Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body. As a born pessimist I wonder if Asian Alumni are less generous than others with gifts and bequests??? The Ivy League colleges live on money from Alumni.
Harvard being sued for discriminating against Asian students
- Thread starter redbone3
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School acceptance criteria based on any type of ethnicity, religion, or skin color needs to be 100% outlawed and banned in the US. A student's ability to be accepted into a selective school should be 100% about your achievements, leadership, and grades/test scores and not your racial or ethnic background or income level, or religion (or lack thereof).
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It's purely skin colour, it has nothing to do with donations. When I was in university I was friends with a few black students. One friend of mine told me she would never use her ethnicity as a ticket to post graduate studies, as she wanted to get there on her own merits. Another guy I knew told he selected every box he could (I think he was part Native Indian or something, too) because he wanted to be as competitive as possible.
All in the name of equality.
All in the name of equality.
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
You kinda missed the point. Harvard is discriminating against Asian students because they have higher grades and better scores. If race is not considered in admissions there would be a higher percentage of Asian students admitted than expected by their percentage of the population. That much is fact. My hypothesis is that Harvard is considering the success of getting money out of their alumni, and just maybe, extracting money from Asian alumni is less successful than it is on others.
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
You kinda missed the point. Harvard is discriminating against Asian students because they have higher grades and better scores. If race is not considered in admissions there would be a higher percentage of Asian students admitted than expected by their percentage of the population. That much is fact. My hypothesis is that Harvard is considering the success of getting money out of their alumni, and just maybe, extracting money from Asian alumni is less successful than it is on others.
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
You kinda missed the point. Harvard is discriminating against Asian students because they have higher grades and better scores. If race is not considered in admissions there would be a higher percentage of Asian students admitted than expected by their percentage of the population. That much is fact. My hypothesis is that Harvard is considering the success of getting money out of their alumni, and just maybe, extracting money from Asian alumni is less successful than it is on others.
A westernized Ivy Leaguer is probably more loose with the lettuce than your typical mainlander, to be fair.
I thought donations were how you secured Ivy League educations for multiple generations of descendants who may or may not get there on their own? You give them a nice chunk of change and they look favorably on your child's application to their school.
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
You kinda missed the point. Harvard is discriminating against Asian students because they have higher grades and better scores. If race is not considered in admissions there would be a higher percentage of Asian students admitted than expected by their percentage of the population. That much is fact. My hypothesis is that Harvard is considering the success of getting money out of their alumni, and just maybe, extracting money from Asian alumni is less successful than it is on others.
A westernized Ivy Leaguer is probably more loose with the lettuce than your typical mainlander, to be fair.
I thought donations were how you secured Ivy League educations for multiple generations of descendants who may or may not get there on their own? You give them a nice chunk of change and they look favorably on your child's application to their school.
IBFTL
I can understand wanting a 'diverse' student body at big universities and I don't think 50 or 60 points on the SATs should be the only deciding factor.
I do, however, have a problem when minorities are hired for desirable civil service (and private sector) JOBS with far lower scores and/or qualifications than white or Asian applicants.
When 'Affirmative Action' began under Nixon, there was no way for minorities (or whites without connections) to get into unions, trades etc...something needed to be done.
But 50 years later it has gotten out of hand....When a woman who is obviously white is claiming to be 'Native American' for the 'benefits'...you know the system has been corrupted.
With the current system, the children of illegals will be given preference over the children and grandchildren of WW2, Korea, and Vietnam vets for jobs, schools etc....based on MELANIN...all in the name of 'diversity'....ridiculous.
I can understand wanting a 'diverse' student body at big universities and I don't think 50 or 60 points on the SATs should be the only deciding factor.
I do, however, have a problem when minorities are hired for desirable civil service (and private sector) JOBS with far lower scores and/or qualifications than white or Asian applicants.
When 'Affirmative Action' began under Nixon, there was no way for minorities (or whites without connections) to get into unions, trades etc...something needed to be done.
But 50 years later it has gotten out of hand....When a woman who is obviously white is claiming to be 'Native American' for the 'benefits'...you know the system has been corrupted.
With the current system, the children of illegals will be given preference over the children and grandchildren of WW2, Korea, and Vietnam vets for jobs, schools etc....based on MELANIN...all in the name of 'diversity'....ridiculous.
I am wondering if this will extend to Nobel Prize. If diversification comes before objective measurable achievement, really what is the point of having something like SAT score?
Originally Posted By: newbe46
I am wondering if this will extend to Nobel Prize. If diversification comes before objective measurable achievement, really what is the point of having something like SAT score?
It's already happened to the Nobel Peace Prize, so I would imagine so. Science/math nerds seem to have a stronger grip on reality, are warmer to contrary opinions and less tolerant of PC culture.
I am wondering if this will extend to Nobel Prize. If diversification comes before objective measurable achievement, really what is the point of having something like SAT score?
It's already happened to the Nobel Peace Prize, so I would imagine so. Science/math nerds seem to have a stronger grip on reality, are warmer to contrary opinions and less tolerant of PC culture.
Originally Posted By: newbe46
I am wondering if this will extend to Nobel Prize. If diversification comes before objective measurable achievement, really what is the point of having something like SAT score?
It already has. One recent president received the Nobel Peace Prize before any accomplishments in office other than being the first member of his race to achieve that office.
I am wondering if this will extend to Nobel Prize. If diversification comes before objective measurable achievement, really what is the point of having something like SAT score?
It already has. One recent president received the Nobel Peace Prize before any accomplishments in office other than being the first member of his race to achieve that office.
Originally Posted By: billt460
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
Pretty much. Asians are highly motivated. The more asians the fewer "Equal Opportunity Students"One would think a university like Harvard would want high achieving students. If I would finish my thoughts the thread would be shut down even quicker than it is going to be.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
Pretty much. Asians are highly motivated. The more asians the fewer "Equal Opportunity Students"One would think a university like Harvard would want high achieving students. If I would finish my thoughts the thread would be shut down even quicker than it is going to be.
because college isn't about learning. If someone is smart enough, they can just use the internet and watch recorded lectures and read books. Access to the knowledge is freerer than ever.
Heck if you want to you can go to just about any university and sit in the back of the room and get a "free" education.
Ill leave it to you to figure out what college really provides, but it may be hard for some to see another perspective.
There's a good freakonomics episode that goes through it, but that is just a starting point
The "asians are cheap" stereotype is dumb argument too if you even think 2 seconds about it.
If it is just about legacy donations, don't you think your stereotypeed smart asians that are good at math and pragmatic and eschewing partying will easily comprehend the pay for admittance scheme and pay to ensure theur kids get in, versus johhny smith who graduated and spending his late 20s partying in new york or taking his kid on ski trips and europe?
Theyre paying for piano lessons and weekend math classes and tutors; education is a blank check for asians and they're going to lock down those donations once their first child is born and have 18years of donations before the application is due.
anyway in before the lock
Heck if you want to you can go to just about any university and sit in the back of the room and get a "free" education.
Ill leave it to you to figure out what college really provides, but it may be hard for some to see another perspective.
There's a good freakonomics episode that goes through it, but that is just a starting point
The "asians are cheap" stereotype is dumb argument too if you even think 2 seconds about it.
If it is just about legacy donations, don't you think your stereotypeed smart asians that are good at math and pragmatic and eschewing partying will easily comprehend the pay for admittance scheme and pay to ensure theur kids get in, versus johhny smith who graduated and spending his late 20s partying in new york or taking his kid on ski trips and europe?
Theyre paying for piano lessons and weekend math classes and tutors; education is a blank check for asians and they're going to lock down those donations once their first child is born and have 18years of donations before the application is due.
anyway in before the lock
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Originally Posted By: raytseng
If someone is smart enough, they can just use the internet and watch recorded lectures and read books.
I can't begin to say how wrong that is...and I'm afraid that in many ways the "Google U" degree is going to be the downfall of our society.
If someone is smart enough, they can just use the internet and watch recorded lectures and read books.
I can't begin to say how wrong that is...and I'm afraid that in many ways the "Google U" degree is going to be the downfall of our society.
Originally Posted By: maxdustington
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
You kinda missed the point. Harvard is discriminating against Asian students because they have higher grades and better scores. If race is not considered in admissions there would be a higher percentage of Asian students admitted than expected by their percentage of the population. That much is fact. My hypothesis is that Harvard is considering the success of getting money out of their alumni, and just maybe, extracting money from Asian alumni is less successful than it is on others.
A westernized Ivy Leaguer is probably more loose with the lettuce than your typical mainlander, to be fair.
I thought donations were how you secured Ivy League educations for multiple generations of descendants who may or may not get there on their own? You give them a nice chunk of change and they look favorably on your child's application to their school.
I don't know if Asian Alumni give more than non Asian alumni. But, I would wager that Harvard and all the other Ivy League colleges have dissected their alumni income in more ways than I could think of.
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Originally Posted By: billt460
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Harvard is being sued for discriminating against Asian students. Harvard claims it's ok because they are seeking a diversified student body.
That's an overweight load of dung if there ever was. It has nothing to do with "diversification". It's because the Asian students are smarter overall. And they are making them look bad. I'll bet they welcome blacks and Hispanics with open arms. They score lower overall academically. None of this is "racist". It's simply a matter of academic fact. And it has been for years. Here you go:
https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/hsts_2009/race_gpa.aspx?tab_id=tab2&subtab_id=Tab_1
You kinda missed the point. Harvard is discriminating against Asian students because they have higher grades and better scores. If race is not considered in admissions there would be a higher percentage of Asian students admitted than expected by their percentage of the population. That much is fact. My hypothesis is that Harvard is considering the success of getting money out of their alumni, and just maybe, extracting money from Asian alumni is less successful than it is on others.
A westernized Ivy Leaguer is probably more loose with the lettuce than your typical mainlander, to be fair.
I thought donations were how you secured Ivy League educations for multiple generations of descendants who may or may not get there on their own? You give them a nice chunk of change and they look favorably on your child's application to their school.
I don't know if Asian Alumni give more than non Asian alumni. But, I would wager that Harvard and all the other Ivy League colleges have dissected their alumni income in more ways than I could think of.
Originally Posted By: bunnspecial
Originally Posted By: raytseng
If someone is smart enough, they can just use the internet and watch recorded lectures and read books.
I can't begin to say how wrong that is...and I'm afraid that in many ways the "Google U" degree is going to be the downfall of our society.
Now you're conflating two different things and a logically different statement with what I said.
People who only get a degree from the Internet is not the same as college (I agree, that's the whole point).
But
If you are arguing you cannot access to the same materials and knowledge except by being a matriculated student in a name brand university like Harvard, or that material can only be provided to paying students by attending Universities such as Harvard; that's the point I disagree with.
That's my whole point too that college is something else more than just the knowledge.
If you are granting admittance by just measuring aptitude for maximizing knowledge, you don't need to go to college.
Originally Posted By: raytseng
If someone is smart enough, they can just use the internet and watch recorded lectures and read books.
I can't begin to say how wrong that is...and I'm afraid that in many ways the "Google U" degree is going to be the downfall of our society.
Now you're conflating two different things and a logically different statement with what I said.
People who only get a degree from the Internet is not the same as college (I agree, that's the whole point).
But
If you are arguing you cannot access to the same materials and knowledge except by being a matriculated student in a name brand university like Harvard, or that material can only be provided to paying students by attending Universities such as Harvard; that's the point I disagree with.
That's my whole point too that college is something else more than just the knowledge.
If you are granting admittance by just measuring aptitude for maximizing knowledge, you don't need to go to college.
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Kestas
Staff member
Is this discrimination against foreign asians only or all asians, including those born in the US?
Harvard being sued doesn't mean they are guilty. No way they said "it's OK because." Someone made that up. All Harvard students have to be high achievers and have high test scores. But as we all know if someone is a top athlete they are free to let them in over another who is not. Once in school all the students must take the same tests and pass the same classes. Students who spend day and night studying to be better than everyone else on tests are not always the most gifted.
Originally Posted By: bunnspecial
Originally Posted By: raytseng
If someone is smart enough, they can just use the internet and watch recorded lectures and read books.
I can't begin to say how wrong that is...and I'm afraid that in many ways the "Google U" degree is going to be the downfall of our society.
I dunno. Before the internet everyone knew someone who had the answer or had experienced whatever. Google just brings myth, legend and folklore to us all the faster. Even if I'm wrong on that, think about this: in the past (or today), how many projects (be it building a house or changing oil) were tackled by people who didn't (don't) know what they are doing? IMO Google changes it but only slightly. Nothing new under the sun and all that.
Originally Posted By: raytseng
If someone is smart enough, they can just use the internet and watch recorded lectures and read books.
I can't begin to say how wrong that is...and I'm afraid that in many ways the "Google U" degree is going to be the downfall of our society.
I dunno. Before the internet everyone knew someone who had the answer or had experienced whatever. Google just brings myth, legend and folklore to us all the faster. Even if I'm wrong on that, think about this: in the past (or today), how many projects (be it building a house or changing oil) were tackled by people who didn't (don't) know what they are doing? IMO Google changes it but only slightly. Nothing new under the sun and all that.
Originally Posted By: Al
Pretty much. Asians are highly motivated. The more asians the fewer "Equal Opportunity Students"One would think a university like Harvard would want high achieving students. If I would finish my thoughts the thread would be shut down even quicker than it is going to be.
I'm from one of the most diverse suburbs of Toronto, I've lived downtown and spend time all over the city. I went to a pretty rough adult HS, before I attended uni. I have never seen a higher population of black kids outside of ethnic enclaves than when I attended Brock University in St. Catharines, Ontario (Niagara). Black students are like gold to universities, they are close to the top of the progressive stack when it comes to victimhood.
The thing that gets me is that the black students who were not athletes were always middle class or higher. There were never any real hood rats like the ones that I remember from my time in Toronto schools. They were totally average and relatable.
Pretty much. Asians are highly motivated. The more asians the fewer "Equal Opportunity Students"One would think a university like Harvard would want high achieving students. If I would finish my thoughts the thread would be shut down even quicker than it is going to be.
I'm from one of the most diverse suburbs of Toronto, I've lived downtown and spend time all over the city. I went to a pretty rough adult HS, before I attended uni. I have never seen a higher population of black kids outside of ethnic enclaves than when I attended Brock University in St. Catharines, Ontario (Niagara). Black students are like gold to universities, they are close to the top of the progressive stack when it comes to victimhood.
The thing that gets me is that the black students who were not athletes were always middle class or higher. There were never any real hood rats like the ones that I remember from my time in Toronto schools. They were totally average and relatable.
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