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#4752076 - 05/09/18 02:42 PM ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored)
1JZ_E46 Offline


Registered: 04/04/16
Posts: 1320
Loc: Oregon
I'm an oil nerd. I admit it. Considering moving to a C3 / LL-04 oil to limit additives the phosphorous build-up in my cats (I burn about a quart every 2-2,500k). These are all U.S. available options. A few standout (Ravenol HLS, M1 ESP, INEO Long Life). Also really like PP Euro L because of its GTL base (and on the shelf at wallyworld).



BTW, I am on a 5k OCI, so not worried about the low TBNs and U.S. gasoline (which is trending in the right direction).


Edited by 1JZ_E46 (05/09/18 02:43 PM)
_________________________
2007 BMW X5 4.8i, 108k: M1 10W-30 HM, Mann
2012 Mini Cooper, 48k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann (for sale)
2016 Mini Countryman S ALL4, 20k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann

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#4752091 - 05/09/18 02:59 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 36092
Loc: Great Lakes
Is the Edge C3 available in the US?
_________________________
'02 530i (Edge 0W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T (Edge 5W-40)
'18 Charger SRT (FF)

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#4752096 - 05/09/18 03:03 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: Quattro Pete]
1JZ_E46 Offline


Registered: 04/04/16
Posts: 1320
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Is the Edge C3 available in the US?


Yep. $36 on Amazon for a 5 quart jug. Flashpoint has me concerned though...
_________________________
2007 BMW X5 4.8i, 108k: M1 10W-30 HM, Mann
2012 Mini Cooper, 48k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann (for sale)
2016 Mini Countryman S ALL4, 20k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann

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#4752104 - 05/09/18 03:17 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 36092
Loc: Great Lakes
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Is the Edge C3 available in the US?


Yep. $36 on Amazon for a 5 quart jug. Flashpoint has me concerned though...
Oh, it's the 5w-30. I was thinking it was the 0w-30 C3 that's available in Europe.
_________________________
'02 530i (Edge 0W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T (Edge 5W-40)
'18 Charger SRT (FF)

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#4752228 - 05/09/18 05:47 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
edyvw Offline


Registered: 03/08/12
Posts: 5116
Loc: Colorado Springs
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Is the Edge C3 available in the US?


Yep. $36 on Amazon for a 5 quart jug. Flashpoint has me concerned though...

As far as I remember Castrol uses different methodology when it comes to flash point. Also, heavy PAO based oils are not having high flash point. Not sure is 5W30 C3 heavy in PAO (I would say not).
_________________________
13' BMW X5 35d (Valvoline 5W40 MST+OEM filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W40+MANN filter)

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#4752244 - 05/09/18 06:04 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: edyvw]
1JZ_E46 Offline


Registered: 04/04/16
Posts: 1320
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: edyvw
As far as I remember Castrol uses different methodology when it comes to flash point. Also, heavy PAO based oils are not having high flash point. Not sure is 5W30 C3 heavy in PAO (I would say not).


Yeah, you may be right. It just looks way out of line. I also doubt thereís any PAO. Ravenol HLS looks to be the only PAO one. Makes sense given its price. $$$
_________________________
2007 BMW X5 4.8i, 108k: M1 10W-30 HM, Mann
2012 Mini Cooper, 48k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann (for sale)
2016 Mini Countryman S ALL4, 20k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann

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#4752318 - 05/09/18 07:17 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
benjy Offline


Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 926
Loc: pa
looked on the Ravenol site, some pretty "serious" oils, but as noted serious prices!! cheap is not usually good + good is not cheap, but for many its good enough for a decent cost!!

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#4752325 - 05/09/18 07:21 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
edyvw Offline


Registered: 03/08/12
Posts: 5116
Loc: Colorado Springs
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted By: edyvw
As far as I remember Castrol uses different methodology when it comes to flash point. Also, heavy PAO based oils are not having high flash point. Not sure is 5W30 C3 heavy in PAO (I would say not).


Yeah, you may be right. It just looks way out of line. I also doubt thereís any PAO. Ravenol HLS looks to be the only PAO one. Makes sense given its price. $$$

There has to be some PAO there.
Check ASTM methodology on Castrol 5W30 C3 and Mobil1 5W30 ESp.
_________________________
13' BMW X5 35d (Valvoline 5W40 MST+OEM filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W40+MANN filter)

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#4752348 - 05/09/18 07:48 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: edyvw]
1JZ_E46 Offline


Registered: 04/04/16
Posts: 1320
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: edyvw
There has to be some PAO there.
Check ASTM methodology on Castrol 5W30 C3 and Mobil1 5W30 ESp.


Castrol is D93 and M1 ESP is D92 and the others are D92, however Pennzoil is also D93. Means itís probably right up there with ESP under D92.
_________________________
2007 BMW X5 4.8i, 108k: M1 10W-30 HM, Mann
2012 Mini Cooper, 48k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann (for sale)
2016 Mini Countryman S ALL4, 20k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann

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#4752547 - 05/10/18 12:21 AM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
edyvw Offline


Registered: 03/08/12
Posts: 5116
Loc: Colorado Springs
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted By: edyvw
There has to be some PAO there.
Check ASTM methodology on Castrol 5W30 C3 and Mobil1 5W30 ESp.


Castrol is D93 and M1 ESP is D92 and the others are D92, however Pennzoil is also D93. Means itís probably right up there with ESP under D92.

It has all the approvals, would not sweat it out.
_________________________
13' BMW X5 35d (Valvoline 5W40 MST+OEM filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W40+MANN filter)

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#4752760 - 05/10/18 09:12 AM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
Fraser434 Offline


Registered: 09/17/11
Posts: 184
Loc: Chicago
When the Ecodiesel had the MS11106 oil spec (before it changed to CJ4) the best UOA results I saw came from Mobil1 ESP 5W30, only C3 type oil with moly in the additives.

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#4752940 - 05/10/18 11:50 AM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
vinu_neuro Offline


Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1119
Loc: Chicago / IN
Originally Posted By: 1JZ_E46
Originally Posted By: edyvw
There has to be some PAO there.
Check ASTM methodology on Castrol 5W30 C3 and Mobil1 5W30 ESp.


Castrol is D93 and M1 ESP is D92 and the others are D92, however Pennzoil is also D93. Means itís probably right up there with ESP under D92.

What's D92 and D93?
_________________________


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#4752959 - 05/10/18 12:13 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: vinu_neuro]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 36092
Loc: Great Lakes
Originally Posted By: vinu_neuro
What's D92 and D93?
Different standard for measuring flash point...

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=761083
_________________________
'02 530i (Edge 0W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T (Edge 5W-40)
'18 Charger SRT (FF)

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#4753033 - 05/10/18 01:21 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
1JZ_E46 Offline


Registered: 04/04/16
Posts: 1320
Loc: Oregon
If I do choose to use a C3/LL-04 oil (will be running a fill of M1 10W-30 high mileage next OCI to see how that does), it will be Pennzoil Platinum Euro L. It's a near 100% GTL based oil (per its SDS), has the right certs, impressive specs, and is available down the street from me for $27 (pre-rebate) per 5qt jug. Looking at a VOA of it, starting TBN is around 7.0 and seems to hold up well in the U.S. (drops to around 3 in 5k miles). After a rebate, I can still keep my oil changes to ~$50 (9qt sump).
_________________________
2007 BMW X5 4.8i, 108k: M1 10W-30 HM, Mann
2012 Mini Cooper, 48k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann (for sale)
2016 Mini Countryman S ALL4, 20k: Castrol 0W-30, Mann

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#4753393 - 05/10/18 07:42 PM Re: ACEA C3 / LL-04 oil comparison table (I got bored) [Re: 1JZ_E46]
Garak Online   content


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 25004
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
That is a pretty respectable price, to say the least!
_________________________
Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, NAPA Gold 7356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515

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