency and capacity across the board. But, "Not many years ago..." ?? It's been at least 15 years since I saw a normal service OCI less than 5,000 miles.


20 years ago the local Ford and Holden (GM) vehicles in Oz were on a 15,000km (9300 miles) OCI, using whatever oil, but most likely dino. It's definitely not a new thing, and those (now) old Fords and Holdens are still running just fine after hundreds of thousands of kilometres.
 
Originally Posted by Bub
Just looked at the owners manual for my 1998 z28 camaro. It recommended 7500 for non severe service. I believe that it also just specified gm6049m which was satisfied by Dino oils at the time. Hard to believe that was already 20 years ago


My 1999 Camaro SS is totally different....with the identical engine. The oil minder goes off every 3,000 miles (or less) to change the oil....so I basically ignore it. Since I only drive it sparingly, it gets about a 1,000 mile annual OCI. Sort of odd since whenever I drive the car it's 15-20 miles minimum, never short tripped...and driven 80% of the time in summer weather. From my owner's manual:

Your vehicle has an engine oil life monitor. This monitor will show you when to change the engine oil and filter - usually between 3,000 and 7,500 miles since your last oil change. Under severe conditions the indicator may come on before 3,000 miles. Never driver your vehicle more than 7,500 miles or 12 months without an oil and filter change.

It also mentions that it cannot detect dust in the oil. So if you drive in a dusty environment....change it every 3,000 miles. That's probably true even for many of today's SN oils.

But I really "push" my daily driver, 3500-4000 mile OCI's or twice per year regardless of mileage. It also gives a range of 3,000-5000 miles based on type of service. Since I'm a semi-short tripper, I shoot for 3K-4K miles on semi-synthetic oils.
 
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I just moved up to 5K. 5 is a nice round number for my simple brain. Seems to be working pretty good for me. I'm fortunate enough to be able to spend an extra $100/year on my cars. Plus, I really love changing my own oil.
 
Originally Posted by spasm3
Its almost coming back. Due to DI fuel dilution and short trips, i'm limiting my oci on the mazda to 4500.

Except European engines with GDI / TGDI and they still run extended drain intervals past 3K-4.5K
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Originally Posted by StevieC
Originally Posted by spasm3
Its almost coming back. Due to DI fuel dilution and short trips, i'm limiting my oci on the mazda to 4500.

Except European engines with GDI / TGDI and they still run extended drain intervals past 3K-4.5K
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I wonder if they run leaner than the usa. I think to keep nox down, ecm programming may be richer here.
 
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What happened to the 3000 mile oil change? It got buried.

Carburetors, being replaced by stiochiometric achieving fuel injection systems with made the coffin.

Oils made with better base stocks and additives put the lid on the coffin.

Advanced engine designs built using greatly improved materials nailed the coffin shut.

Intelligent oil life monitoring buried the coffin.

There are exceptions of course but the norm is 7500 - 10k OCIs nowadays (as witnessed here on bitog).
 
Quote
What happened to the 3,000 Mile OCI?

Hyundai added 750 miles and called it severe service.
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Now they could put an Oil Life Monitor on their vehicles but that would reduce trips to the dealership.
 
BITOG is what happened, among other things.

Year after year, UOA after UOA finally put the urban myths to a slow death. We now know:

1. Grade matters but not brand.

2. Oil can easily go more than 3,000 miles even under severe service.

3. Oil does not degrade in a linear way. Even the "cheap insurance " argument doesn't hold water.
 
Originally Posted by jimbrewer

3. Oil does not degrade in a linear way. Even the "cheap insurance " argument doesn't hold water.

"Cheap insurance" isn't even all that cheap any more. Back when I started changing my own oil, a typical brand name motor oil like Pennzoil yellow bottle was around $1/quart at an auto parts store. Now today the equivalent is more than $4 depending on where, although 5 quart jugs are more common than they were in the early 90s. It's definitely the case that the price has outpaced inflation. But for that price I'd hope it's better and can last longer.

Certainly a lot of discussion here has been that engines are far better at avoiding contaminating the oil. And the oil is obviously asked to do more in certain ways - especially modern thin oil. But I don't know of any carmakers recommending going longer intervals with newer oil, although some have backdated thinner oil to older models.
 
Originally Posted by WobblyElvis
By the 70's most North American cars manufacturers recommended a 6 - 7,500 mile OCIs.

Were the engines in the 70's really ok with 6-7k OCI with conventional oil? Still had lead in gas (the pumps were around, and once you gutted the cat you were all set), carbs and old school motors.

Originally Posted by y_p_w

"Cheap insurance" isn't even all that cheap any more. Back when I started changing my own oil, a typical brand name motor oil like Pennzoil yellow bottle was around $1/quart at an auto parts store. Now today the equivalent is more than $4 depending on where, although 5 quart jugs are more common than they were in the early 90s. It's definitely the case that the price has outpaced inflation. But for that price I'd hope it's better and can last longer.

When did you start changing oil? Curious.
https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/
2019: $4.00 This becomes:
2010: $3.47
2000: $2.74
1990: $2.08
1980: $1.31
1970: $0.62
1960: $0.47

So if you could buy oil for $1/qt in 1990 then yes, motor oil has outpaced inflation (although arguably the oil is "better" today and can do longer OCI's).

I'm starting to do more 5k OCI's. My '99 Camry was reputed to be "hard on oil" and none of my fleet is all that young these days. Cheap Supertech oil and rotate the tires at the same time. The vehicles that seem to come up with the most miles on here were taxis run on cheap bulk with "frequent" changes, although we don't know if they'd have gone just as far with "long" OCI going by just that observation.
 
When I first joined this site a very common saying was 5k miles is the new 3k mile oci, even with conventional. Generally speaking I've heeded that as minimum oci. Also, now using mostly using closed out and rebated synthetic oil, all the more reason to go 5k+ miles. I will say reading some comments recently, seems like for some 3k miles even using synthetic oil is the norm or viewed as ok. I have no intention of following that practice.
 
Originally Posted by supton
Originally Posted by WobblyElvis
By the 70's most North American cars manufacturers recommended a 6 - 7,500 mile OCIs.

Were the engines in the 70's really ok with 6-7k OCI with conventional oil? Still had lead in gas (the pumps were around, and once you gutted the cat you were all set), carbs and old school motors.

Originally Posted by y_p_w

"Cheap insurance" isn't even all that cheap any more. Back when I started changing my own oil, a typical brand name motor oil like Pennzoil yellow bottle was around $1/quart at an auto parts store. Now today the equivalent is more than $4 depending on where, although 5 quart jugs are more common than they were in the early 90s. It's definitely the case that the price has outpaced inflation. But for that price I'd hope it's better and can last longer.

When did you start changing oil? Curious.
https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/
2019: $4.00 This becomes:
2010: $3.47
2000: $2.74
1990: $2.08
1980: $1.31
1970: $0.62
1960: $0.47

So if you could buy oil for $1/qt in 1990 then yes, motor oil has outpaced inflation (although arguably the oil is "better" today and can do longer OCI's).

I'm starting to do more 5k OCI's. My '99 Camry was reputed to be "hard on oil" and none of my fleet is all that young these days. Cheap Supertech oil and rotate the tires at the same time. The vehicles that seem to come up with the most miles on here were taxis run on cheap bulk with "frequent" changes, although we don't know if they'd have gone just as far with "long" OCI going by just that observation.

Might have been around 1992 that I attempted my first oil change. I had my first car in 1995 and the oil was never changed by anyone but myself.

Of course a lot of pricing was extremely variable depending on where you got it. But even around 1995 one could typically find a reputable "conventional" oil brand such as Pennzoil yellow bottle for less than $1. For some reason Chevron Supreme was the low price leader. A friend claimed that since it was so cheap they must cut corners somewhere. I said it was probably because they didn't spend money marketing it like Pennzoil or Castrol.
 
Originally Posted by Donald
I will bet Jiffy Lube still says 3000 OCI.

Then you lose that bet. Pay up.
 
Ford was using 6000 mile oil change intervals in the 60s.

Random R&T tests from 1969: Volvo 164, BMW 2500 and newly introduced Maverick: 6000 miles.

R&T 1981: Renault 18i 4000 miles, Dodge Aries, 7500

Car [UK] 1973 : Fiat 132, Fiat 128, 6000

1965 Lincoln owner's manual : 6000 miles

63 Valiant, 4000

65 Chevrolet 6000

78 Malibu, full size Chevrolet, 84 Ford Tempo 7500

AMC 1967 4000, 71 Gremlin, 6000.

I don't know if that was optimistic marketing, but oil change intervals every 6 months or 6000 miles have been around a long time.
 
The whole 3000 miles under any conditions has really been more a marketing thing. A shop that I otherwise trust has recommended 3000 miles for a long time as "cheap insurance". Jiffy Lube, car dealers, and motor oil manufacturers have been touting 3000 miles for a while. I guess the oddest recommendation was when Mobil was selling different motor oils as 5000/7500/etc motor oils with a "warranty". But if you read the fine print they were saying that they would warranty it for 5000 mile oil changes under any conditions, and that their engine warranty would be valid if the manufacturer's recommendations were followed for "normal" driving conditions or when recommended by an OLM.

7500 miles for "normal" service was the recommendation since at least the 80s for most cars.

I remember stuff like a Pennzoil commercial showing a large pickup truck being used as a spotting vehicle for wide loads. The owners claimed that they had it last due to 3000 mile oil changes for hundreds of thousands of miles. But under those conditions where they're operating it all day with few start stop cycles and not a lot of hard acceleration, it's actually pretty easy on the motor oil.
 
I change the oil in everything (except the whole house generator) every 6 months or 5K miles whichever comes first. For the Jeep and BMW, that is between 4K-5K miles. For the Scat Pack it is about 1K miles. Don't subscribe to the theory that early oil changes harm your engine. Don't believe in saving pennies on oil with my expensive machinery. 89 cars and trucks in the last 50 years. Never an oil related engine problem of any kind.
 
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