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Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos #4755699
05/13/18 09:22 AM
05/13/18 09:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
WyrTwister Offline OP
WyrTwister  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
We have a 2015 Chevy Sonic 1.8l automatic , purchased new . At that time , Dexos was required . Since then , Dexos Gen 2 has come out .

My thought is to not worry about Gen 2 Dexos until I use up my stash of Gen 1 oil .

Am I missing something ?


Thanks , :-)


Wyr
God bless
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4755708
05/13/18 09:32 AM
05/13/18 09:32 AM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 618
Canada
nap Offline
nap  Offline
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 618
Canada
I wouldnt worry as your engine is not turbo. However keep an eye on GMs announcements, if at some point they retroactively recommend gen 2 for your engine, you may want to follow.

Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4755720
05/13/18 09:44 AM
05/13/18 09:44 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,445
St. Charles County, Missouri
csandste Offline
csandste  Offline
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,445
St. Charles County, Missouri
Practically speaking I doubt if the 1.8 would require Dexos anyway. It's a pretty basic engine. GM requires Dexos 1.2 because (1)they want a single oil their dealers can stock, (2)some engines would need it so the whole standard was upgraded and(3) they want the licensing money.

Granted my late, lamented (totaled) Buick Encore 1.4 was out of warranty, but I continued with MaxLife after it lost its Dexos licensing. Worked as well as it did before, because it was the same oil. Same with your car. When VWB was mistakenly put into my car I posted on here and heard from owners who had used it without incident on a 1.4 Sonic (or Cruze, can't remember). The 1.4 should be more demanding on oil than your 1.8.

So, practically speaking, I don't think you have anything to worry about, even if it was never a Dexos oil. If you were playing by the rules when you bought the oil you probably have even less to worry about. However, there probably are dealers out there who would do their best to try to get some money out of you but that would be a long shot.

I would continue to use it without worry.

Last edited by csandste; 05/13/18 09:46 AM.

2017 Kia Soul Plus-- Valvoline MaxLife Blend 5-20, 48,000 miles.
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4755722
05/13/18 09:45 AM
05/13/18 09:45 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 42,136
New Jersey
JHZR2 Offline
JHZR2  Offline
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 42,136
New Jersey
If you have it, use it. It's obsolete by spec only. When you buy new, modern spec oil will be what's on the shelf. I wouldn't think about it at all.

Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4755761
05/13/18 10:28 AM
05/13/18 10:28 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,278
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,278
New England
You're not missing a thing, use that stash up and don't worry about it.


2014 Forester XT, 90000 miles
Last Change;
M1 5W30 d1G2
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: nap] #4755795
05/13/18 10:57 AM
05/13/18 10:57 AM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
WyrTwister Offline OP
WyrTwister  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
Originally Posted By: nap
I wouldnt worry as your engine is not turbo. However keep an eye on GMs announcements, if at some point they retroactively recommend gen 2 for your engine, you may want to follow.


I was planning on it , when I use up what I have on hand .

Right nos , I think it has 48,000 on the clock . Been changing oil / filter when the OLM hits 55% & 5% . I want to keep everything inside the engine CLEAN . Especially the cam phaser oil control system . I figure that could get real expensive real quickly !

Kind of glad I did not end up with the 1.4l with the turbo .


Wyr
God bless
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: csandste] #4755798
05/13/18 11:02 AM
05/13/18 11:02 AM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
WyrTwister Offline OP
WyrTwister  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
Originally Posted By: csandste
Practically speaking I doubt if the 1.8 would require Dexos anyway. It's a pretty basic engine. GM requires Dexos 1.2 because (1)they want a single oil their dealers can stock, (2)some engines would need it so the whole standard was upgraded and(3) they want the licensing money.

Granted my late, lamented (totaled) Buick Encore 1.4 was out of warranty, but I continued with MaxLife after it lost its Dexos licensing. Worked as well as it did before, because it was the same oil. Same with your car. When VWB was mistakenly put into my car I posted on here and heard from owners who had used it without incident on a 1.4 Sonic (or Cruze, can't remember). The 1.4 should be more demanding on oil than your 1.8.

So, practically speaking, I don't think you have anything to worry about, even if it was never a Dexos oil. If you were playing by the rules when you bought the oil you probably have even less to worry about. However, there probably are dealers out there who would do their best to try to get some money out of you but that would be a long shot.

I would continue to use it without worry.


The car came with 4 free oil changes . Do not know what oil then dealer used ? My guess wauld be GM Dexos , which I think , at that time , was a blend .

I have only used Dexos full synthetic , Mobil & Pennzoil . I have 1 or 2 jugs of the Pennzoil left & 24 quarts of NAPA Dexos Synthetic 5W-30 to use up , also .

So , I have never use anything but full synthetic . What ever that means ?


Wyr
God bless
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4755801
05/13/18 11:04 AM
05/13/18 11:04 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,445
St. Charles County, Missouri
csandste Offline
csandste  Offline
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,445
St. Charles County, Missouri
That's not a very stressed engine. Think you could easily push the oil well past that. Changed my 1.4 at 20% which was about 6500 miles. Planning on changing my new Kia Soul at 6000 miles with conv or semi syn(no OLM). I've owned well over cars and only lost two engines (overheating on a '76 Plymouth Arrow, and a used Ford Festiva which I looked like it hadn't had an oil change for its first 28,000 miles--died at 120K and I got used engine/transmission in for $700. Engines are tougher then the anal retentives on my favorite board give them credit for.

Last edited by csandste; 05/13/18 11:14 AM.

2017 Kia Soul Plus-- Valvoline MaxLife Blend 5-20, 48,000 miles.
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4755817
05/13/18 11:19 AM
05/13/18 11:19 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,445
St. Charles County, Missouri
csandste Offline
csandste  Offline
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,445
St. Charles County, Missouri
Think you chose the trouble free engine of the two. My 1.4 had to have two valve covers replaced under warranty because of the PCV, and a secondary valve in the intake manifold was flashing CEL codes mostly in cold weather. Drove fine and didn't want to drop a thou when I could just pull the battery and reset things, but compared to my Kia Soul's engine (and my Kia Rio's before that), the small GM turbos looked a lot more complicated and potentially troublesome. If I remember the 1.8 correctly, it's comparatively pretty simple.

Last edited by csandste; 05/13/18 11:20 AM.

2017 Kia Soul Plus-- Valvoline MaxLife Blend 5-20, 48,000 miles.
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: csandste] #4755916
05/13/18 12:54 PM
05/13/18 12:54 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,176
Pennsylbammyvania
dailydriver Offline
dailydriver  Offline
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,176
Pennsylbammyvania
Originally Posted By: csandste
That's not a very stressed engine. Think you could easily push the oil well past that. Changed my 1.4 at 20% which was about 6500 miles. Planning on changing my new Kia Soul at 6000 miles with conv or semi syn(no OLM). I've owned well over cars and only lost two engines (overheating on a '76 Plymouth Arrow, and a used Ford Festiva which I looked like it hadn't had an oil change for its first 28,000 miles--died at 120K and I got used engine/transmission in for $700. Engines are tougher then the anal retentives on my favorite board give them credit for.



Does the Soul have a TDI engine?

I would NOT run a conventional, or even a semi-synthetic (good as they all are nowadays) in a power dense, LSPI prone, highly stressed engine like that, even if there are no timing chain issues (IF it even has a chain instead of a belt). no-no


2016 Ford Fiesta ST
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Amsoil Ea15K51 filter
Motul Gear 300 non-LS 75W-90
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: csandste] #4755938
05/13/18 01:24 PM
05/13/18 01:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
WyrTwister Offline OP
WyrTwister  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
Originally Posted By: csandste
Think you chose the trouble free engine of the two. My 1.4 had to have two valve covers replaced under warranty because of the PCV, and a secondary valve in the intake manifold was flashing CEL codes mostly in cold weather. Drove fine and didn't want to drop a thou when I could just pull the battery and reset things, but compared to my Kia Soul's engine (and my Kia Rio's before that), the small GM turbos looked a lot more complicated and potentially troublesome. If I remember the 1.8 correctly, it's comparatively pretty simple.


Don't know how simple it is . The 1.4l is suppose to get a little better MPG's , but I do not think that would be worth it . Further down the road , with the potential for more expensive maintenance / repairs .


Wyr
God bless
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4756023
05/13/18 03:19 PM
05/13/18 03:19 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 7,757
New York
pbm Offline
pbm  Offline
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 7,757
New York
Originally Posted By: WyrTwister
Originally Posted By: csandste
Think you chose the trouble free engine of the two. My 1.4 had to have two valve covers replaced under warranty because of the PCV, and a secondary valve in the intake manifold was flashing CEL codes mostly in cold weather. Drove fine and didn't want to drop a thou when I could just pull the battery and reset things, but compared to my Kia Soul's engine (and my Kia Rio's before that), the small GM turbos looked a lot more complicated and potentially troublesome. If I remember the 1.8 correctly, it's comparatively pretty simple.


Don't know how simple it is . The 1.4l is suppose to get a little better MPG's , but I do not think that would be worth it . Further down the road , with the potential for more expensive maintenance / repairs .



If I'm not mistaken, your 1.8 has a timing BELT that needs replacing...the 1.4T has a timing CHAIN that doesn't.


'Journalism is Dead'
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: WyrTwister] #4756168
05/13/18 06:24 PM
05/13/18 06:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 25,588
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Garak Offline
Garak  Offline
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 25,588
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: WyrTwister
Am I missing something ?

No. GM is, though. The dexos1 spec was intended to make things easier for the consumer. Then they decided to introduce more grades than the original 5w-30. Then they decided to make dexos1 Generation 2 involve differing logos and print, rather than dexos1 simply being a rolling specification like every other OE on the planet.

They should have gone with the license number format simply changing, so those of us who wish to pay attention to these things can, and those who wish to simply buy an appropriate, current dexos1 oil (i.e. the vast majority of the oil buying public) aren't bothered with minutiae.


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, NAPA Gold 7356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: pbm] #4756465
05/14/18 03:29 AM
05/14/18 03:29 AM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
WyrTwister Offline OP
WyrTwister  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,920
Texas
Originally Posted By: pbm
Originally Posted By: WyrTwister
Originally Posted By: csandste
Think you chose the trouble free engine of the two. My 1.4 had to have two valve covers replaced under warranty because of the PCV, and a secondary valve in the intake manifold was flashing CEL codes mostly in cold weather. Drove fine and didn't want to drop a thou when I could just pull the battery and reset things, but compared to my Kia Soul's engine (and my Kia Rio's before that), the small GM turbos looked a lot more complicated and potentially troublesome. If I remember the 1.8 correctly, it's comparatively pretty simple.


Don't know how simple it is . The 1.4l is suppose to get a little better MPG's , but I do not think that would be worth it . Further down the road , with the potential for more expensive maintenance / repairs .



If I'm not mistaken, your 1.8 has a timing BELT that needs replacing...the 1.4T has a timing CHAIN that doesn't.


You are correct about the timing belt . I was kind of miffed about that . But then I started reading about engines that seemed to wear or stretch timing chains , prematurely . Replacing a timing belt looks a lot more doable DIY , than DIY'ing a timing chain .

Owners manual call to replace the timing belt at just shy of 100,000 miles . When the time comes , I think I can DIY the timing belt . Last time I check it out , an AC Delco kit was less than $ 125 . Course , this is from RockAuto & you have to add freight .

You can also buy a kit that includes the water pump . But the 1.8l does not have the water pump inside the timing belt cover ( many 4 cylinders do ) . The water pump is " outside " and looks easier to get to .

So , I will probably do what I have done with all my cars , drive it until the water pump gives problems & then replace it .

All in all , I have been pretty satisfied with the little engine , at 48,000 and change .

I would be much happier with the transmission if it had a dip stick and DIY serviceable filter . I have done 3 spill and fills so far & hope to get around to doing it again , soon . It holds around 4-1/2 quarts of Dexron 6 , so does not cost that much to do & I certainly wish to keep the non-DIY fluid clean , in hopes that filter never clogs .

Thanks , :-)


Wyr
God bless
Re: Gen 1 - Gen 2 Dexos [Re: nap] #4756751
05/14/18 09:59 AM
05/14/18 09:59 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,003
Cajun Country, La.
BlueOvalFitter Offline
BlueOvalFitter  Offline
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,003
Cajun Country, La.
Originally Posted By: nap
I wouldnt worry as your engine is not turbo. However keep an eye on GMs announcements, if at some point they retroactively recommend gen 2 for your engine, you may want to follow.

If it's not required now, why would it be required in the future? I'm not knocking your advice, I am just wondering what could possibly change?
I am here to learn and I find this very interesting. Thank You. smile

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