2013 SUBARU Outback, M1EP 0w20, 14190mi, 74465 tot

[NO2]

2 quarts of M1 AFE were added as top-off oil. This engine is covered under the oil control ring recall, but is not yet burning enough oil to have the rings replaced. Mostly highway miles. Is the excess iron likely to be from rings, and how much longer will they last at this rate (currently using 1Q/5500 mi)? 1Q/4000 mi is the recall threshold.

 

[Patrick0525]

Not to hijack the thread, but that is a lot of Fe. My Toyota V6@74K has about 5-6ppm per 5K miles. It uses 0W-20 PP.

By the way, your Fe ppm level maybe significantly higher since you diluted by adding 1.5 qts.

 

[Phishin]

If you have a "rig problem" .... why are you going 14k miles on an OCI?

You'll likely NEVER get to the magical 1 qt./1k mile requirement. Don't you think this type of OCI only has the potential of creating nasty ring lands?

 

[CharBaby]

*Too many variables in your UOA.
*Maybe 14K miles is too long for your engine.
*Even though you added makeup oil, the iron wear is still too high.
*Could be the Mobil 1!
*We all know that M1 show higher PPM of Fe. I'm not saying M1 is a poor oil at all but, why is that?
*I don't think that 1qt of makeup oil every 5K miles is too much considering the 0W20 synthetic.
*A 5W30 syn may slow that down and a 5W30 dino will probably stop it completely(NO, I'm not saying you need to switch/change).
*I do think that you need to lower your time/mileage on your OCI if Fe is a concern however everything else look OK.

 

[LEADED]

Plus you added 2 Quarts , What are you trying to accomplish with a 0w-20 PCMO ?

 

[JoelB]

Oh boy, here we go with the Mobil conspiracy theorists. If it were my car I'd shorten the OCI considering the high iron and oil consumption. Maybe UOA at 5-7k and see how it looks.

 

[tig1]

The acceptable limits for iron is 150PPM.

 

[buster]

Could be better. Fe is high possibly from elevated Si reading. Oil didn’t thicken at all which is good and TBN is good. TBN probably got a bump from the make up oil. I’d check your air filter and run it again.

 

[CharBaby]

Originally Posted By: JoelB
Oh boy, here we go with the Mobil conspiracy theorists. If it were my car I'd shorten the OCI considering the high iron and oil consumption. Maybe UOA at 5-7k and see how it looks.


Personally, I think there is an proprietary additive in Mobil 1 chemistry package that we are all unaware of that, isn't causing more Fe wear per say but, carrying away more PPM of iron in the oil drain process that is showing up in UOAs. Does anyone agree?

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Personally, I think there is an proprietary additive in Mobil 1 chemistry package that we are all unaware of that, isn't causing more Fe wear per say but, carrying away more PPM of iron in the oil drain process that is showing up in UOAs. Does anyone agree?

That's not possible. Either the iron atoms are there or they aren't, it's not as if other oils are somehow sequestering the iron in the engine or in some compound undetectable in ICP.

 

[Loi]

Try switching to an oil that have more molybdenum. I like Mazda 0w20 with moly for Subarus that require 0w20.

 

[Rand]

FWIW I dont think boxer engines are the greatest to go long intervals in. I'd cut back to 7500 miles or so.

The org. factory interval on the fb25 was 6000, then they went 7500... then back to 6000.

I'd have to see you with a broken timing chain from trying to save some oil.

I think your oil needs to be changed earlier.. getting abit of tbn back from your make-up oil doesn't make it fresh oil.

 

[Whimsey]

Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Originally Posted By: JoelB
Oh boy, here we go with the Mobil conspiracy theorists. If it were my car I'd shorten the OCI considering the high iron and oil consumption. Maybe UOA at 5-7k and see how it looks.


Personally, I think there is an proprietary additive in Mobil 1 chemistry package that we are all unaware of that, isn't causing more Fe wear per say but, carrying away more PPM of iron in the oil drain process that is showing up in UOAs. Does anyone agree?


I could be mistaken but I THOUGHT Molakule mentioned something about this not too long ago in another Mobil 1 post when the subject of iron levels came up again. Could be mistaken though

.

Whimsey

 

[NO2]

The rings on this engine have been recalled due to excessive wear leading to excessive oil consumption. Apparently they were not heat treated properly. Since rings are primarily iron , I assume that that is the source of the excess iron, which is still not extraordinarily high. Even 100ppm is considered 'moderate'.

Isn't M1 EP designed to go 15K miles? TBN of 3.2 would indicate some remaining life in the oil.

1Q/4000mi is the threshold that Subaru considers excessive.

 

[4WD]

Originally Posted By: Whimsey
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Originally Posted By: JoelB
Oh boy, here we go with the Mobil conspiracy theorists. If it were my car I'd shorten the OCI considering the high iron and oil consumption. Maybe UOA at 5-7k and see how it looks.


Personally, I think there is an proprietary additive in Mobil 1 chemistry package that we are all unaware of that, isn't causing more Fe wear per say but, carrying away more PPM of iron in the oil drain process that is showing up in UOAs. Does anyone agree?


I could be mistaken but I THOUGHT Molakule mentioned something about this not too long ago in another Mobil 1 post when the subject of iron levels came up again. Could be mistaken though

.

Whimsey


What about an iron block vs an aluminum block:







Bear in mind in industrial applications the samples are taken with the engine underload and from an oil circulation point … drain pan samples are not accepted …
I’m not about to burn myself to get some ideal sample from a car, PU, or SUV …

 

[CharBaby]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Personally, I think there is an proprietary additive in Mobil 1 chemistry package that we are all unaware of that, isn't causing more Fe wear per say but, carrying away more PPM of iron in the oil drain process that is showing up in UOAs. Does anyone agree?

That's not possible. Either the iron atoms are there or they aren't, it's not as if other oils are somehow sequestering the iron in the engine or in some compound undetectable in ICP.
Originally Posted By: Whimsey
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Originally Posted By: JoelB
Oh boy, here we go with the Mobil conspiracy theorists. If it were my car I'd shorten the OCI considering the high iron and oil consumption. Maybe UOA at 5-7k and see how it looks.


Personally, I think there is an proprietary additive in Mobil 1 chemistry package that we are all unaware of that, isn't causing more Fe wear per say but, carrying away more PPM of iron in the oil drain process that is showing up in UOAs. Does anyone agree?


I could be mistaken but I THOUGHT Molakule mentioned something about this not too long ago in another Mobil 1 post when the subject of iron levels came up again. Could be mistaken though

.

Whimsey


Hmmm, IDK!

 

[mehullica]

You could have the beginning of cylinder wall scoring with high iron. I don’t see chromium being high so it’s possible the rings are ok