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#4752682 - 05/10/18 07:57 AM Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves?
cmlind Offline


Registered: 01/10/05
Posts: 74
Loc: Minnesota
Just changed the oil on my new Forester for the first time last weekend at 2700 miles. I warmed up the car for 10 minutes, cooled down for another 10 and pulled the drain plug, then filter - I hate figuring out plastic cover clips and stuck plugs and tight filters on the first changes.......

Anyway, the black Subaru filter that installs upside down was completely drained out. I cant see an anti drainback valve either. The Wix I installed has a valve. How can this be right from the factory?

I still need to cut it open and inspect. There was a little metal in the pan - some glitter in the light, but nothing alarming, but enough to justify in my mind an early change. My thoughts other than dry start ups - would the filter draining back regularly allow dirt to flow back to the pan? I know it is a small filter, but not good design. Anyone know if the blue subaru filters have valves?

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#4752697 - 05/10/18 08:17 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
Trav Offline


Registered: 11/20/06
Posts: 19612
Loc: MA, Mittelfranken.de
If its mounted upside down I would think it should have a ADBV or it will have to refill the filter every start and that's not good. The old Subaru had a vertical mounted filter from below and didn't need a ADBV.
I this case I believe yes everything not hanging in the filter will go backwards at least as far as the pump.
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#4752701 - 05/10/18 08:21 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
racin4ds Offline


Registered: 05/07/10
Posts: 1044
Loc: Ocala, Florida
I just looked under the hood of the loaner we had (2018 Forester) and seen that filter right there on top and upside down! It was black as well, not blue like the other OEM Subies I've seen.

My 08 Legacy has the filter on the bottom, very easy to get to and I guess it would stay full and not need a ADBV.
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#4752703 - 05/10/18 08:22 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
Virtus_Probi Offline


Registered: 06/25/15
Posts: 4188
Loc: New England
If that filter you took off had a part number ending in AA160, that's one that a lot of us wish we could buy in the US. I am presently using a Tokyo Roki filter intended for the WRX (not STI), I am comfortable with it since the engine in my FXT is almost identical.
Every Subaru/Tokyo Roki filter I've used has had an ADBV and they always have some oil in them when I take them off my car. I used one WIX/NAPA Gold filter with the higher bypass pressure Subaru seems to like and it just wouldn't stop weeping oil...I think the square cut seal on the thing had an overly prominent seam and oil still got out when I went gorilla on it. Went back to the Tokyo Rokis that I have never had issues with.
I used a couple of blue cans early on and didn't like that I could feel the case flexing when I tightened them, it just didn't sit right with me.
_________________________
2014 Forester XT, 86000 miles
Last Change;
M1 5W30 d1G2
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#4752735 - 05/10/18 08:50 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
cmlind Offline


Registered: 01/10/05
Posts: 74
Loc: Minnesota
I will get a picture of the filter tonight when I get home.

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#4752738 - 05/10/18 08:52 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 12117
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
Have had 3 FB engines in the past 8 years.

Basic physics and fluid dynamics.

Doesn't matter if it has an anti-drainback valve- It will empty.

It is at the highest point on engine, above all oil galleries, NOT in a closed system. It will fill with air and drain.
Dry start every time.

Now how does that add you your BITIOG paranoia? smile

Wife's last FB25 was burning oil at the rate of 1-2 per OCI at 55K miles.
No oil use, but excessive startup noise on the Crosstrek FB20.
_________________________
2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter

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#4752739 - 05/10/18 08:53 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 12117
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
IIRC all filters had ADB valves, Including the JDM OE Toyo-Roki.
_________________________
2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter

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#4752749 - 05/10/18 08:59 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 12117
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
Originally Posted By: cmlind
Just changed the oil on my new Forester for the first time last weekend ....
.... I cant see an anti drainback valve either ...

I still need to cut it open and inspect. ...


Its right there under the inlet holes. You may be thinking BYPASS which is in the can bottom on Roki's and Fram-arus. IN Wix its at the base end ( taking up all the filter space!)

If you want to emulate SUBARU OE replacement service parts you want to use a Fram Toughguard. That's basically what the dealer filter is.

Me ID look for a M1 filter in a large format. A low Bypass rating or 7-10 PSIG delta doesn't matter in the Non turbo engine in non "racy" environments.
_________________________
2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter

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#4752885 - 05/10/18 10:52 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
CT8 Offline


Registered: 10/09/14
Posts: 11480
Loc: Idaho
Oil leaks out of the passages and bearing . The drain back valve is to keep the oil from back washing the filter. There are some filters with "double " anti drain back valves for certain applications.
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#4752926 - 05/10/18 11:33 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 12117
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
If the filter ( with an ADBV) is low in the system (some are under the oil level) it will hold oil in the galleries and filter. at least overnight if the engine isn't put away wet.
_________________________
2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter

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#4752945 - 05/10/18 11:57 AM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
Yah-Tah-Hey Offline


Registered: 05/26/14
Posts: 3572
Loc: Columbus,Nebraska
If it it "upside down" no anti-drainback valve will prevent oil returning to the engine via pump clearances. May take awhile but the distortion of spacetime by the Earth(gravity) will empty the filter. smile

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#4752972 - 05/10/18 12:24 PM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: Yah-Tah-Hey]
ZeeOSix Offline


Registered: 07/22/10
Posts: 18167
Loc: PNW
Originally Posted By: Yah-Tah-Hey
If it it "upside down" no anti-drainback valve will prevent oil returning to the engine via pump clearances. May take awhile but the distortion of spacetime by the Earth(gravity) will empty the filter. smile


It might empty the center tube and gallery down stream of the center tube depending on the configuration of the system after the filter mount. But the oil inside the filter and down to the pump would stay full if the ADBV seals 100%.

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#4753167 - 05/10/18 03:49 PM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: ZeeOSix]
Rand Offline


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 12804
Loc: NE,Ohio
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: Yah-Tah-Hey
If it it "upside down" no anti-drainback valve will prevent oil returning to the engine via pump clearances. May take awhile but the distortion of spacetime by the Earth(gravity) will empty the filter. smile


It might empty the center tube and gallery down stream of the center tube depending on the configuration of the system after the filter mount. But the oil inside the filter and down to the pump would stay full if the ADBV seals 100%.


So oil wont go through the filter when its not under pressure?
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#4753201 - 05/10/18 04:26 PM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: Rand]
ZeeOSix Offline


Registered: 07/22/10
Posts: 18167
Loc: PNW
Originally Posted By: Rand
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: Yah-Tah-Hey
If it it "upside down" no anti-drainback valve will prevent oil returning to the engine via pump clearances. May take awhile but the distortion of spacetime by the Earth(gravity) will empty the filter. smile

It might empty the center tube and gallery down stream of the center tube depending on the configuration of the system after the filter mount. But the oil inside the filter and down to the pump would stay full if the ADBV seals 100%.

So oil wont go through the filter when its not under pressure?


Oil should say in the filter between the media and the can if the ADBV is sealing 100%. The info below is from an old thread of mine, but the photos don't show anymore due to the "Photobucket Ransom". But as you can see below (and others have done this same test), the filter was full of oil after sitting base down for a week in a funnel. The oil only leaked out if the filter after I opened up the ADBV with some Q-Tips to hold it open.


---- From My Old Thread With Same Photos -----

Drainage setup for the filter to test the ADBV.
While the filter was still pretty hot I put it base side down in a funnel and let the hot oil drain out, and then left it to drain for a whole week. After the week of draining, I then jammed some folded over Q-tip sticks in 3 of the base plate holes to open up the ADBV to let the guts drain out in a clean glass bottle. What drained out was what the ADBV was holding back for a week.




Results of the oil trapped by the ADBV - it came out to 6 ounces.

A rough calculation of the volume between the center core and the can shell showed to be about 13.7 cu-in. Six ounces of fluid will take up 10.8 cu-in, so this means basically the ADBV was keeping the entire space between the can and center core full of oil indefinitely. Filter is in the cutter ready for dissection.



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#4753225 - 05/10/18 04:58 PM Re: Do Subaru Factory Filters Anti Drainback Valves? [Re: cmlind]
Yah-Tah-Hey Offline


Registered: 05/26/14
Posts: 3572
Loc: Columbus,Nebraska
Thank you for that ZOS

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