Alonso is out
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Highly likely Indy if McLaren can field a car as well as WEC.
wemay
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Indy and Endurance racing. The writing's been on the wall.
He's getting a fair amount of plaudits, but a few people, Massa and Brundle included, have pointed to his shortcomings.
Originally Posted By: Garak
He's getting a fair amount of plaudits, but a few people, Massa and Brundle included, have pointed to his shortcomings.
Massa's take on Alonso's shortcomings:
Quote:
First, Felipe Massa, his team-mate for four of his five years at Ferrari, who has also partnered seven-time world champion Michael Schumacher.
The German won, give or take, three times as many races and titles as Alonso, and yet Massa thinks Alonso was better "because although Michael was at the top, and an amazing driver, I had an easier time with him - I suffered more with Fernando than I did with Michael."
Of Alonso, Massa says: "First of all, he is an amazing driver. His talent is very complete. He is one of the quickest drivers, but also one of the most consistent, most aggressive. He has everything.
"He is able to use the car in the best way, so he is very intelligent. He is able to understand the race pretty well, everything that is happening. He knows how to use his best in a particular moment."
He really ripped into him!
He's getting a fair amount of plaudits, but a few people, Massa and Brundle included, have pointed to his shortcomings.
Massa's take on Alonso's shortcomings:
Quote:
First, Felipe Massa, his team-mate for four of his five years at Ferrari, who has also partnered seven-time world champion Michael Schumacher.
The German won, give or take, three times as many races and titles as Alonso, and yet Massa thinks Alonso was better "because although Michael was at the top, and an amazing driver, I had an easier time with him - I suffered more with Fernando than I did with Michael."
Of Alonso, Massa says: "First of all, he is an amazing driver. His talent is very complete. He is one of the quickest drivers, but also one of the most consistent, most aggressive. He has everything.
"He is able to use the car in the best way, so he is very intelligent. He is able to understand the race pretty well, everything that is happening. He knows how to use his best in a particular moment."
He really ripped into him!
Originally Posted By: weasley
He really ripped into him!
Here's the rest of it, from Autosport:
Originally Posted By: Autosport
However, in the same interview he said Alonso would end up "splitting the team in half" and "could have achieved much more" without this.
From Martin Brundle:
Originally Posted By: Autosport
"Needed somebody stronger than him around to control the destructive moments which prevented him being first choice for any team, but not sure such a person exists."
There's not a lot of denial of his talent. When the chips are down, though, look out. Like I said, a change in scenery would be good for him, but he made his own bed to the point that the only change of scenery possible is another motorsport. Despite what he's doing and saying now, take a look at it objectively. For the last two plus seasons, he's been selling himself on the team radio left and right, making sure anyone who'd listen was aware of his attempt to wring as much out of the car as he can, and how it was Honda's fault, and then someone else's. So, no one's going to convince me he wouldn't have been interested in driving for a championship contending team.
Red Bull technically has room but no interest, and Horner said as much. Ferrari may have room coming up, but we all saw that he burned those bridges ages ago. Mercedes did have room, since Bottas had an expired contract and they could have let him go elsewhere, and brought in Alonso to pair up with Hamilton. Alonso couldn't handle pairing with Hamilton when Hamilton was a rookie, much less after three more championships and in a team that Lewis has set up around himself, insofar as he can. Also notice that in the end it didn't matter; Bottas got another contract and no one asked Alonso.
He really ripped into him!
Here's the rest of it, from Autosport:
Originally Posted By: Autosport
However, in the same interview he said Alonso would end up "splitting the team in half" and "could have achieved much more" without this.
From Martin Brundle:
Originally Posted By: Autosport
"Needed somebody stronger than him around to control the destructive moments which prevented him being first choice for any team, but not sure such a person exists."
There's not a lot of denial of his talent. When the chips are down, though, look out. Like I said, a change in scenery would be good for him, but he made his own bed to the point that the only change of scenery possible is another motorsport. Despite what he's doing and saying now, take a look at it objectively. For the last two plus seasons, he's been selling himself on the team radio left and right, making sure anyone who'd listen was aware of his attempt to wring as much out of the car as he can, and how it was Honda's fault, and then someone else's. So, no one's going to convince me he wouldn't have been interested in driving for a championship contending team.
Red Bull technically has room but no interest, and Horner said as much. Ferrari may have room coming up, but we all saw that he burned those bridges ages ago. Mercedes did have room, since Bottas had an expired contract and they could have let him go elsewhere, and brought in Alonso to pair up with Hamilton. Alonso couldn't handle pairing with Hamilton when Hamilton was a rookie, much less after three more championships and in a team that Lewis has set up around himself, insofar as he can. Also notice that in the end it didn't matter; Bottas got another contract and no one asked Alonso.
Not at all surprising given the uncompetitiveness of his F1 team for years now compared to the instant success and adulation he received at Indy. Who wouldn’t prefer the latter?
Oh, absolutely. I understand him wanting to switch. However, if he wants to know the reason he's not welcome at any competitive team in F1, he merely has to look in the mirror. Alonso has done something pretty amazing. He's made possibly the greatest current talent in F1 not desirable by any top team in F1.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Oh, absolutely. I understand him wanting to switch. However, if he wants to know the reason he's not welcome at any competitive team in F1, he merely has to look in the mirror. Alonso has done something pretty amazing. He's made possibly the greatest current talent in F1 not desirable by any top team in F1.
Yeah, that seems crazy to me, as I'd think his performance on track would be worth a bit drama, but all the top teams have 1 top driver, and even the Verstappen/Ricciardo pairing produced some stray carbon fibre...
I would have thought he could go to Renault for equal money as Ricciardo, and those two could push and respect each other, to have the team overtake redbull in results, even if the renault is slower.
Oh, absolutely. I understand him wanting to switch. However, if he wants to know the reason he's not welcome at any competitive team in F1, he merely has to look in the mirror. Alonso has done something pretty amazing. He's made possibly the greatest current talent in F1 not desirable by any top team in F1.
Yeah, that seems crazy to me, as I'd think his performance on track would be worth a bit drama, but all the top teams have 1 top driver, and even the Verstappen/Ricciardo pairing produced some stray carbon fibre...
I would have thought he could go to Renault for equal money as Ricciardo, and those two could push and respect each other, to have the team overtake redbull in results, even if the renault is slower.
As a driver in his twilight years, I agree that he does have some talent and raw speed. I remember he is always the faster one in qualifying and scoring more points within a team, except Hamilton took him head on.
Comparing to Kimi who has just lost a bit of spark as he ages, Massa more or less the same but he was bound by the speed of the Williams. Given a winning car I’m sure he can dominate. I bet he must have said to himself “had I not left Ferrari”, where would he be now?
Comparing to Kimi who has just lost a bit of spark as he ages, Massa more or less the same but he was bound by the speed of the Williams. Given a winning car I’m sure he can dominate. I bet he must have said to himself “had I not left Ferrari”, where would he be now?
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Yeah, that seems crazy to me, as I'd think his performance on track would be worth a bit drama, but all the top teams have 1 top driver, and even the Verstappen/Ricciardo pairing produced some stray carbon fibre...
Don't get me wrong. I'd have enjoyed the drama, and he can certainly drive. The teams clearly didn't think the talent outweighed the drama, though. Renault, as a works team, does have potential. They don't need their lead driver badmouthing them every race, though, either.
Alonso was again decrying the predictability of the racing in F1. Again, I'm going to point out that despite this predictability, he sure can't predict for whom to drive.
newbe46: I don't doubt there's some thinking of what might have been, had he not left Ferrari. Watch McLaren take a magic jump somehow next year.
Yeah, that seems crazy to me, as I'd think his performance on track would be worth a bit drama, but all the top teams have 1 top driver, and even the Verstappen/Ricciardo pairing produced some stray carbon fibre...
Don't get me wrong. I'd have enjoyed the drama, and he can certainly drive. The teams clearly didn't think the talent outweighed the drama, though. Renault, as a works team, does have potential. They don't need their lead driver badmouthing them every race, though, either.
Alonso was again decrying the predictability of the racing in F1. Again, I'm going to point out that despite this predictability, he sure can't predict for whom to drive.
newbe46: I don't doubt there's some thinking of what might have been, had he not left Ferrari. Watch McLaren take a magic jump somehow next year.
I'm surprised he doesn't bad mouth them more. He's been patient enough, long enough. Especially when you consider that McLaren has been a totally unreliable, slow, POS ever since he signed with them 4 years ago. With the budget that team has, how long is the guy supposed to wait? It would appear they couldn't deliver a roll of toilet paper that would tear evenly at the perforations.
I can't blame his impatience, but what would he have done if he was at Sauber, or worse in some respects, Williams?
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