Filter Minder naysayers!

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ThunderOne

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I recently posted in a truck forum as an additional to an existing thread, harmlessly saying I installed a filter Minder for my 3.4L Toyota engine. The reasoning for doing so was because of the knowledge I gained from browsing this board and then looking at other sources.

This was immediately followed up with:
"Why did you do this? Filters are cheap, just change it at xx miles"
"Just change it at xx interval"
"Just change it when it looks dirty"
"Just tap it out and blow it out and put it back in"
"This is pointless when filters are cheap"
"How do you know this is even accurate?"
"How do you know this works on normal cars! These were designed for Diesels!"
Etc etc etc

To shut up the people who said "it won't work on passenger cars" I followed that up with a WOT run in 2nd gear with a new filter and it got a reading of h2o. I also said I would change if restriction got to 11-15in/h2o and not at the max. Because obviously the red restriction line WAS designed with diesels in mind.

Then we went around the merry go round of arguments all over again.
I had to kindly, and then as I lost my patience, not so kindly inform them that changing your air filter too early is dumb, if not dumber, for engine longevity as changing your filter too little. It had fallen upon deaf ears.

I told them to go do their own research. It's a $15 part, I'm not sure why everyone feels the need to [not] educate me with their personal opinions. I didn't even know that prematurely changing filters was a thing, until I was researching Napa ProSelect filters and the smart folks on this board were eloquently discussing premature filter replacement and the consequences, something I did not even know about until then. It seems as though the adage of "replace your filter earlier rather than later" has become a bit of an unfounded dogma amongst the automotive community. I fell for it too, right up until I didn't.
 
Do you change it at 11 to 15” total or after initial restriction? I think my Mazda restricted at 8” initially and is up to 11 now. Been there for a while. I haven’t looked to see what it looks like but deriving performance hasn’t changed. My truck has never registered any movement at all from reset.
 
Originally Posted By: E150GT
Do you change it at 11 to 15” total or after initial restriction? I think my Mazda restricted at 8” initially and is up to 11 now. Been there for a while. I haven’t looked to see what it looks like but deriving performance hasn’t changed. My truck has never registered any movement at all from reset.

Considering it read 8" at WOT on a new filter, I may wait until 11 or 15, not sure which yet. Depends how many miles will have elapsed I guess. FWIW the filter minder website says passenger vehicles usually have up to 20in/h20 requirements. I think 15 would be a safe replacement point. If I notice unusual performance issues I will replace earlier and see what it reads at the time of replacement.


"Gasoline engine calibrations can vary depending on the engine size and air cleaner design. Small gas engines (2-5 HP) should usually limit restriction to 3 inches maximum, 6-25 HP should limit filter restriction to 8" maximum, and most gasoline engine powered automobiles 20 inches maximum."
 
Originally Posted By: ThunderOne
Originally Posted By: E150GT
Do you change it at 11 to 15” total or after initial restriction? I think my Mazda restricted at 8” initially and is up to 11 now. Been there for a while. I haven’t looked to see what it looks like but deriving performance hasn’t changed. My truck has never registered any movement at all from reset.

Considering it read 8" at WOT on a new filter, I may wait until 11 or 15, not sure which yet. Depends how many miles will have elapsed I guess. FWIW the filter minder website says passenger vehicles usually have up to 20in/h20 requirements. I think 15 would be a safe replacement point. If I notice unusual performance issues I will replace earlier and see what it reads at the time of replacement.


"Gasoline engine calibrations can vary depending on the engine size and air cleaner design. Small gas engines (2-5 HP) should usually limit restriction to 3 inches maximum, 6-25 HP should limit filter restriction to 8" maximum, and most gasoline engine powered automobiles 20 inches maximum."

I see. I think mine has been in service for about 35k Miles with no degradation to performance yet. I think I’m going to see how long it takes. I know once it gets clogged it does so rapidly so I’ve been keeping an eye on it. I think the filterminde is a neat idea and I really like small improvements to stock cars like this. I originally put a k&n brand one on my car but it only read 10” total and it maxed out with a new filter. I ended up installing that one on the ford. I need to order one for the Buick too as it’s filter is a pain to replace
 
I ftted a DIY water manometer as a combo filter minder/decoker, but it didn't register much restriction until I added extra in the form of a paper towel wrap.

Either there is very little restriction or its under-reading, though its hard to see what there is to go wrong.

Perhaps the IV line I was using as a connection doesn't allow sufficient air flow for it to register actual pressures within the air filter quickly enough.
 
OP/ThunderOne,

blow their mind:
-go to the deals sub-thread: show them you change your oil under $2 per quart
-get an oil filter free on a deal
-get an air filter on a deal
-call them a 3k-er (3k miles oil changer type of thinker....)
-give them the link to synlube
 
Originally Posted By: E150GT

I see. I think mine has been in service for about 35k Miles with no degradation to performance yet. I think I’m going to see how long it takes. I know once it gets clogged it does so rapidly so I’ve been keeping an eye on it. I think the filterminde is a neat idea and I really like small improvements to stock cars like this. I originally put a k&n brand one on my car but it only read 10” total and it maxed out with a new filter. I ended up installing that one on the ford. I need to order one for the Buick too as it’s filter is a pain to replace


yeah that's why I didn't go with the K&N one, the Filter Minder reads just as many measurement intervals, plus a few more. It can't hurt.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Chris142
Blowing them out does not do much really. It will remove the loose stuff. But the stuff stuck in the fibers won't come out.


You don't really want to remove the stuff stuck in the fibres, it's the whole point of not replacing too early (the particles on the outside of the air filter effectively reduce the particle size that can pass through the filter; they essentially act as as filter elements).

The OP is right ... the only reason to replace an air filter is if the CFM flow falls below the engine requirements. All OEM filters pass more CFMs when new than the enginre requires. Pressure drop is an effective way to determine that replacement point.

" ...
I told them to go do their own research.
..."

Some people can't tell the difference between facts and opinions. Facts do change ... it's the essential feature of the Scientific Method ... but a fact cannot be established as such without testing (hundreds, millions, even trillions of times) while it takes only one repeatable instance of it failing to disprove (or modify) it. It's a strong methodology and those that stand are extremely likely to be the truth.

An opinion might be fact-based, but it doesn't have to be, and it doesn't require being validated by repeatable tests.

I'm reminded of a quote usually attributed to John Kenneth Galbraith (an economist often criticized for changing his recommendation for application of economic theory).

" ... When I get new facts, I change my position. What do you do, sir? ..."

People who prefer opinion to fact are unlikely to do much research, as they dislike changing their opinion more than they prefer to be correct.
 
Originally Posted By: Johnny2Bad
People who prefer opinion to fact are unlikely to do much research, as they dislike changing their opinion more than they prefer to be correct.


My opinion was certainly changed after educating myself on engine air filtration. It's sad that some people would rather stick to their opinions... but c'est la vie.
 
The idea of changing a filter when it no longer passes enough air seems extremely basic to me. The Filter-Minder tool sure looks like it'd do the job.

My questions are: How rigorously tested is the Filter-Minder? Are they made with adequate QC?
For example, the spring being off just a bit can render any scale of inches of H20 useless.

Nothing wrong with a cheaper tool if it's accurate and consistent.

...and no, my grandpappy did not have a Marvel Mystery Oil injector fitted to his Edsel.
 
Only the Heavy Duty Filter Manufacturers give the truth about air filter performance and filter changing recommendations. Here is a quote from
"Nanofibers in Filtration Applications in Transportation" by employees of Donaldson Company given in 2001 regarding light duty vehicles.

"Consumers must also make maintenance decisions about air filters in their cars.This user group is relatively unsophisticated in their knowledge of filter maintenance and function. Air filters are perhaps the most easily serviced but least understood parts of a vehicle. Other common replacement parts on a vehicle such as tires, wiper blades, oil and oil filters work best when new. However, this is NOT the case with conventional air filters. Since most (dry) air filters rely on the formation of a dust cake to improve the performance of the filter media, over-servicing can lead to dire consequences from inadequate engine protection."

I have installed many air filter minder indicators and check them by simply sucking on the new gauge before installation. The red sleeve moves easily and holds its reading until manually reset. The rule of thumb for changing light duty air filters is to change at 10 inches of water greater restriction than the initial clean filter reading. The greatest restriction will occur at wide open throttle and near maximum engine speed. My experience is that air filters last far longer than OEM recommendations if vehicles are operated mostly on paved roads.
 
I have them on all my cars except the classics (about a dozen) I run them all to the red, at 25", with no discernible change in power or consumption. I do it because filters get more efficient with use.
My Grand Cherokee just recently got it's second filter (currently at 84,000 km).

Here is a neat controlled test I ran on one of the delivery vans, from day one. It shows clearly that you cannot change a filter by time or km.
stacks-image-255d245.png
 
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