Photos of Truck Tire Treads

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Originally Posted by spasm3
We got 14 inches of snow today. I have about 1/4 mile of snow covered gravel drive to get to the main road in the morning. Freezing rain now. Will see how the 1/2 worn Grabber HTS does in this. Really wishing i had the Grabber all terrains.



Well they did very well. I was not sure since they are 1/2 worn and are the older grabber hts. But they gripped well and handled well. 14 inches of snow, so I may stick with the HTS next go round.
 
Originally Posted by maxdustington
Motomasters are made in China ain't they? Michys seem to be divisive on this board.

Get the Generals
02.gif
ONE OF US, ONE OF US!


No, not necessarily. The Motomaster brand has been made by many different manufacturers.

I have the APL tires in the picture, used as trailer tires on my fifth wheel. They are made in the USA by Cooper. Most if not all their LT tires seem to be made by Cooper, and they seem to get good reviews.

To the OP, I would look at Cooper Discoverer AT3. They came on the truck I bought second had, and even though they appear close to the treadwear bars, they still have amazing traction in all conditions from dry pavement, to standing water, to light snow. I have not used them at all in true winter conditions so I can't comment on how they would do there.
 
How do the all terrain tires do in light snow as compared to highway treads. For example the grabber hts vs the grabber atx. I know the ATX would be better in mud, but how about snow?
 
Originally Posted by spasm3
How do the all terrain tires do in light snow as compared to highway treads. For example the grabber hts vs the grabber atx. I know the ATX would be better in mud, but how about snow?


As a general rule, the better the mud traction, the better the snow traction.

Think of it like this: What we are talking about is the viscosity of water. The more viscous, the more the "paddle wheel effect". The range is from more or less water or something fairly solid.

From a tire designer's point of view, it is edges that count. Each edge is like a paddle wheel - and the more the better. - EXCEPT - Part of the traction is because of the ability of the tire to penetrate down to a higher friction surface. That's why it is recommended that people use tall and narrow tires for the winter. That, of course, stops when the tire begins to float on the mud/snow. So there is a compromise to be made between widely spaced lugs and small biting edges - and snow tires tend to go with the edges.
 
Question for CapriRacer....

How much of tread design is "Engineering" vs "Marketing". Just knowing how stuff works in the manufacturing world, I'd imagine the marketing folks probably have a pretty strong hand in the tire appearance, depending on the segment of the market they are targeting. After all, consumers in the market for a performance tire (for example) want a tire that looks like a cool "performance" tire, and not grandmas all-season passenger car tire tread, even if the "grandma" tread performs.
 
Originally Posted by novadude
Question for CapriRacer....

How much of tread design is "Engineering" vs "Marketing". Just knowing how stuff works in the manufacturing world, I'd imagine the marketing folks probably have a pretty strong hand in the tire appearance, depending on the segment of the market they are targeting. After all, consumers in the market for a performance tire (for example) want a tire that looks like a cool "performance" tire, and not grandmas all-season passenger car tire tread, even if the "grandma" tread performs.


Let me describe the process:

When marketing says its time for an update on a particular tire line, the first step is to get the artistic folks to draw up possible tread patterns. The engineers will give them design limitations, such as the amount of edges, the width of the grooves, or whatever parameters they've figured out result in the properties they want. The result is usually much more pleasing than what the engineers would have designed.

Then there are a series of meetings with the marketing folks to sort out what works for them and what doesn't. Usually it's 2 or 3 meetings.

Please note that these meetings also discuss the performance targets - wet traction, dry traction, snow traction, ride and handling, rolling resistance etc. At the end of those meetings, a prime candidate is selected - and sometimes more than one.

If there is some conflict about what works and what doesn't, the engineering folks can always have a blank tire hand cut. Sometimes this is just for display to get a feel for the overall affect - and sometimes they will do testing on hand cut samples. The problem with hand cut samples is that they always look better than production, and their actual performance is either worse or better depending on which test is being performed. Snow traction is always better on hand cut tires, because the edges are sharper.


If everyone is in agreement about the overall pattern, then the molds are order, test tires made and the testing begins. There will be periodic meetings with marketing where the test results are shared and any thing unexpected is discussed. There was this one time where the snow traction was sooooo good, it required a retest. I won't bore you with the details, but if you look at the bottom of the grooves of some tires, you may notice ridges and those are there because of that.

Please note that I have described the process inside one company, but since my experience working with Ford resulted in pretty much the same procedure, I assume every tire manufacturer does something similar.

So it isn't that the marketing folks rule - or the engineers rule. These things are compromises and the question is what compromise works best - and the marketing folks generally have the best feel for what is needed.
 
Originally Posted by CapriRacer
Originally Posted by spasm3
How do the all terrain tires do in light snow as compared to highway treads. For example the grabber hts vs the grabber atx. I know the ATX would be better in mud, but how about snow?


As a general rule, the better the mud traction, the better the snow traction.

Think of it like this: What we are talking about is the viscosity of water. The more viscous, the more the "paddle wheel effect". The range is from more or less water or something fairly solid.

From a tire designer's point of view, it is edges that count. Each edge is like a paddle wheel - and the more the better. - EXCEPT - Part of the traction is because of the ability of the tire to penetrate down to a higher friction surface. That's why it is recommended that people use tall and narrow tires for the winter. That, of course, stops when the tire begins to float on the mud/snow. So there is a compromise to be made between widely spaced lugs and small biting edges - and snow tires tend to go with the edges.


This sounds very wrong...offhand, many mud tires have little or no siping. You WANT a tire to "pack up" in snow...not so much in mud.
 
CapriRacer… Thanks! I figured the marketing folks had to provide the design criteria based on what segment of the market they are targeting (performance, cost, etc). I wasn't sure how much of the tread design was based on appearance and buyer perception vs strict performance characteristics. I suspected that it wasn't all left to Engineering through, as most Engineers I've worked with are not always focused on the "artistic" side of design. Left to their own devices, I suspect Engineering could likely come up with a good performing tread design that might not look appealing to the buyer.

EDIT: I will also add that somebody should tell the marketing folks that less is more when it comes to sidewall design. Seems like every new tire has all kinds of goofy patterns, serrations, etc all over the sidewall. There is a simple elegance in a clean sidewall like on the 50 year old Goodyear Polyglas tires (Blackwall, white stripe, red line, or white letter). Even the blackwall Goodyear Eagle GT and Gatorback tires of the 1980s had a clean look. I hate billboard raised blackwall lettering and weird designs, but many have gone that way.
 
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Originally Posted by dogememe
Originally Posted by Black_Thunder
2 guys i work with recently both got sets of Falken Wildpeak AT's for their trucks and say they are a very quiet running tire and have a nice tread design

I've been eyeballing those Falkens for my Silverado. Glad to read some good experiences!




Falken tires in general seem to be getting more and more popular and the pricing is decent.



My Uncle has a set of the MT's on his pickup and really nice looking aggressive tire that is easily compared to bigger brand tires. don't know how loud they are


If I ever get another set of tires for my pickup I may look into the Falken's

I have a set of cooper ST's on it right now and as i don't drive my pickup a lot they are lasting awhile etc, but they are a bit noisy which has never really bothered me as i usually have the radio up a bit etc.
 
If I hadn't got a free set of Sumitomos I would have chosen Falken Wildpeak AT3s great price and nothing but good reviews.
 
Originally Posted by Imp4
Choosing tires based on how the tread looks is a fool's errand.
So much more goes into tire construction and, by extension, overall performance.

There are quite a few (semi) dependable tire review sites out there (Tire rack, Consumer Reports, etc....).

Whatever information you get from those places will be orders of magnitude more dependable than some intetwebs poster that says 'They worked well on my '08 F150!!!'.

Good luck!
cheers3.gif


Also, choosing a tire based solely on someone's opinion.
 
Originally Posted by CapriRacer
Originally Posted by novadude
Question for CapriRacer....

How much of tread design is "Engineering" vs "Marketing". Just knowing how stuff works in the manufacturing world, I'd imagine the marketing folks probably have a pretty strong hand in the tire appearance, depending on the segment of the market they are targeting. After all, consumers in the market for a performance tire (for example) want a tire that looks like a cool "performance" tire, and not grandmas all-season passenger car tire tread, even if the "grandma" tread performs.


There was this one time where the snow traction was sooooo good, it required a retest. I won't bore you with the details, but if you look at the bottom of the grooves of some tires, you may notice ridges and those are there because of that.



I know the ridges you're talking about. Do they just add more edges/"paddles" to a tire in what would otherwise be unused space, and do they really make that big a difference?
 
Originally Posted by dogememe
If I hadn't got a free set of Sumitomos I would have chosen Falken Wildpeak AT3s great price and nothing but good reviews.


Fun fact, Sumitomo actually produces the Falken brand.
 
Originally Posted by cheesepuffs
Originally Posted by CapriRacer
Originally Posted by novadude
Question for CapriRacer....

How much of tread design is "Engineering" vs "Marketing". Just knowing how stuff works in the manufacturing world, I'd imagine the marketing folks probably have a pretty strong hand in the tire appearance, depending on the segment of the market they are targeting. After all, consumers in the market for a performance tire (for example) want a tire that looks like a cool "performance" tire, and not grandmas all-season passenger car tire tread, even if the "grandma" tread performs.


There was this one time where the snow traction was sooooo good, it required a retest. I won't bore you with the details, but if you look at the bottom of the grooves of some tires, you may notice ridges and those are there because of that.



I know the ridges you're talking about. Do they just add more edges/"paddles" to a tire in what would otherwise be unused space, and do they really make that big a difference?


It was enough that the engineers wondered if the test results were somehow screwed up. They retested, then noticed the ridges, then conducted some research to verify - and voila, ridges became a thing!
 
Originally Posted by Jarlaxle

This sounds very wrong...offhand, many mud tires have little or no siping. You WANT a tire to "pack up" in snow...not so much in mud.


What's funny are the plow trucks around here running around on mud tires. They could do better. Maybe all the extra weight in front helps them crash through to pavement (transiting from job to job) regardless of how good the tires actually are.
 
So you actually do want a snow tire to pack up with snow? Is this because the snow packed in the tire is supposed to grip the snow over the road? And then the deep tread depth and often times directional V patterns of snow tires I assume are more for slush and wet traction instead of deep snow traction?
 
Originally Posted by cheesepuffs
So you actually do want a snow tire to pack up with snow? Is this because the snow packed in the tire is supposed to grip the snow over the road? And then the deep tread depth and often times directional V patterns of snow tires I assume are more for slush and wet traction instead of deep snow traction?



Would like to know also.
 
It's the snowball effect. Also take note, that usually a good highway tire will get better snow/ice traction than the knobbiest of AT tires. Maybe trying to claw through 2 feet of snow, a mud tire might work better, but that's about it.
 
www.tiresize.com

I bought 3 sets of winter tires this fall.

2016 GMC 2500 work truck; 265/70/17 Toyo CT
2013 GMC 1500 SLT 275/60/20 Nitto EXO studded
2018 Chev 3500 HC; 275/65/20 Nitto EXO

On 3rd winter; 2011 2500 GMC SLE 6.6;
275/65/20 Hankook RW-11
 
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