Motomaster Formula 1 Synthetic 5W-30 new baseline

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Check the lot numbers and see if they match.

Even if they don't, if it were my car I would still get rid of it. I would bring this up with CT too. Also, check if there is a number to call for Motomaster. They might be interested in the analysis you had done.
 
Yes, I checked lot numbers. I have 2 bottles with same lot number.

Not sure how much I trust AGAT if they wouldn't have advised me this ASAP.

I have to think that AGAT made a mistake, But they should have informed me immediately if they determine that the additives are not right.

The lot # of the jug I sent in is MS4A037/21/1705:34 11036242 C521 07/APR/17
The bulk of the oil in engine is the same except 5:09 instead of 5:34

I guess I might send the used oil analysis from next change into both Fluidlife, & AGAT, & see how they compare.

I cant go sending baseline samples away from each oil change, to ensure that I am getting what I purchased, I have to trust Shell/ Canadian Tire has a Quality Control in place that would prevent this from hitting the shelf if that's the case.

I am about 100 kilometers away from when I have been sending last 2 samples, so I guess I send one more.

I have contacted Canadian Tire, Shell, & AGAT.

I hope there is a mistake on AGAT or I opened up a can of worms for someone in Quality Control somewhere.
 
Originally Posted by Garak
Originally Posted by cdlamb
Is it at least a good conventional oil?

The most realistic possibilities are that the product in the jug isn't what was claimed, or the testing results were messed up with something else, or there are serious typos on their report, or their testing is totally out of calibration somewhere. If this testing is correct, no, it's not a good conventional oil, either. If the results are correct, this oil is not suitable for use. If the PQIA came across this in their testing, they'd be flagging it for sure.

So, we have no idea what happened. If it were me, I'd submit a sample from the same bottle to another lab, not to mention have the product retested by the people who did this. I'd also bring it up with Canadian Tire. It could be from Shell, but could be a Citgo product, too; even a Castrol one. Didn't the lab indicate that if this is motor oil, that something is wrong?


Well according to the OP's photo. it looks like F1 made by Shell. With Shell's high standards, I'm thinking the test was improperly conducted.

Contacting CT may or may not be helpful.
 
Originally Posted by newbe46
Originally Posted by sir1900
TBN embarrassingly low for a Full Synthetic.


What is the TBN for an "entry level" full synthetic, e.g. PP or Mobil 1?

I've always wanted to try Motomaster Synthetic.


Pennzoil and Mobil 1's TBN is north of 8. Even Pennzoil's conventional is higher than 8.

Check PQIA. There is a plethora of information.

www.pqiamerica.com
 
Originally Posted by PimTac
Check the lot numbers and see if they match.

Even if they don't, if it were my car I would still get rid of it. I would bring this up with CT too. Also, check if there is a number to call for Motomaster. They might be interested in the analysis you had done.


Motomaster is Canadian Tire stores house brand of products

yes, I contacted Canadian Tire, Shell, AGAT, and PQIA, giving them lot #'s
 
Originally Posted by cdlamb
Originally Posted by PimTac
Check the lot numbers and see if they match.

Even if they don't, if it were my car I would still get rid of it. I would bring this up with CT too. Also, check if there is a number to call for Motomaster. They might be interested in the analysis you had done.


Motomaster is Canadian Tire stores house brand of products

yes, I contacted Canadian Tire, Shell, AGAT, and PQIA, giving them lot #'s


Thanks for posting this up and doing the VOA. Like someone else mentioned, I was also curious about using this oil but shied away from it thinking it was likely less stellar than most oils out there. Glad I stuck with my instincts.
 
I ran this kind of oil out to 14,800 miles and the UOA was very good with 16 ppm of iron and life left in the oil. Shell doesn't make bad oil but then nothing is perfect and mistakes happen. My money is on a poor analysis if the virgin sample. If it proves to be the actual oil is defective, it will be interesting to see what they do about. Perhaps a recall/public notice? Shell cannot have their name associated with something that can damage your engine. Will they lawyer up and squash this?
 
Originally Posted by StevieC
A lot of labs aren't properly calibrated as I found out from Terry. I sent him a sample, Blackstone, Wear Check, and Toromont-Cat and Blackstone was far out from Wear Check which was similar to Toromont-Cat but was still out. Terry's was identical to Wear Check.

Terry told me his lab he uses in Ohio recalibrates before any of his samples are processed and they use tighter specs with the equipment they have versus Blackstone. I don't remember what it is but there is two ways to do lab testing on oil samples and one is more expensive but a lot more accurate versus the other which is the one Blackstone uses.

Now I'm not cutting up Blackstone because they give you a really good idea with pretty good accuracy and their price is decent, but this is more to prove my point that the lab you used might be wildly out of calibration and not realize it although from those numbers it should be obvious to them.



This makes me wonder... some of us don't just take the recommended OCI by the manufacturers, we go steps further to get UOA over a period of time and the point of this is to see how good any oil performs and to determine the OCI on our own. If the labs don't calibrate their tools properly, where should we go from there?
 
The way to confirm would be to send a sample to another lab.

This has been a very interesting discussion. I hope the op gets to the bottom of things and keeps us apprised.
 
Originally Posted by cdlamb
How do I post a PDF file of the AGAT oil test?

I submitted sample straight from the oil jug.

Could Canadian Tire be purchasing fake oil, not from Shell Canada, but in its packaging?

Maybe something wrong with AGAT testing methods?



I can hardly find any bottles of that shape anymore. They are more the round handles like this:

http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/motomaster-formula-1-synthetic-motor-oil-5-l-0288712p.html#srp

I am sure the formulation is different in these new bottles.
 
I can hardly find any bottles of that shape anymore. They are more the round handles like this:

http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/motomaster-formula-1-synthetic-motor-oil-5-l-0288712p.html#srp

I am sure the formulation is different in these new bottles.

I am not sure they would change the formulation, when they change the packaging. The MSDS indicates Nov 2011 as original formulation, with updates to MSDS every 4 years to keep the date stamp current.

This is what I purchased off the store shelf in Lloydminster AB, within last couple of months.

& yes, I have been getting email concerns from Shell, and Canadian Tire, will keep everyone posted with what I end up doing, and results.
 
There was some confusion with this sample!

An AGAT technician called me, & let me know that there was an error.

They apparently got 2 samples mixed up doing the data entry. They ran a Petro Canada hydraulic oil sample for another customer, the same day, & somehow things got messed up. They are doing some sort of internal investigation / Incident reporting, as well as refunding my test fee's.

They still have the original sample, & ran new tests.

Once I get the correct results I will update, & hopefully an admin can remove the false test reports.
 
Originally Posted by cdlamb

I can hardly find any bottles of that shape anymore. They are more the round handles like this:

http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/motomaster-formula-1-synthetic-motor-oil-5-l-0288712p.html#srp

I am sure the formulation is different in these new bottles.

I am not sure they would change the formulation, when they change the packaging. The MSDS indicates Nov 2011 as original formulation, with updates to MSDS every 4 years to keep the date stamp current.

This is what I purchased off the store shelf in Lloydminster AB, within last couple of months.

& yes, I have been getting email concerns from Shell, and Canadian Tire, will keep everyone posted with what I end up doing, and results.



The jug you bought in Lloyd is the old formulation. The most current version of F1 is made by CITGO.

Canadian Tire changed suppliers approximately one year ago. I assume with a lower population in Lloyd relative to larger cities, there are still some older Shell-made F1s on the shelves.
 
Originally Posted by cdlamb
There was some confusion with this sample!

An AGAT technician called me, & let me know that there was an error.

They apparently got 2 samples mixed up doing the data entry. They ran a Petro Canada hydraulic oil sample for another customer, the same day, & somehow things got messed up. They are doing some sort of internal investigation / Incident reporting, as well as refunding my test fee's.

They still have the original sample, & ran new tests.

Once I get the correct results I will update, & hopefully an admin can remove the false test reports.





That is good news and the lab is being upfront. Good customer service on their part.
 
Quote
The jug you bought in Lloyd is the old formulation. The most current version of F1 is made by CITGO.

Canadian Tire changed suppliers approximately one year ago. I assume with a lower population in Lloyd relative to larger cities, there are still some older Shell-made F1s on the shelves.



I think the new citigo formulation is European Formula. I am sure they are still making the synthetic 5W-30.
Cant find a newer Safety Data Sheet
 
Yes, I was in Canadian Tire store today to purchase a new jug of oil. couldnt find the same as what i am using, so next oil change will be a blend of some sort.


They have the Dexo's licensed oil, as well as the syn formula 1 5W-30.

Looks like they are both manufactured in USA, where my old jug says Canada.

too bad Canadian Tire is sourcing this out of country.

Might start using Petro Canada oils.

has anyone done new oil analysis on Petro Canada Synthetic 5W-30?

i like the info on PQIAmerica.com but hard to search by brand or oil weight.
 
Just go for the Pennzoil Platinum or Quaker State Ultimate....its right next to the Motomaster and regularly (almost monthly) on sale for the same price.
 
These are supposed to be the new specs on the sample I provided of new unused oil.

I was going to send another baseline sample into another lab to compare the results between 2 labs, but since I cant seem to buy the same Shell manufactured oil anymore, its probably not worth wasting time to verify accuracy between labs for 3.5 liters of oil.

will possibly send 2 samples from my next 2500 mile oil change, into 2 different labs, to see how closely results match.

Visc, TAN, & TBN never changed.


Aluminum-------0
Chromium------0
Copper----------0
Iron---------------0
Tin----------------0
Lead-------------0
Silicon----------0
Molybdenum---178
Nickel------------0
Silver------------0
Potasium-------0
Sodium---------0
Boron----------81
Barium---------0
Calcium--------2170
Magnesium---5
Maganese-----0
Phosphorous--658
Zinc-------------1002
Visc 40 C------61.1
Visc 100 C----10.3
TAN-------------1.48
TBN-------------6.1
 
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