Extended OCI and warranty

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Thoughts on a car under warranty and I want to run Amsoil SS 0W-20 and a Fram Ultra filter at extended OCI. Idea is I would get a UOA at the time the MM wanted the oil changed and as long as the UOA comes back in spec stay the course.

Thoughts/opinions please....
 
If you value your warranty, why risk it? The warranty could potentially save you thousands, which to me might not be worth the risk taken in order to save a few bucks.

That said, if you get denied warranty coverage and decide to fight them over it, they would have to prove that the extended OCI caused the failure. The way I see it, that would be pretty difficult to do unless it's obvious, such as sludge build-up.
 
I wanted to do similar using different synthetic oils(more mainstream oil) and I was told right here at BITOG to NOT stray away from the owner's manual/MFG's recommendation for OCI's during the warranty period.

Sure, you could have all of the documentation and UOA's in the world but(BUT), should you have a warranty issue, be prepared for a fight. It's a case of choosing your battles!
 
I'm assuming your talking about the 2018 pilot in your signature the MM on that vehicle is going to get you about 8-10k if it is like any other Honda. I'm not sure what your looking to extend your changes to but it is always a proceed with caution thought when dealing with a new vehicle under warranty. If you go outside what the MFG recommends they can deny if there is an issue, of course they have to prove it was oil related and all that stuff blah, blah and it could be a pain in the butt...who wants that headache. It's a Honda, chances are you will never have an issue extending your interval but "you" have to decide if it is worth while under warranty.
 
Under warranty if you choose to extend the oci/fci beyond the OM MM recommendation, you assume the risk (however small) should something catastrophic happen to the engine. All UOA's in the world unlikely to help you in that event.

Now that you're fully informed, if you choose to go ahead, your call. Out of warranty, another matter.
 
I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve; from your tag line, it doesn't appear that you keep a car long enough to matter what oil or filter you put into it.
 
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Originally Posted By: JustN89
If you value your warranty, why risk it? The warranty could potentially save you thousands, which to me might not be worth the risk taken in order to save a few bucks.

That said, if you get denied warranty coverage and decide to fight them over it, they would have to prove that the extended OCI caused the failure. The way I see it, that would be pretty difficult to do unless it's obvious, such as sludge build-up.


I think you could be in for a heck of a fight if something were to go wrong with the engine. Automakers employ a lot of lawyers and have much deeper pockets than the average citizen. If it ever went to court, your legal team would likely be required to prove your extended oil changes did not cause the warranty issue....assuming your problem was some type of engine failure. This could be expensive for you, in fact very expensive. IMO, new vehicles are too expensive to worry about saving a few $$$ extending your oil changes. FWIW, our Honda CR-V uses a maintenance minder and it always gets down to 15% oil life between 9-10k miles. It has done this since we bought it new in 2008.
 
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Originally Posted By: klt1986
Originally Posted By: JustN89
If you value your warranty, why risk it? The warranty could potentially save you thousands, which to me might not be worth the risk taken in order to save a few bucks.

That said, if you get denied warranty coverage and decide to fight them over it, they would have to prove that the extended OCI caused the failure. The way I see it, that would be pretty difficult to do unless it's obvious, such as sludge build-up.


I think you could be in for a heck of a fight if something were to go wrong with the engine. Automakers employ a lot of lawyers and have much deeper pockets than the average citizen. If it ever went to court, your legal team would likely be required to prove your extended oil changes did not cause the warranty issue....assuming your problem was some type of engine failure. This could be expensive for you, in fact very expensive. IMO, new vehicles are too expensive to worry about saving a few $$$ extending your oil changes. FWIW, our Honda CR-V uses a maintenance minder and it always gets down to 15% oil life between 9-10k miles. It has done this since we bought it new in 2008.

This just isn't the case. The burden of proof is on the company providing the warranty, not on the consumer. They would have to use their vast legal resources to prove that the extended OCIs caused the failure, which isn't as easily done as they would like to make you believe.

 
Based on some of the responses thus far, you'd think that doing extended OCIs is EXTREMELY DANGERIOUS and you have to assume all risk and expenses should something catastrophic happen to the engine during a 10-15k mile run on a synthetic oil GARANTEED by the manufacturer to be good for 20k miles... hmmmmm. Something doesn't add up here.

The way I see if, we have MORE THEN ENOUGH data on this site to suggest that, the OP will be TOTALLY SAFE to run an oil of his choosing for 2x the mantienance schedule without even a hint of any LUBRICATION RELATED failure if the UOA backed it up, showing that the oil is in good shape during oil change. What's the problem??

With today's 36-60k mile warranties, he'll be out of warranty and on his own in what, 3-4 oil changes? We all know that engine can last past the warranty period without even changing the factory fill, so I don't see what the fuss is about. If the lab report shows the oil is fine after putting on 2, 3, 5, or 10,000 MORE MILES then what the maintenance reminder suggest, then the OP should have NOTHING to worry about and he'll be past the warranty period with flying colors and a clean engine in no time at all.

Just my $0.02

I say you go for it, OP.
 
The cost saving of doing an extended OCI is small compared to the possible issues. Follow the MM with a good synthetic and filter of choice. you do not want to get into a shouting contest with the dealership/manufacturer.
 
Originally Posted By: JustN89

This just isn't the case. The burden of proof is on the company providing the warranty, not on the consumer. They would have to use their vast legal resources to prove that the extended OCIs caused the failure, which isn't as easily done as they would like to make you believe.



For wins on the internet, you are right. In the real world, you may have to litigate on your own dime to prove you are right against companies that have deeper pockets to financially cripple you first.

When discussion like this come up, people have to ask themselves if they are willing to absorb the cost of taking that risk? Most smart people will go with following the OEM recommended OCI while in warranty and expecting warranty coverage.

Also, even AMSOIL will tell you to follow the the OEM recommended OCI while in warranty.
 
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If this is about a GDI engine then the UOA at maintenance minder alert will show sufficient fuel dilution as to discourage the OP from any extended anything. So the whole discussion is pretty much hypothetical.

As for warranty purposes, my experience with Honda and Toyota is that their dealers have reasonable pricing for maintenance items. Changing oil at recommended interval at the dealer with their brand name Honda or Toyota oil is impeccable from a warranty pov.
 
Originally Posted By: Artem
Based on some of the responses thus far, you'd think that doing extended OCIs is EXTREMELY DANGERIOUS and you have to assume all risk and expenses should something catastrophic happen to the engine during a 10-15k mile run on a synthetic oil GARANTEED by the manufacturer to be good for 20k miles... hmmmmm. Something doesn't add up here.

The way I see if, we have MORE THEN ENOUGH data on this site to suggest that, the OP will be TOTALLY SAFE to run an oil of his choosing for 2x the mantienance schedule without even a hint of any LUBRICATION RELATED failure if the UOA backed it up, showing that the oil is in good shape during oil change. What's the problem??

With today's 36-60k mile warranties, he'll be out of warranty and on his own in what, 3-4 oil changes? We all know that engine can last past the warranty period without even changing the factory fill, so I don't see what the fuss is about. If the lab report shows the oil is fine after putting on 2, 3, 5, or 10,000 MORE MILES then what the maintenance reminder suggest, then the OP should have NOTHING to worry about and he'll be past the warranty period with flying colors and a clean engine in no time at all.

Just my $0.02

I say you go for it, OP.

I don't think anyone is saying that it's dangerous to extend OCIs, rather they're saying that it's not worth the risk of losing warranty. In all reality, an extended OCI with a good synthetic won't cause harm, but no engine is perfect. If something breaks, it was probably going to break regardless of whether or not the OCI was extended with synthetic oil. However, it's a pretty safe bet that if your receipts show that you extended beyond the Manufacturer's OCI recommendations, they will more than likely fight you over warranty coverage. It may still be worth it to some, but if you strictly look at this from a value point-of-view, it's not worth the risk. Especially considering that the Honda OLM will already take you out up to 10k miles.
 
Thanks for all the responses - that's what I thought - I will follow the MM.

Now as a purely theoretical question and I'm not saying I would'nt be truthful but as a hypothetical you're running Amsoil SS with an extended OC filter and you're sure the oil level is good and you get a UOA that says the oil is doing well and BAM out of no where something catastrophic happens unrelated to the extended OCI causing loss of oil and you fry the engine or something lubricated by oil breaks, etc.. How would a dealership prove the oil wasn't changed at the recommended MM interval? Under the above circumstances that seems like a very difficult thing to prove.
 
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Originally Posted By: PWMDMD
Thanks for all the responses - that's what I thought - I will follow the MM.

Now as a purely theoretical question and I'm not saying I would'nt be truthful but as a hypothetical you're running Amsoil SS with an extended OC filter and you're sure the oil level is good and you get a UOA that says the oil is doing well and BAM out of no where something catastrophic happens unrelated to the extended OCI causing loss of oil and you fry the engine or something lubricated by oil breaks, etc.. How would a dealership prove the oil wasn't changed at the recommended MM interval? Under the above circumstances that seems like a very difficult thing to prove.


You are the one that has to prove that all maintenance requirements were satisfied. The dealer has to prove nothing.
 
IDK what procedures a dealership or the MFG(who actually has to accept/deny the warranty claim) would take in proving that it is the oil &/or filter that caused the engine failure.

However what I do believe is that they'll just deny your warranty claim and make it difficult for you(outside of the dealership) in the courts to fight for your rights.

And this will happen all while you have no car to drive. YES, I realize that YOU have multiple vehicles but, "hypothetically" speaking. Most people have just the one vehicle in the shop. They won't be giving you a loaner/rental while you're taking them to court. Nor will they reimburse you for the rental after the fact unless the judge says so as part of your claim/win.
 
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Originally Posted By: turnbowm
Originally Posted By: PWMDMD
Thanks for all the responses - that's what I thought - I will follow the MM.

Now as a purely theoretical question and I'm not saying I would'nt be truthful but as a hypothetical you're running Amsoil SS with an extended OC filter and you're sure the oil level is good and you get a UOA that says the oil is doing well and BAM out of no where something catastrophic happens unrelated to the extended OCI causing loss of oil and you fry the engine or something lubricated by oil breaks, etc.. How would a dealership prove the oil wasn't changed at the recommended MM interval? Under the above circumstances that seems like a very difficult thing to prove.


You are the one that has to prove that all maintenance requirements were satisfied. The dealer has to prove nothing.


Theoretical again and since I'm a truth guy I wouldn't do this but - I go to Walmart and buy oil for my other car which always seems to be on a similar maintenance schedule and I save the receipt. MM allows you to change the oil filter every other OC so no problems there. I change the oil on my Mazda5 and write that I used that oil in my Honda. Catastrophic event happens that I logically know has nothing to do with the extended OCI so feel justified in presenting my documentation to the dealership.

How could a dealership deny coverage? Said another way if I choose to do my own OCs a receipt is all I will every have even if I change the oil more often than recommended by the MM - how would the dealership ever make heads or tails of it?
 
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I believe the burden of proof would be on you
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I think extended OCIs are a thing of the past, from the times when most cars were having OCIs designed for mineral oil and using a synthetic would had been wasteful if the OCI was not adjusted according to the synthetic’s properties.

These days car makers are already recommending longer OCIs, adjusted to contemporary oil performance.
 
Originally Posted By: PWMDMD
...Theoretical again and since I'm a truth guy I wouldn't do this but - I go to Walmart and buy oil for my other car which always seems to be on a similar maintenance schedule and I save the receipt. MM allows you to change the oil filter every other OC so no problems there. I change the oil on my Mazda5 and write that I used that oil in my Honda. Catastrophic event happens that I logically know has nothing to do with the extended OCI so feel justified in presenting my documentation to the dealership.

How could a dealership deny coverage? Said another way if I choose to do my own OCs a receipt is all I will every have even if I change the oil more often than recommended by the MM - how would the dealership ever make heads or tails of it?


In that scenario the dealer wouldn't deny coverage, but you would be committing fraud.
 
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