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Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: demarpaint] #4941221
12/02/18 06:10 AM
12/02/18 06:10 AM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,464
Minnesota
philipp10 Offline
philipp10  Offline
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,464
Minnesota
Originally Posted by demarpaint
Originally Posted by philipp10
Originally Posted by Chris142
The last couple times we bought a vehicle the dealer would not move from the sticker price.

DO what I have done. First do some research on the internet. Once you know what you should be paying, haggle through email or the phone to multiple dealers. Since you are not sitting in front of them, all their old tricks won't work. Trust me, they will haggle if they want a chance to be in the sale.


That's pretty much what I do for a new vehicle purchase. I found dealing with the internet manager is the best way to go. Most of the time they'll push to get you into the store. I politely let them know that will only happen after we cut a deal and I'm ready to come in to sign the buyers order and leave a deposit. If they don't play that way I move on to someone that will. That method gets good results.

yeah the worse thing you can do is come in and then they start all the BS....."I have to talk to my sales manager" type of thing. What a joke.

Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941230
12/02/18 06:30 AM
12/02/18 06:30 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,057
Buffalo, NY
JTK Online content
JTK  Online Content
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 11,057
Buffalo, NY
Chris, I hear you. They're mega chain dealers around me. You can browse many of their lots and not have someone approach you at all.

You can start a negotiating process, walk away and never hear from them.

It would be rare to not get them to move some off of MSRP, but like said, that totally depends on supply and demand.

I've done the email thing lots of times, dating back to around 1999-2000. Today you have to be careful with that because they can quote you a great price and then tack dealer fees onto the deal after you drive all the way there.

I know you can go the "out the door" price. You still have to know and understand all the line item costs and know what you are willing to pay for each. You have to shop around to know them.


2017 Ram 1500 4x4, 3.6L. 2016 Nissan Quest SV (Babe magnet IV)
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Skippy722] #4941235
12/02/18 06:40 AM
12/02/18 06:40 AM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 722
Central Oklahoma
tony1679 Offline
tony1679  Offline
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 722
Central Oklahoma
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Traded the Durango in for our 2016 300 at Carmax. So much less stress than any dealership. I’ll probably stick with them for car buying.

Also tried leasing a 2016 Charger SXT at one point. What an absolutely aggravating experience that was. Ended up walking away from that... sales guy said “we don’t haggle here at all” and I knew that they did. That was the last time I ever stepped foot on one.
Am I the only one confused by this?

Wants to stick with Carmax for no-haggle pricing (which is a rip-off, Carmax is ALWAYS higher on every vehicle I've ever looked at, even prior to any negotiation elsewhere), yet was upset with no-haggle somewhere else. shrug


'16 Hyundai Elantra 1.8L 77k
'08 Chevy Impala SS 5.3L 132k (Tuned- AFM is EVIL!)
Original GM tranny still laying rubber.thankyou
\/SP & WIX FTW
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: tony1679] #4941260
12/02/18 07:46 AM
12/02/18 07:46 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 42,464
New Jersey
JHZR2 Offline
JHZR2  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 42,464
New Jersey
Originally Posted by tony1679
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Traded the Durango in for our 2016 300 at Carmax. So much less stress than any dealership. I’ll probably stick with them for car buying.

Also tried leasing a 2016 Charger SXT at one point. What an absolutely aggravating experience that was. Ended up walking away from that... sales guy said “we don’t haggle here at all” and I knew that they did. That was the last time I ever stepped foot on one.
Am I the only one confused by this?

Wants to stick with Carmax for no-haggle pricing (which is a rip-off, Carmax is ALWAYS higher on every vehicle I've ever looked at, even prior to any negotiation elsewhere), yet was upset with no-haggle somewhere else. shrug


I was going to say; carmax is the worst for pricing.

Some tactics Ive observed are:
- regional sales group fees - non-negotiable fees to a regional group of some sort, which they can't remove and must be paid to them. Supposedly all dealers in an area pay them so you can't escape.
- dealer prep pack, usually window etching and wheel locks and such stuff, which they give a retail price, and since they're already installed on all cars as they come in, they're tough to remove, best that can be done is negotiate them down.

All of this is why it's critical to negotiate an out the door price that's appropriate. They can allocate costs however they wish, all you really care is what you're paying in full. They could sell the car for $1 and the Adonis for tens of thousands for all I care, so long as the out the door price is right.

Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941278
12/02/18 08:08 AM
12/02/18 08:08 AM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,313
Nashville, TN via Memphis
john_pifer Offline
john_pifer  Offline
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,313
Nashville, TN via Memphis
Bid it out.

Start sending out e-mails to every dealer you can find who has what you're looking for. State that you're in the market for that vehicle and that you're going to buy it from whoever gives you the best deal. When comparing price, be sure you're comparing apples to apples.

Don't be afraid to ask them to remove the doc fee - that is pure profit for them. Also, if it's out of town, don't be afraid to ask them to deliver at no extra charge. In fact, buying from out of town is often the easiest. Negotiation handled via phone/text/email, then they just send the paperwork with the delivery driver for you to sign.

Another thing - if you're financing, join a credit union. That will often be your best rate (unless getting 0% or other extremely low rate from a manufacturer's in-house bank). I got 1.99% @ 72 mos. from a local credit union when I bought my new 2016 WRX back in March 2016.


16 WRX - PPPP
07 Tacoma V6 - M1 EP 5W-30, Fram Ultra, 10K OCIs, 198K
07 Yamaha R1 - Rotella T6 5W-40, Bosch 3300
07 Yamaha YZ-250, Klotz, Rotella

Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: john_pifer] #4941282
12/02/18 08:12 AM
12/02/18 08:12 AM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,607
San Rafael, CA
dogememe Offline
dogememe  Offline
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 1,607
San Rafael, CA
Originally Posted by john_pifer


Another thing - if you're financing, join a credit union. That will often be your best rate (unless getting 0% or other extremely low rate from a manufacturer's in-house bank). I got 1.99% @ 72 mos. from a local credit union when I bought my new 2016 WRX back in March 2016.


Yup, my credit union financed my Escape at 5.9% when everyone else either straight up wouldn't finance me. I think one other lender was willing to do it at 29%.


2010 Ford Escape 2.5 ~92K Miles: RP 5W-30, AMSOIL SS FE ATF.
1995 Chevy Silverado 5.7 ~277K Miles: Delo 10W-30, AMSOIL OE MV ATF.
AMSOIL in EVERYTHING!
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941307
12/02/18 08:29 AM
12/02/18 08:29 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,357
in the shop
sw99 Offline
sw99  Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,357
in the shop
Got 18% off MSRP sticker price on the subi and 15% off my previous Ram.


2016 Nissan Versa S 1.6L
2018 Subaru Outback 2.5i
2019 Ford F250 6.7L CCSB

Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941327
12/02/18 08:46 AM
12/02/18 08:46 AM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 573
Denver
marine65 Online content
marine65  Online Content
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 573
Denver
5 years ago the wife needed a new used car.
After 3 weeks of visiting dealer lots when they were closed and her not finding a car she liked we found the 2010 Elantra.
I had gotten to the point of just find a car and buy it.
It was a no haggle dealer.
I checked the price on the net and it was smack in the middle of comparable Elantras.
Some were a 1K higher and some 1K lower.
We found the car on Sunday and drove it home Monday at 5:30.
At that point the money was less of a concern than lets get this over.
Buying a car to me is like buying a sweater,just find what you like and get it done.

I never understood people looking to buy a new car for 30K or more walking away for a couple hundred.
If a couple hundred means that much maybe you should take the bus.


2006 Nissan Sentra 200K miles. How far will it go ?
2018 Hyundai Elantra GT
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941509
12/02/18 11:17 AM
12/02/18 11:17 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 954
Los Gatos, CA
JeffKeryk Online content
JeffKeryk  Online Content
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 954
Los Gatos, CA
Last February we were in the market for a Lexus RX450h. The 2018s were trickling onto the lots; dealers were closing out the 2017s.
Silicon Valley is the #1 market for Lexus. There are at least 5 dealers within 50 miles. Within 100 miles, even more.
I emailed each dealer and told them what I wanted and that I was doing the same with each dealer.
They were all close to each other, with the winner being almost 10% off MSRP which was really good because new year models do not get late-year discounts...
It kinda helped that I had an in with Putnam Lexus in Redwood City.
When I was about to pull the trigger, Stevens Creek Lexus offered me an slightly better deal, but I wanted to be true to my word.
We went with Putnam and bought another (used) car a few months later.

Another suggestion is to use Costco; get their price so you at least have a starting point.
Good luck.


2018 Tesla Model 3, Medium Range Battery
2018 Lexus RX450h
2013 Lexus GS350 F Sport
2006 Acura TSX
2001 Tundra Access Cab, 1998 Accord LX, 1968 Corvette L36 Roadster, 1965 Olds 4-4-2
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941514
12/02/18 11:20 AM
12/02/18 11:20 AM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,253
PNW/WA
JOD Offline
JOD  Offline
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,253
PNW/WA
As others have said, it really depends on the car. If you're buying any sedan, hatchback or wagon, you can probably get a deal just based on how the market is trending.

Funny thing about the internet/online sales manager vs. going into the dealer. Having bought my last couple of cars online remotely, I would have agreed with this thought--until my dealer experience... I had an offer from a remote dealer on an Alltrack via the interwebs, about 5K off of list. Seemed like a solid deal, though I hadn't actually driven the car yet (I knew I wanted a manual transmission wagon, and there aren't a lot of options out there). I went into a local dealer with no intentions of buying a car; I just wanted to drive it before I hopped on a plane to pick up the other car. The dealer did ALL of the typical car dealer nonsense, "what can we do to get you in this car today", talking to his manager--me walking out of the dealership and him chasing me down, etc... I ended up walking out with an Alltrack SE at 20% off of list, with no stupid add ons I didn't want.

I guess the moral of the story is that if you're walking into a dealer, your best negotiating position is not really wanting to buy a car there... Clearly in this case the dealer was more interested in moving inventory that making a profit on the sale--for whatever reason. In this instance, the gueling dealer visit ended up being worth it.

Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941532
12/02/18 11:36 AM
12/02/18 11:36 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,308
The Garden State
Whimsey Offline
Whimsey  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,308
The Garden State
From the same Ford dealer I purchased new a 1989 F-150, 1996 Contour and a 2002 F-150. I used Consumer Reports paid service to get the dealer invoice cost and offered the dealer $200 over this. These I ordered so the dealer got to keep the total 3% hold back. Could I have gotten a slightly better deal with haggling, maybe. BUT other dealers were not up front and played all sorts of games, such as claiming the factory incentives did not apply to their selling offer. it was easier and more pleasurable to do it my way. Both the dealer and I were "happy" in the end, without the aggravation of haggling. It may have cost a bit more but both sides made out fairly and I got extra "warranty" service even though it had expired. This was worth the little extra I might have paid for the vehicles. My wife bought a new Explorer in January of 2017. She used the "internet sales department" at 2 of the dealers to get pricing. At both dealers when she went in person she was handed off to a sales rep who said what ever the internet sales person told you was not valid. Needless to say those conversation did not last long LOL. She bought from a dealer who told her the up front cost of the vehicle, not just the monthly financing costs, and she got ALL of the Ford rebates, even the one for being an EMT. The price was fair for both parties.

Whimsey

Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941535
12/02/18 11:39 AM
12/02/18 11:39 AM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,466
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 7,466
Waco, TX
I don't know how to make this not sound sexist.....

But I know two women that bought their cars with pretty much NO NEGOTIATION AT ALL.

A lot of women are making a lot of money nowadays....

and I think their "No haggle" negotiating "tactics" are ruining it for the rest of us.


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Chris142] #4941546
12/02/18 11:44 AM
12/02/18 11:44 AM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 6,983
...
PimTac Offline
PimTac  Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 6,983
...
A lot of people go in to dealerships blind. With all the resources on the interwebs today you should be able to get a decent price.

Some makes and models are selling so well that dealers probably have a floor and they won’t go below that.


Cannot see signatures any longer so it doesn’t matter.
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: tony1679] #4941819
12/02/18 04:56 PM
12/02/18 04:56 PM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 178
Northern Indiana
Skippy722 Offline
Skippy722  Offline
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 178
Northern Indiana
Originally Posted by tony1679
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Traded the Durango in for our 2016 300 at Carmax. So much less stress than any dealership. I’ll probably stick with them for car buying.

Also tried leasing a 2016 Charger SXT at one point. What an absolutely aggravating experience that was. Ended up walking away from that... sales guy said “we don’t haggle here at all” and I knew that they did. That was the last time I ever stepped foot on one.
Am I the only one confused by this?

Wants to stick with Carmax for no-haggle pricing (which is a rip-off, Carmax is ALWAYS higher on every vehicle I've ever looked at, even prior to any negotiation elsewhere), yet was upset with no-haggle somewhere else. shrug


For the dealer that said it was no haggle, it actually was and still is. Had friends buy cars after that and haggled their way down. That sales guy no longer works there.


Paid 23k towards the beginning of the year for my 300 at Carmax. At the time they were 26+ at all the dealers. Just looked up the fair purchase price on KBB and it’s 19-20k now for the same 300. Sometimes you can find a perfectly fair deal on a car there, but you have to know what you’re looking for. Could I have gotten one cheaper or with fewer miles elsewhere? Definitely. Would it have taken more time I’d rather spend elsewhere? Yep.

Last edited by Skippy722; 12/02/18 05:03 PM.

2016 Chrysler 300S v6
2012 Dodge Caliber SXT
Re: Are dealers getting away from price haggling? [Re: Linctex] #4942247
12/03/18 04:09 AM
12/03/18 04:09 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,183
West Chester, PA
artbuc Offline
artbuc  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,183
West Chester, PA
Originally Posted by Linctex
I don't know how to make this not sound sexist.....

But I know two women that bought their cars with pretty much NO NEGOTIATION AT ALL.

A lot of women are making a lot of money nowadays....

and I think their "No haggle" negotiating "tactics" are ruining it for the rest of us.


Don’t worry. It doesn’t sound sexist at all, just stupid.

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