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Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4759767 05/17/18 10:16 AM
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2007 F150, 4.2 V6
Havoline PRO DS 5W20, M1-209A
"One Filter, One OCI!"
"One Box, One OCI!"
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4759772 05/17/18 10:25 AM
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I have had my brake system on my 07 F150 flushed 3 times since new. It's due this year. I have used DOT 4 twice, DOT 3 once. DOT 4 next time.


2007 F150, 4.2 V6
Havoline PRO DS 5W20, M1-209A
"One Filter, One OCI!"
"One Box, One OCI!"
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4759833 05/17/18 11:32 AM
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artificialist Offline
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I use DOT4 on non-abs brakes and I use DOT4 low viscosity on ABS brakes. That is because DOT4 is cheaper than DOT4 low viscosity, and DOT4 low viscosity mostly exists so the ABS module can react faster.

Typically I use Valvoline DOT4 and I use Pentosin DOT4LV low viscosity.


2010 Lancer Ralliart Sportback
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: BlueOvalFitter] #4759994 05/17/18 01:49 PM
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Most of that i knew but learned a couple things thanks for the good reads.


12 cruze rs 1.4t 6spd pp 5w30 tuned on 22psi
19 cruze auto 1.4t amsoil oe 5w20 tuned on 24psi
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4759997 05/17/18 01:50 PM
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Dylan1303 Offline OP
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Im still undecided, maybe i can do half and half dot 3,4.


12 cruze rs 1.4t 6spd pp 5w30 tuned on 22psi
19 cruze auto 1.4t amsoil oe 5w20 tuned on 24psi
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4760124 05/17/18 03:36 PM
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This aritacle says dot 4 is less hydroscopic. Witch is why i wanted to use it in the first place.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.speedwa...fications/28676


12 cruze rs 1.4t 6spd pp 5w30 tuned on 22psi
19 cruze auto 1.4t amsoil oe 5w20 tuned on 24psi
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Gimpy1] #4760228 05/17/18 05:35 PM
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dailydriver Offline
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Originally Posted By: Gimpy1
USE Castrol SRF. The per litre price will give you a heart attack.


I am considering it for my first changeout despite it's 'liquid gold' status/co$t. (Hard to argue with a 518*F wet boiling point!)
The manual does spec a Low Viscosity fluid though, IF that has any bearing on my choices. shrug


2016 Ford Fiesta ST 17K miles
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Fram XG3600 filter
Ravenol MTF-2 in the IB6 transaxle
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: artificialist] #4760230 05/17/18 05:39 PM
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dailydriver Offline
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Originally Posted By: artificialist
I use DOT4 on non-abs brakes and I use DOT4 low viscosity on ABS brakes. That is because DOT4 is cheaper than DOT4 low viscosity, and DOT4 low viscosity mostly exists so the ABS module can react faster.

Typically I use Valvoline DOT4 and I use Pentosin DOT4LV low viscosity.


The Bosch LV stuff (on the shelf at Auto Zones) has slightly better wet and dry boiling points than the Pentosin LV.


2016 Ford Fiesta ST 17K miles
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Fram XG3600 filter
Ravenol MTF-2 in the IB6 transaxle
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: dailydriver] #4760661 05/18/18 06:56 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: Gimpy1
USE Castrol SRF. The per litre price will give you a heart attack.


I am considering it for my first changeout despite it's 'liquid gold' status/co$t. (Hard to argue with a 518*F wet boiling point!)
The manual does spec a Low Viscosity fluid though, IF that has any bearing on my choices. shrug


I think I could manage to "argue with a 518*F wet boiling point".

Whatever that is in meaningful units (can't be bothered to convert it to centigrade), I'm not very interested in wet boiling point, because I don't intend to use wet brake fluid.

Even if it works fine as brake fluid, I'm unsure that its corrosion resistance hasn't been compromised.

With a quick, cheap change of DOT3 I get rid of the water and wet boiling point becomes irrelevent.

High performance or track use might be another matter, but that not relevent to me either.

Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4760694 05/18/18 07:28 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: mightymousetech
Originally Posted By: Marco620
Dot 3 lasts longer,Dot4 has better performance but needs changing more often.


That's not true.

One of the main benefits of DOT4 is that it has a higher wet boiling point.



The two statements are not incompatible, so "That's not true" is not appropriate.

If "lasts longer" is defined as "having a higher wet boiling point after 2 years" then "That's not true" is OK, but since "Last longer" is not defined, it isn't.

"Lasts longer" COULD be defined by rate of water absorption, but there is no information about this on the graph, which only refers to a single time point.

Moreover, as drawn, the graph implies that ALL the fluids have EXACTLY the same amount of water in them (about 3.6%) after 2 years service. This seems rather unlikely, and tends to undermine its credibility a bit.

Re: Brake fluid question [Re: BlueOvalFitter] #4760716 05/18/18 07:44 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Second one says DOT3 is higher viscosity. That'd presumably be better (for a non-ABS system at least) since it seems likely to reduce wear.

Also says ""*Some manufacturers sell brake fluid with much higher boiling points. These fluids are intended for use in race vehicles only and should not be used in daily drivers or street vehicles.**

Doesn't say why they "should not be used in daily drivers or street vehicles.", but perhaps they, too, could "argue with a 518*F wet boiling point".

Neither of them say anything about relative water absorption.

Last edited by Ducked; 05/18/18 07:45 AM.
Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4760762 05/18/18 08:07 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: Dylan1303
This aritacle says dot 4 is less hydroscopic. Witch is why i wanted to use it in the first place.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.speedwa...fications/28676


This could be true. Its the reverse of my recollection of what I'd read, but I don't have the source and might be mis-remembering.

However, there's enough technically illiterate bollocks in that article that I'd want independant confirmation of anything it said before I acted on it.

For example

"If you look at the chemistry behind most brake fluid, it comes from the combination of various types of glycols, which are basically a mixture of non-petroleum and other alcohol-based fluids. After a mixing process, the chemical name gets shortened to “polyglycol”."

Tosh

"But there are a few draw backs to silicon-based fluids, they expand more when compressed...."

Expand more when compressed doesn't make any sense.

Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Ducked] #4760766 05/18/18 08:13 AM
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Ducked Offline
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Originally Posted By: Ducked
Originally Posted By: mightymousetech
Originally Posted By: Marco620
Dot 3 lasts longer,Dot4 has better performance but needs changing more often.


That's not true.

One of the main benefits of DOT4 is that it has a higher wet boiling point.



The two statements are not incompatible, so "That's not true" is not appropriate.

If "lasts longer" is defined as "having a higher wet boiling point after 2 years" then "That's not true" is OK, but since "Last longer" is not defined, it isn't.

"Lasts longer" COULD be defined by rate of water absorption, but there is no information about this on the graph, which only refers to a single time point.

Moreover, as drawn, the graph implies that ALL the fluids have EXACTLY the same amount of water in them (about 3.6%) after 2 years service. This seems rather unlikely, and tends to undermine its credibility a bit.


What this actually showing, probably, is simply the wet boiling point, which IIRC is DEFINED at 3.7% water.

The "after 2 years service" thing, then, seems to be pure invention.

Re: Brake fluid question [Re: Dylan1303] #4760957 05/18/18 11:13 AM
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Use the Valvoline brake fluid and you won't have to make a decision.

Re: Brake fluid question [Re: dailydriver] #4761208 05/18/18 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: artificialist
I use DOT4 on non-abs brakes and I use DOT4 low viscosity on ABS brakes. That is because DOT4 is cheaper than DOT4 low viscosity, and DOT4 low viscosity mostly exists so the ABS module can react faster.

Typically I use Valvoline DOT4 and I use Pentosin DOT4LV low viscosity.


The Bosch LV stuff (on the shelf at Auto Zones) has slightly better wet and dry boiling points than the Pentosin LV.

That is great news. I never thought I would see any DOT4LV at Autozone. I can buy that and get Duralast brake pads at the same time, that is very convenient.


2010 Lancer Ralliart Sportback
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