Everstart MAXX 65s vs 65n

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Need a battery and Walmart seems to have the best deal locally. The group number is 65, but now I find there's a 65S and a 65N (which is listed as out of stock). The "S" means "south" according to some postings I've seen, but don't know whether I believe that, seems more likely it's just more cheaply made, maybe Mexico vs US? They're both the same retail price. The 65S has lower CCA (700) than the 65N (850). I'm definitely located in the south, batteries here don't last much beyond three years. So why would I want a battery with lower CCA? I'm pretty sure that 700 is lower than the original Motorcraft battery it will be replacing.
 
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It has to do with plate thickness.
I never can remember which is which, but once plate thickness gives better CCA, but does not last as long in hot conditions. The other last longer in hot conditions, but has a little lower CCA (but in hotter climates, a high CCA is not needed as much).

Let me read back up on it.
 
not plate thickness but lower specific gravity.
lower acid concentration.
less grid corrosion in your high temp area.
lower cca not a problem in a warm climate.
 
Thinner plates mean more plates means higher CCA but less resistance to heat. Suitable for North.

Thicker plates mean fewer plates means lower CCA but more resistance to heat. Suitable for South.
 
Yes cca is Cold cranking amps. Not much of a problem in the south. You just need to trust that they have done the math to provide a decent battery that will make its warranty period reliably. You are shopping for the "best deal" so you cant expect tip top quality but you wont get trash either or WM will straighten that out with their suppliers.
 
I go for the largest battery that will physically fit, with the lowest CCA that covers my vehicles specification.
 
The hotter the electrolyte, the more it eats the plates. Every 10 degrees C doubles the rate at which the electrolyte chews up the plates

N and S designations have absolutely nothing to do with plate thickness, it is about the density of the specific gravity.

A battery meant for cold climates might have a fully charged specific gravity of 1.300, and a battery meant for hot climates might have a full charge specific gravity of 1.265. The exact numbers are not important, the density of the electrolyte meant for a cold climate is higher than that intended for a hot one.

Do not confuse specific gravity with voltage, I did not screw up the placement of the decimal point.

Likewise a battery that is low on water but is still above the plates, if fully charged, will have a higher specific gravity reading than one which was recently topped off with distilled water, and fully charged. It will also read a higher rested voltage and perform slightly better, holding higher voltage under loads.

How many of you have noticed a battery seemingly beahving poorly, to find low water levels, then fill it back up, to have the battery jump off the cliff soon after? Filling it up reduced the strength of the likely already weak electrolyte on the likely already sulfated battery and then it performed worse.

The recently topped up battery would perform worse on an actual Load test for CCA than it would when its electrolye level was just above the plates.

People in hot climates wanting to extend their battery longevity would not only keep it fully charged, but would top the battery off with distilled water to lower the acid concentration slightly so that the hot sulfuric acid does not chew on the plates as rapidly.

Note that does not mean filling the battery cells to overflowing. There are some arms which hang down into each cell, Fill to within 1/8" of these arms, when the battery is already fully charged. Do not fill it to there on an undercharged battery then try and fully charge it, as then it will likely spew some electrolyte from the caps, which then refilled to the proper level would have less dense electrolyte..

Care should be taken so than nothing other than distilled water enters the cells. Any debris entering the cells, is not good, and with recessed caps it is hard to actually get water in them without introducing any debris into them. It is hard to even clear the debris away from the openings without some Q tips some care and patience.

Wearclothes you do not care about when opening the cell caps, and use eye protection.

I do not think there is any topic more misunderstood on automotive forums, by otherwise wise mechanics or the maintenance minded bitoger, than the lead acid battery and its requirements for reaching near its maximum expected lifespan. Lesser lifespans seem to be acceptable, and the actual sticker on the battery is somehow more important to the consumer, that the actual treatment of the battery, which wants to be fully charged always, and kept cool.

Batteries with removeable caps require a hydrometer to actually indicate full charge, not a floating ball type. A smart charger's green light is a liar, which would be proved by the hydrometer, if one were actually ever employed by those with ultimate confidence in their smart charger and its marketing literature or those who think the vehicle and its 165 amp alternator are the alpha and omega physics defying battery charging god..

Do not assume your vehicle's charging system is actually holding your battery at full charge. it takes no less than 3.5 hours to charge a relatively healthy battery from 80% to 100% and that is with a charging source holding voltages in the mid 14 range for those 3.5 hours, which few if any vehicles will allow. An Unhealthy battery takes longer, and perhaps much much longer.

Once can deplete a 100% charged battery to 80% in a few minutes of blasting their stereo with the engine off, but getting that battery to a true 100% state of charge, is likely not going to occur with a 4 hour highway drive.

Proveable, time and again, with a hydrometer. But nobody will ever bother to use one. They will just abuse a battery by keeping it in a well undercharged state and complain about battery quality when it fails in a short period of time.
 
Thank you wrcsixeight for explaining the difference between the North/south batteries within a same size group.

A related question: What about battery quality/construction differences between low and high cca in the same battery size group that don't have north/south designations? If I have a situation (small engine-few electronics) that operates well in my given climate at a lower OEM CCA (i.e., 540cca), is the "gold" (i.e., 700cca) battery in the same size class maybe not a better choice, opposite of what marketing claims? In this instance, are there fewer/thicker plates in the smaller cca battery that might make it last longer than the larger cca battery with more, but thinner plates?
 
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There is also plate porosity as an influncer of CCA numbers

Actual Plate number and thickness are pretty much unknown, as manufacturers do not list these specs, and we do not have a bunch of anal Bitog freaks opening up battery cases to count plates, like we do with filters and pleats and their spacing. No core charges on Oil filters.

Comparing 2 same size batteries, I would buy the heavier one, if they were the same weight I would buy the cheaper one, even if the more expensive one had a much better warranty. The heavier one could certainly have less CCA indicating denser and or thicker plates which are more durable over time. I would choose the cheaper one as I can and will directly influence battery longevity by achieving an actual full charge, and would never expect to exercise any warranty on a defect free battery, and a defective batttery will make itself know early on in the warranty

If one had the option of buying S or N designations of the same size battery, well personal choice. One could buy the N designated one which migght be 1.310 specific gravity, and use the bulb on a hydrometer to remove some electrolyte, and store it somewhere safe, and fill with distilled h20 and lower the specific gravity and make a S battery with SG of 1.265 when fully charged. Nearer the end of the battery life when the battery needs watering, if it needs watering, that stronger electrolyte removed can be used to milk some more performance from it in its final days/months.



As far as CCA ratings go, I am not aware of any body which goes around testing that the numbers on the stickers match up to real life carbon pile tests and issues alerts on batteries not living up to their specs. It Seems to be an honor system and there is no honor in the max profit mentality which has become the golden rule.

The truly anal battery buyer would walk into retailers with their bathroom scale, along with their voltmeter which can indicate the freser battery, as the stickers on the batteries indicating date of manufacture, are only stickers which can be peeled off cleanly with a fingernail. Figuring out the date code if heat stamped into the casing somewhere might not be obvious or easily deceiphered.

There are lots of maintenance free sealed flooded batteries out there. These use a higher percentage of calcium in the plates and are expected to fail before they ever run low on water. These are very poor performers when they are cycled, and today's vehicle's high parasitic loads, on a rarely driven vehicle, is cycling the battery.

Maintenance free calcium flooded sealed batteries which are drained below 75% state of charge should be charged at higher voltages and held at those voltages until amperage tapers to a very low figure. Basically impossible to achieve with smart chargers as most simply turn on an egg timer once the charger gets the battery to the mid 14's. They will hold the battery at mid 14's for X amount of time, and their X, is a guess. A compromise.

X changes depending on battery temperature, health, capacity, and smart charger's algorithms, since they are not asking the battery capacity to make a well educated guess as to how long to hold absorption voltage based on amperage accepted, are guessing.

They rely on the green light and the fact that humans love to see a green light, and as such, the battery hot off the charger, is likely not truly 100% charged, and while 98% charged is good, it is only half as good as getting the battery to 100%, in terms of keeping the plates sulfation free for as long as possible
 
Interesting info in this thread. I did not know about the different specific gravity between N and S batteries.

Originally Posted by wrcsixeight
...

The truly anal battery buyer would walk into retailers with their bathroom scale, along with their voltmeter which can indicate the freser battery, as the stickers on the batteries indicating date of manufacture, are only stickers which can be peeled off cleanly with a fingernail.
...


Last 3 batteries I bought I did bring in a volt meter and found the one with the highest charge on it.
Walmart did not care, the guys at Advance Auto looked at me weird, but let me do it anyway (battery was ordered online, went to pick it up and told the guy I wanted to check it, and it was @ 12.5v, so I told him I was going to go check the others on the rack for a better one).
If buying a battery in Walmart, just grab one of their scales in the housewares area and bring it to the automotive department. There always seems to be an open scale at my store (maybe somebody is weighing the batteries???).
 
Just thought I'd jump in to let you know Sam's Club has $20 off auto batteries right now - you could probably get a group 65 for around $80 - $85.53 at my local club vs $93.75 for the everstart Maxx.
 
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