Generator change interval

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Originally Posted By: CaspianM
Why such thick oil needed for a small engine? Unnecessary shear stress which creates more friction & rotational drag. Motor oil has gone a long way.
Today the thinnest oil that works is the one to use.


You are out of your element dude. Some of us have actual experience maintaining small engines, in Florida, that run long hours or commercially. I've done thousands of oil changes on small engines in Florida. You tend to notice things when you are actually hands on, working on them day in and day out.

There is nothing wrong with thicker oil in the south, in an air cooled generator, that could run for 24 hours straight out of every 24 hour period. And 7 days straight. Or in my case, in 2004 hurricane season, for 60 days straight. My generator worked perfectly. All my neighbors had blown theirs up after the first week.

Here is some truth bombs for you. Thinner oils consume faster. Thicker oils consume slower.

Yes, technically, 10W30 will keep a generator lubricated. IF you top the oil off at every fuel fill-up and make sure it doesn't get low. And IF you change the oil every 50 hours as the manual requires. Then yes, 10W30 would be fine. But, most people neglect their equipment. Almost no one actually checks their oil 3 times a day (as required), and almost no one changes their oil every two days (as required)

The thicker oils are an insurance policy against neglected maintenance. It last longer in the sump. And resist fuel dilution if you extend the change interval. Period.

I run 15W40 or SAE40 in my generators. And honestly, I dont think you can find a better generator oil in Florida than SAE40. The stuff is robust and doesn't burn off. I always keep a few quarts of SAE40 around.
 
Originally Posted By: bubbatime

Here is some truth bombs for you. Thinner oils consume faster. Thicker oils consume slower.

Yes, technically, 10W30 will keep a generator lubricated. IF you top the oil off at every fuel fill-up and make sure it doesn't get low. And IF you change the oil every 50 hours as the manual requires. Then yes, 10W30 would be fine. But, most people neglect their equipment. Almost no one actually checks their oil 3 times a day (as required), and almost no one changes their oil every two days (as required)

The thicker oils are an insurance policy against neglected maintenance. It last longer in the sump. And resist fuel dilution if you extend the change interval. Period.

I run 15W40 or SAE40 in my generators. And honestly, I dont think you can find a better generator oil in Florida than SAE40. The stuff is robust and doesn't burn off. I always keep a few quarts of SAE40 around.


I see! You use 40 grade believing there is not any better oil but suggest to use 15W-50 as an bannd aid for equipment neglect! Ironic!
I iterated normal temp 30 grade, well above 90-100 40 grade. So how was I out of element? Aren't you doing the same?
I also repeatedly said stick to the manual or common knowledge.

Oil consumption has nothing to do with grade of oil to begin with. Oil consumption occurs as a result of neglect and wear & tear to the equipment.
If you do to change oil and only add or consistently do late change, engines starts to burn the oil due to break down of viscosity and shearing(thinning). If running continuously in overly hi temp, you need to do early change. That is simple.
If 50 grade work for some so hey can neglect their machine more, it is a choice. But a poor choice.

Bottom line is that 50 grade practice is an old timers favorite and spread to other owners.
I always tell my friends always use the thinnest oil that works for you not the thickest.
 
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I always tell my friends always use the thinnest oil that works for you not the thickest.
After a natural disaster when everything is down isn't a good time to be testing how thin you can go. You want oil that you know can handle the worst case scenario with the least attention.
 
So what are you doing in oil forum if worse case scenario is the agenda? And if you know the answer why you keep reading the thread?
 
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Originally Posted By: Kamele0N
Even Loncin LC3500i (your Predator) specifies 10w40 (click on technical details)
smile.gif


http://www.loncinindustries.com/en/engine/ProductDetail.aspx?catid=8-15-17-44-2146789930#proFlag


I don't have the Predator 3500 inverter, if that's really what it is.
 
I was not paying attention to whom I am replying...that forum functions in the way that if you dont specify your reply it replays automatically to the OP...

So please be without hard feelings
smile.gif
 
I have a 5 year old Yamaha inverter that's pushing 1600 hours. Oil change interval is 100 hours and I run a 5/10W30 - 15W40 blend 50-50, usually Rotella. I check the oil level every 25 hours or so. Otherwise it an oil change every 100 hours.
 
Originally Posted By: Cujet

Thousands of thrown rods beg to differ. After the hurricanes, generators were pressed into serious duty...

Imagine my surprise when I measured my lawn mower oil temp at 264 degrees. And that's really only at partial load.

In addition, conventional 10W-30 oil (as recommended in many engines) is consumed at a faster rate. Leading to a situation where the engine can run out of oil when it's refilled during operation.

This is a situation where real world experience counts. My co-workers generator made it 6 hours before the rod perforated the crankcase, yup, you guessed it, 10W-30. He was heating water. Stories like this are rather common.

This prompted me to check the level in my generator, currently filled with T6 5w40. The oil was changed late last summer. Other than an occasional exercise run, it has powered a real load for about two hours last winter at 32 F, and another two hours last weekend at about 80 F. The oil level is good, and the oil looks factory fresh. Barring an extended outage this fall, I think that oil will be staying for another year.
 
After an initial half hour with the provided 10w30 oil from craftstman in a cute bottle, I changed the oil to Shell Rotella 15w40. This went 50 hours. After the 50 hours I changed and again put in Rotella 15w40. Repear over and over, until power restored. If when restored its close to 50, 35 or more, I change it out and rwady for next time.

Who are the clowns running for days straight on end? I think you can shut down for 20 minutes and swap out the oil. I have 6 gallons of Rotella for my generator. Hope and pray for 60 days or change .75-1 quart of oil every 50 hours. I'll change it.
 
Originally Posted By: 93cruiser
Who are the clowns running for days straight on end? I think you can shut down for 20 minutes and swap out the oil. I have 6 gallons of Rotella for my generator. Hope and pray for 60 days or change .75-1 quart of oil every 50 hours. I'll change it.


When we had an ice storm several years back, our power was out for 4 days. My little chonda 3500 chugged away without fail. Of course I didn't run it continuously, it ran for intervals of several hours each. Keep the freezer and fridge stuff cold without having to put stuff outside (lol), occasional Microwave usage, etc. I ran a little Honda 1000 inverter type (incredibly fuel efficient) for lighting.

Worth noting that my house has a gas stove, gas water heater, and the old side of the house has an old radiant-type gas floor furnace.

Since it was cold weather here, I also ran T6 in them without fail. Summer oil is 15w40 here also.
 
It seems like a good point that since the conventional gensets are constantly flailing away at 3600 RPM maybe they need changing more frequently than, for example, lawn mower or snow blower use. Maybe the interval should be expressed on an "engine turns" basis
smile.gif


Seriously, I have a 7000/8750 69671 genset. Seriously, the manual sucks. In a table it says to choose between 10W-30 and 5W-30. In another place, 30 is added to those two. That's not so bad, but in the service interval table there are checks for oil service at monthly or every 20 h of use, every 6 months or 100 h of use, yearly or every 300 h of use, and Every 2 years.

The manual describes a 3 h operational break in period where a heavy load is not to be applied, and "The maintenance break‑in period will last about 20 hours of use. After this period:• Change the engine oil."

I reason that the chart covers the 20 h break in and then they want longer. A check of other similar gensets indicates that 50h is a more reasonable choice but this spot in their chart is unchecked in favor of the others (listed above 100/300...). That seems long so I send a question to their tech people. To their credit, they responded:

Q:Generator model 68530 The MAINTENANCE SCHEDULE for this equipment indicates that I change oil: 1) Monthly or EVERY 20 hours of use 2) Every 6 months or 100 hours of use 3) Yearly or every 300 hours of use Frankly, I don't get it. If I run the genset all day, every day for a week, do I change the oil once or do I change it 5 times?

A:...If you use the generator very often, you would change the oil per the Hour schedule, if you use the generator occasionally, you would use the monthly chart....

I remained perplexed.

Follow-up question:...I understand that part. If I am using the generator often and for long periods, do I change it every 20, 100 or 300 hours?

Follow-up answer: If the generator is run often, the oil would need to be changed every 20 hours as shown in the manual.

This is just perplexing. I gave up. Is there any point to used oil analysis in the case that I have to do a long run?

I got some other useful info from the tech guys. Acceptable spark plugs are not listed in the manual, but they provided this list:

SPARK PLUG: F7TC
GAP: 0.027" TO 0.031"
NGK: BP7ES
CHAMPION: N9YC
BOSCH: W7DC

valve clearance is not in the manual, but they told me: Cold Engine
Intake: 0.10 - 0.15 mm (.004"-.006")
Exhaust: 0.15 - 0.20 mm (.006"-.008")
 
That’s really something.

Originally Posted By: thre_on_da_tre
It seems like a good point that since the conventional gensets are constantly flailing away at 3600 RPM maybe they need changing more frequently than, for example, lawn mower or snow blower use. Maybe the interval should be expressed on an "engine turns" basis
smile.gif


Seriously, I have a 7000/8750 69671 genset. Seriously, the manual sucks. In a table it says to choose between 10W-30 and 5W-30. In another place, 30 is added to those two. That's not so bad, but in the service interval table there are checks for oil service at monthly or every 20 h of use, every 6 months or 100 h of use, yearly or every 300 h of use, and Every 2 years.

The manual describes a 3 h operational break in period where a heavy load is not to be applied, and "The maintenance break‑in period will last about 20 hours of use. After this period:• Change the engine oil."

I reason that the chart covers the 20 h break in and then they want longer. A check of other similar gensets indicates that 50h is a more reasonable choice but this spot in their chart is unchecked in favor of the others (listed above 100/300...). That seems long so I send a question to their tech people. To their credit, they responded:

Q:Generator model 68530 The MAINTENANCE SCHEDULE for this equipment indicates that I change oil: 1) Monthly or EVERY 20 hours of use 2) Every 6 months or 100 hours of use 3) Yearly or every 300 hours of use Frankly, I don't get it. If I run the genset all day, every day for a week, do I change the oil once or do I change it 5 times?

A:...If you use the generator very often, you would change the oil per the Hour schedule, if you use the generator occasionally, you would use the monthly chart....

I remained perplexed.

Follow-up question:...I understand that part. If I am using the generator often and for long periods, do I change it every 20, 100 or 300 hours?

Follow-up answer: If the generator is run often, the oil would need to be changed every 20 hours as shown in the manual.

This is just perplexing. I gave up. Is there any point to used oil analysis in the case that I have to do a long run?

I got some other useful info from the tech guys. Acceptable spark plugs are not listed in the manual, but they provided this list:

SPARK PLUG: F7TC
GAP: 0.027" TO 0.031"
NGK: BP7ES
CHAMPION: N9YC
BOSCH: W7DC

valve clearance is not in the manual, but they told me: Cold Engine
Intake: 0.10 - 0.15 mm (.004"-.006")
Exhaust: 0.15 - 0.20 mm (.006"-.008")
 
I keep GC Castrol 0W-30 in both of our generators for general use for winter to summer temperatures, and stock two quarts of Mobil V twin 20W-50 and two quarts of Mobil 15W-50 for them for use when the temperature is above 80 degree Fahrenheit.
 
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: CaspianM
There is no benefit to thicker oil than what is specified by the manufacturer. Read my post again.
Katerina situation and continuous operation is totally a different topic.


Thousands of thrown rods beg to differ.

After the hurricanes, generators were pressed into serious duty. The weather was hot, the homes and foods deteriorating. People wanted AC, hot water, well pumps, washing machines and all sorts of other things running.

Placing a portable 11HP generator against the garage, and running it at full load heating the water in the water heater, while sitting in noon day sun is a sure fire way to get oil temp over 300 degrees F. And the result is completely predictable.

I lost 2 Honda water pumps this way, using the recommended oil.

Imagine my surprise when I measured my lawn mower oil temp at 264 degrees. And that's really only at partial load.

In addition, it's very likely that under the right conditions, the hot air around the genset is being recycled. The answer is quite simple. M1, 15W-50. Solves the problem completely.

In addition, conventional 10W-30 oil (as recommended in many engines) is consumed at a faster rate. Leading to a situation where the engine can run out of oil when it's refilled during operation.

This is a situation where real world experience counts. My co-workers generator made it 6 hours before the rod perforated the crankcase, yup, you guessed it, 10W-30. He was heating water. Stories like this are rather common.


The only “thicker than 30” in my stash is Delvac 1 5W40 … think I should switch my 389 cc Chonda to that … I feed two full size fridges, a stand up freezer, and a few fans with that gen (off two 20 amp breakers) …
 
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: CaspianM
There is no benefit to thicker oil than what is specified by the manufacturer. Read my post again.
Katerina situation and continuous operation is totally a different topic.


Thousands of thrown rods beg to differ.

After the hurricanes, generators were pressed into serious duty. The weather was hot, the homes and foods deteriorating. People wanted AC, hot water, well pumps, washing machines and all sorts of other things running.

Placing a portable 11HP generator against the garage, and running it at full load heating the water in the water heater, while sitting in noon day sun is a sure fire way to get oil temp over 300 degrees F. And the result is completely predictable.

I lost 2 Honda water pumps this way, using the recommended oil.

Imagine my surprise when I measured my lawn mower oil temp at 264 degrees. And that's really only at partial load.

In addition, it's very likely that under the right conditions, the hot air around the genset is being recycled. The answer is quite simple. M1, 15W-50. Solves the problem completely.

In addition, conventional 10W-30 oil (as recommended in many engines) is consumed at a faster rate. Leading to a situation where the engine can run out of oil when it's refilled during operation.

This is a situation where real world experience counts. My co-workers generator made it 6 hours before the rod perforated the crankcase, yup, you guessed it, 10W-30. He was heating water. Stories like this are rather common.


Since my new generator has a Chonda motor … thought a popular Honda oil would be appropriate

 
Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
I don't think there are ANY air-cooled engines that recommend 0W-20 oil.


Could not help myself … had a half gallon of HDEO leftover … just reused the quart bottle


 
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