Recommended weight BMW 550i m- Sport

[WatsaDisplayName]

Hi all. first time caller long time listener.

Vehicle - 2008 BMW 500i M-Sport. N62 V8 normally aspirated engine, 75k miles
BMW Recommended - API SM or greater, Castrol 5W-30 or 5W-40. And the ubiquitous LL01.
Fuel Recommended - Top Tier 91 Octane. I can't get 91 octane ethanol free gas around here but I can get 90 octane so I fill with 2/3rds 90 octane ethanol free and 1/3 93 octane ethanol polluted. Gets me 91 Octane and 3% corn.
At the last oil change I sent a sample off to Blackstone and my numbers were much better than norm.
I like to change at least every 5K miles.

The car is new to me but was previously taken very good care of. I assume previous owner ran BMW or Castrol 5W-30.
I'm in central florida, it's flat and rarely if ever freezes - maybe once a year for a few hours. This time of year the daily temp is 75-90 and will only get warmer over the next few months.
Car is my daily driver.
Commute is 20 minutes on mostly highway with light traffic. In the evenings, 35-40 minutes, same highway but stop and go traffic.
I drive easy during the week. Transmission in Drive mode which is the economy mode. But on the weekends a shift to Sport mode and drive quick and fast.

Did I leave anything out?

My question is about weight. I switched to 5W-40 thinking I needed the 40 because of the climate. But I've read that since the motor oil gets to 100 C pretty quick the 40 isn't really necessary solely for climate reasons. And I've also read that the wider the gap between Winter and Hot weights the larger the additive package and thus the smaller the base oil percentage. I see a lot of people running 0W but I've got no need for cold protection. So first is my thinking correct? Might I even consider 10W-30? Oil is free through FCPEuro so as long as they sell it that's what I use. Currently using Ligui Moly Leichtlauf High Tech 5W-40. It meets specs.

My wants are:
1) Protection. Whatever makes engine lasts longer. Particularly valve seals.
2) Performance. If it shaves a tenth of a second off of 0-60 times I'm all for it.
3) If one and two or met then Fuel Economy

What I couldn't care less about:
1) Any tree-hugger concerns.
2) Long Life. I'm changing at 5k miles so I don't need additives to make it longer lasting.

Side question. I assume that I want the highest HTHS I can get. Is that correct considering my concerns?

I'll hang up and listen.

 

[kschachn]

Use any oil that has Longlife-01 certification. Grade is irrelevant as they all meet the same minimum HTHS. Pass by the oils that say they are recommended for LL-01, get one that actually has the cert. After that it won’t make a bit of difference.

An oil that meets the requirements for 0W doesn't provide cold weather "protection", it allows pumpability at very low temperatures. It won't make the oil any better or worse in your climate, you can ignore the "W" rating in your decision.

I don't know why you get it free at FCP Euro but if that ever stops, then Castrol 0W-40 at Walmart is the cheapest choice.

 

[RooflessVW]

As said above: use any oil that is LL01 certified. Grade is more or less irrelevant when shopping LL01. Castrol 0W-40 is the most popular choice and cheap @ Walmart.

FCP Euro's lifetime deal is nice. I'd keep with it and LM 5W-40.

 

[1JZ_E46]

You can have any oil you'd like, as long as it's LL-01. Most of them will have a HTHS between 3.5 and 3.7, with 5W-40 being the highest. I have the same engine (well, the TU version) in my X5, and I didn't like the Liqui-Moly.

You mentioned 10W-30. The only one you should consider is M1 High Mileage, since it is not a thin GF-5 oil (like all the others). I'm actually switching to that oil next OCI, in the hope of keeping seals happy.

Some other things, re N62 (ask me how I know...):
- Cooling system: if you have over 75k miles, you need to replace water pump (recommend HEPU), thermostat, hoses, and expansion tank, at the least. I would look into the "bimmmerfix" coolant pipe stent kit as well (highly recommended).
- Valve stem seals: they will go bad, just a matter of when. Don't be alarmed if you see a puff of smoke out the tailpipes after idling for 5-10 minutes.
- Alternator bracket gasket (also called the oil thermostat gasket if you have an oil cooler): it will spew oil eventually, recommend replacing before it does.
- Valve and timing cover gaskets: these will eventually leak. Usually around 80k miles or so.
- Transmission: recommend replacing the fluid ASAP with new OEM pan (which has an integrated filter). Ford Mercon SP fluid is the same as OEM Lifeguard fluid.

 

[WatsaDisplayName]

Thanx.
I have the transmission fluid replacement kit. I'm just waiting for a chance to do it. I'm considering getting a water pump, thermostat (90 C). and now since you suggested it, the stent so that I have it when I need it. Like I said the car is my daily driver so I can't wait a week for parts. Maybe I'll keep an alternator gasket handy too. I like to just do everything at once when I'm taking things apart. Coincidently I was at a car show this morning and I was admiring some of the fancy aftermarket hoses so I may go that rout.

There's a review on Amazon about replacing the stent ($234)
"It needs to be said, at least on the 2008 550i (that's me), it will take hours to do the sanding of the casting mark. (don't know what that's about)
The whole job took me 10 hours (yikes) but if you know what you are doing it can be less. I am 5'4 and have small hands, if you have large hands, getting the bottom 10mm bolt out is going to be VERY hard. (I've heard about that) You may want to take the crankshaft pulley off, but you may need the 40$ tool to get the AC belt back on, (and that too) and a torx set.
If you only drain the coolant from the radiator drain plug, you will have a much more difficult time. Drain it from the whole engine. ( I agree, based on what I've seen)A good walk-through is on pelicanparts.com under N-62 coolant pump replacement." (yeah Pelican parts has good DIY instructions)

I don't even want to think about valve stems. That's why I'm searching for the best PM for that problem.

But we digress a bit.
My first question is about 0w. If I don't need it for cold weather what do I give up by using it, or 5W for that matter? Again my understanding is that more additives are needed to get that W performance. What's the downside of going to 10W. I'm still operating under the assumption that it's better to have the two numbers closer together.
Also about using 40. Is that number more about engine age than ambient temps?
The other question is about LL01. If that's just about making the oil long life, which I don't need, why worry about it?
I'm all about trusting the Engineers (Engineer myself) but that depends on what requirements they had to meet when choosing oil. My requirements are different. Unless LL01 is and additive package that does something other than make the oil last longer I can ignore it. They had to spec weights that were good for all climates and I'm willing to bet that was more towards Europe and North America not the tropics.

Speaking of snake oil additives LM makes two products: Motor oil saver is supposed to help with rubber/plastic i.e. stem seals and Ceratec which is a ceramic coater. I'm not a believer in additives but there are a lot of people that swear by Motor Saver and claim they are past 200k miles on original valve seals. And Ceratec, I guess there's a sucker born every minute and I'm just that sucker. That's a total 600ml of additives so I'll have to wait until I burn some oil off. Or the next oil change.

You said you didn't like the LM. Is that because it burned off?

 

[CT8]

5W-40 will be fine. 10W-30 would be fine . 0W-40 would be fine .Oil that meets the specs is what you want . The Xw is most important for low temp[freezing or below] starts. How long the engine will last in the future is how it was taken care of in the past. What about the P/S, trans and differentials.

 

[MCompact]

Use any LL-01 certified oil in the viscosity of your choice. Run whatever OCI that you feel comfortable with, but I'd be willing to bet a UOA would show excellent numbers from a 10k mile OCI.

 

[kschachn]

The Longlife-01 specification encompasses long life, but it achieves that by having a high resistance to oxidation, sludge formation and piston deposits among other things. Having "long life" is a side effect from being a tough specification to meet. There is no technical reason to deviate from the LL-01 specification trying to get a "better" oil.

There may more than one way to achieve a desired W rating in an oil, but for the most part 0W oils achieve it by using superior base stocks. Castrol 0W-40 is a predominately PAO base that achieves the 0W rating (and Longlife-01) by being a high quality oil. Any oil that caries LL-01 certification is by its very nature a superior oil, as also proven by the other certifications those oils often meet such as Porsche A40.

Your requirements are not different even if you think they are. There are very few requirements that a Longlife-01 oil cannot satisfy. You ask about downsides to a 10W oil, are there any that carry Longlife-01 certification? If there are then no, there aren't any downsides necessarily if you are picking a winter rating appropriate for your operating conditions. But certifications are far more important in grading oil than the winter rating.

Originally Posted By: WatsaDisplayName
My first question is about 0w. If I don't need it for cold weather what do I give up by using it, or 5W for that matter? Again my understanding is that more additives are needed to get that W performance. What's the downside of going to 10W. I'm still operating under the assumption that it's better to have the two numbers closer together.
Also about using 40. Is that number more about engine age than ambient temps?
The other question is about LL01. If that's just about making the oil long life, which I don't need, why worry about it?
I'm all about trusting the Engineers (Engineer myself) but that depends on what requirements they had to meet when choosing oil. My requirements are different. Unless LL01 is and additive package that does something other than make the oil last longer I can ignore it. They had to spec weights that were good for all climates and I'm willing to bet that was more towards Europe and North America not the tropics.

Speaking of snake oil additives LM makes two products: Motor oil saver is supposed to help with rubber/plastic i.e. stem seals and Ceratec which is a ceramic coater. I'm not a believer in additives but there are a lot of people that swear by Motor Saver and claim they are past 200k miles on original valve seals. And Ceratec, I guess there's a sucker born every minute and I'm just that sucker. That's a total 600ml of additives so I'll have to wait until I burn some oil off. Or the next oil change.

 

[1JZ_E46]

I’ve done the full cooling system (including stent kit) on my X5. It’s not terribly hard. I did it over a weekend, including spark plugs, which is not an easy job in its own right. That was 25k miles ago. No issues since. I would start gathering parts and knowledge so you can just knock out a few items at once over a weekend. Better to be proactive than reactive with BMWs. PS it’s easiest to just remove the crank pulley when replacing the water pump. And perfect time to do belts, idler pulleys and tensioners.

 

[edyvw]

Go to Wal Mart and get Castrol 0W40. That is it. Of all available Euro oils, that one is probably the best.
Liqui Moly is OK, but that is it, OK. It is average oil with oversized Made in Germany letters and owners of German cars go like fly on [censored] when they see that oil.

 

[WatsaDisplayName]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
The Longlife-01 specification encompasses long life, but it achieves that by having a high resistance to oxidation, sludge formation and piston deposits among other things. Having "long life" is a side effect from being a tough specification to meet. There is no technical reason to deviate from the LL-01 specification trying to get a "better" oil.

There may more than one way to achieve a desired W rating in an oil, but for the most part 0W oils achieve it by using superior base stocks. Castrol 0W-40 is a predominately PAO base that achieves the 0W rating (and Longlife-01) by being a high quality oil. Any oil that caries LL-01 certification is by its very nature a superior oil, as also proven by the other certifications those oils often meet such as Porsche A40.

Your requirements are not different even if you think they are. There are very few requirements that a Longlife-01 oil cannot satisfy. You ask about downsides to a 10W oil, are there any that carry Longlife-01 certification? If there are then no, there aren't any downsides necessarily if you are picking a winter rating appropriate for your operating conditions. But certifications are far more important in grading oil than the winter rating.

Originally Posted By: WatsaDisplayName
My first question is about 0w. If I don't need it for cold weather what do I give up by using it, or 5W for that matter? Again my understanding is that more additives are needed to get that W performance. What's the downside of going to 10W. I'm still operating under the assumption that it's better to have the two numbers closer together.
Also about using 40. Is that number more about engine age than ambient temps?
The other question is about LL01. If that's just about making the oil long life, which I don't need, why worry about it?
I'm all about trusting the Engineers (Engineer myself) but that depends on what requirements they had to meet when choosing oil. My requirements are different. Unless LL01 is and additive package that does something other than make the oil last longer I can ignore it. They had to spec weights that were good for all climates and I'm willing to bet that was more towards Europe and North America not the tropics.

Speaking of snake oil additives LM makes two products: Motor oil saver is supposed to help with rubber/plastic i.e. stem seals and Ceratec which is a ceramic coater. I'm not a believer in additives but there are a lot of people that swear by Motor Saver and claim they are past 200k miles on original valve seals. And Ceratec, I guess there's a sucker born every minute and I'm just that sucker. That's a total 600ml of additives so I'll have to wait until I burn some oil off. Or the next oil change.


Thank you. That was helpful.

 

[WatsaDisplayName]

Originally Posted By: CT8
5W-40 will be fine. 10W-30 would be fine . 0W-40 would be fine .Oil that meets the specs is what you want . The Xw is most important for low temp[freezing or below] starts. How long the engine will last in the future is how it was taken care of in the past. What about the P/S, trans and differentials.

At the last service check they said P/S was good. Previous owner might have done a recent flush.
I asked them to check transmission fluid because i was debating doing the $1000 flush. They actually said fluid looked pretty good.
I'm going to DIY the transmission anyway soon. If after that I have time I'll do differential. In both cases I'll take samples and send to Blackstone for analysis.
Brake flush will be done as routine PM when everything is out of the way.
And then a P/S flush if I've got nothing else to do.

 

[WatsaDisplayName]

Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
I’ve done the full cooling system (including stent kit) on my X5. It’s not terribly hard. I did it over a weekend, including spark plugs, which is not an easy job in its own right. That was 25k miles ago. No issues since. I would start gathering parts and knowledge so you can just knock out a few items at once over a weekend. Better to be proactive than reactive with BMWs. PS it’s easiest to just remove the crank pulley when replacing the water pump. And perfect time to do belts, idler pulleys and tensioners.

And the alternator bracket gasket since that's a common cause of leaks.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: WatsaDisplayName
Originally Posted By: CT8
5W-40 will be fine. 10W-30 would be fine . 0W-40 would be fine .Oil that meets the specs is what you want . The Xw is most important for low temp[freezing or below] starts. How long the engine will last in the future is how it was taken care of in the past. What about the P/S, trans and differentials.

At the last service check they said P/S was good. Previous owner might have done a recent flush.
I asked them to check transmission fluid because i was debating doing the $1000 flush. They actually said fluid looked pretty good.
I'm going to DIY the transmission anyway soon. If after that I have time I'll do differential. In both cases I'll take samples and send to Blackstone for analysis.
Brake flush will be done as routine PM when everything is out of the way.
And then a P/S flush if I've got nothing else to do.

DO NOT DO transmission flush!
Change pan/filter by using ZF pan (you can find it on Amazon) and ZF fluid. ZF6 is around $25-28 per liter, depends where you get. You good ole gravity to change fluid. I did fluid and pan change at 63k and I used 5 liters. Again, you can use Redline fluid, Valvoline Maxlife (pretty popular among BMW owners) BUT DO NOT do flush.
Also when it comes to engine oil specifications, look that besides LL-01 oil meets MB229.5 as that one is most stringent among ACEA A3/B3 B4 oils.
Castrol 0W40 meets all most important ones including LL-01 and MB229.5. Whatever you do avoid Castrol 5W40.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted By: edyvw
DO NOT DO transmission flush!
Change pan/filter by using ZF pan (you can find it on Amazon) and ZF fluid. ZF6 is around $25-28 per liter, depends where you get. You good ole gravity to change fluid. I did fluid and pan change at 63k and I used 5 liters. Again, you can use Redline fluid, Valvoline Maxlife (pretty popular among BMW owners) BUT DO NOT do flush.
Also when it comes to engine oil specifications, look that besides LL-01 oil meets MB229.5 as that one is most stringent among ACEA A3/B3 B4 oils.
Castrol 0W40 meets all most important ones including LL-01 and MB229.5. Whatever you do avoid Castrol 5W40.


+1. Do not do a "flush". You must do a pan drop (or two) and fill. Furthermore, the transmission has to be at a specific temperature and perfectly level to fill to the correct capacity. The same ZF transmission came in a few Ford vehicles, so you can get the same fluid (Mercon SP) for far cheaper than ZF Lifeguard6.

As for P/S, you must to use Pentosin CHF11S. Don't just flush it with any old P/S fluid or ATF. That's asking for problems down the road. I did three drain and fills of the P/S reservoir (about a liter in capacity) in my X5.

 

[1JZ_E46]

Originally Posted By: WatsaDisplayName
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
I’ve done the full cooling system (including stent kit) on my X5. It’s not terribly hard. I did it over a weekend, including spark plugs, which is not an easy job in its own right. That was 25k miles ago. No issues since. I would start gathering parts and knowledge so you can just knock out a few items at once over a weekend. Better to be proactive than reactive with BMWs. PS it’s easiest to just remove the crank pulley when replacing the water pump. And perfect time to do belts, idler pulleys and tensioners.

And the alternator bracket gasket since that's a common cause of leaks.


Yeah you can do that at the same time too. It's all a matter of how much time you have.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted By: edyvw
DO NOT DO transmission flush!
Change pan/filter by using ZF pan (you can find it on Amazon) and ZF fluid. ZF6 is around $25-28 per liter, depends where you get. You good ole gravity to change fluid. I did fluid and pan change at 63k and I used 5 liters. Again, you can use Redline fluid, Valvoline Maxlife (pretty popular among BMW owners) BUT DO NOT do flush.
Also when it comes to engine oil specifications, look that besides LL-01 oil meets MB229.5 as that one is most stringent among ACEA A3/B3 B4 oils.
Castrol 0W40 meets all most important ones including LL-01 and MB229.5. Whatever you do avoid Castrol 5W40.


+1. Do not do a "flush". You must do a pan drop (or two) and fill. Furthermore, the transmission has to be at a specific temperature and perfectly level to fill to the correct capacity. The same ZF transmission came in a few Ford vehicles, so you can get the same fluid (Mercon SP) for far cheaper than ZF Lifeguard6.

As for P/S, you must to use Pentosin CHF11S. Don't just flush it with any old P/S fluid or ATF. That's asking for problems down the road. I did three drain and fills of the P/S reservoir (about a liter in capacity) in my X5.

He needs to check for CHF11S, some came with ATF.

 

[WatsaDisplayName]

Yes. I'm not flushing just changing. I'm still a believer in sludge holding transmissions together. I'll do a change now and maybe another change soon. It's free through FCPEuro. ZF Lifeguard 6. The second time I'd drain (no pan) and replace with the same amount I took out.

The temperature thing is kind of an odd thing. They recommend getting the temp 30-50 C. Well 30C is ambient temperature around here.

"As for P/S, you must to use Pentosin CHF11S. Don't just flush it with any old P/S fluid or ATF. That's asking for problems down the road. I did three drain and fills of the P/S reservoir (about a liter in capacity) in my X5."
I'll keep that in mind when I get to the P/S. Thanx.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: WatsaDisplayName
Yes. I'm not flushing just changing. I'm still a believer in sludge holding transmissions together. I'll do a change now and maybe another change soon. It's free through FCPEuro. ZF Lifeguard 6. The second time I'd drain (no pan) and replace with the same amount I took out.

The temperature thing is kind of an odd thing. They recommend getting the temp 30-50 C. Well 30C is ambient temperature around here.

"As for P/S, you must to use Pentosin CHF11S. Don't just flush it with any old P/S fluid or ATF. That's asking for problems down the road. I did three drain and fills of the P/S reservoir (about a liter in capacity) in my X5."
I'll keep that in mind when I get to the P/S. Thanx.

I think, temperature for trans. fluid change is 37.5c.

 

[1JZ_E46]

How are you getting free oils/fluids from FCP Euro?