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#4752027 - 05/09/18 01:16 PM 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro
Danh Offline


Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 1763
Loc: .


This was the carís third oil change since new, the last being very short because of an upcoming trip.

Two comments:

The oil is Idemistu Zepro 0w-20 with Molybdenum. Havenít seen this in a UOA before, so thought it would be of interest. And the 625ppm of Moly says the label doesnít lie.

My primary reason for the UOA was looking for fuel dilution, which is an issue with the other Honda K24W engine in our household. But 2.3% dilution is truly negligible for a DI engine and Iím happy with that. Viscosity is hanging in there, too.

Questions:

Nickel is an unexpected finding. My other K24W showed none in any UOA and this has me puzzled: is nickel even used in Honda K24s? I donít recall ever hearing nickel was an oil additive. Admittedly 4ppm is not much, but any ideas?

Aluminum is still on the high side, but as the car only had 3,700 miles or so when this fill was added I guess this could still be residue from break in and some additional break-in wear. Given some copper is still showing up, might break-in be the answer?

This sample included quite a few highway miles and the OLM said 70% oil life remaining (60-70%) at the time of sampling. With the TBN of 5.67, this seems about right.

So, while Iím happy with the fuel dilution and other wear metals, any general comments or on nickel and aluminum would be appreciated.

Thanks!


Edited by Danh (05/09/18 01:34 PM)

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#4752037 - 05/09/18 01:34 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
PimTac Online   content


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 4615
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
Isnít nickel used in bearings?
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter


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#4752047 - 05/09/18 01:52 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
nap Offline


Registered: 04/27/18
Posts: 441
Loc: Canada
Nickel: fuel pump -> fuel dilution -> UOA

Far fetched but not impossible.

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#4752112 - 05/09/18 03:25 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
PimTac Online   content


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 4615
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter


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#4752127 - 05/09/18 03:49 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
jayg Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 1211
Loc: Rabbit Creek, Alaska
Nickel could be valvetrain, wrist pins, but on a newer Honda with only 4 ppm I'd bet on some tiny amount of residual factory anti-seize.




Watch it but don't sweat it. If you still have some after a few more oil changes, switch oil and see what happens.
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#4752169 - 05/09/18 04:35 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: jayg]
Danh Offline


Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 1763
Loc: .
Originally Posted By: jayg
Nickel could be valvetrain, wrist pins, but on a newer Honda with only 4 ppm I'd bet on some tiny amount of residual factory anti-seize.




Watch it but don't sweat it. If you still have some after a few more oil changes, switch oil and see what happens.


Thanks for the thought. I have yet to see a Honda that didnít report 0 for nickel, so it would seem it isnít used in engines or in anti-seize compounds. But maybe there was a short-term anti-seize change at the engine manufacturing facility or maybe the dealer had to fix something in the 6 months the poor thing sat unloved on the lot. Or maybe itís a lab error.

But Iíll try a different oil and resample. Engine works great otherwise:no measurable oil consumption, terrific fuel economy, more than adequate power, etc. And minimal fuel dilution for a DI Honda. Easily the best new car Iíve owned.


Edited by Danh (05/09/18 04:36 PM)

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#4753654 - 05/11/18 12:47 AM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
HondaBroMike Offline


Registered: 11/02/17
Posts: 312
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.
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#4753948 - 05/11/18 09:06 AM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
Danh Offline


Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 1763
Loc: .
Want to take the opportunity to compliment Oil Analyzers/Polaris, the source of this UOA.

I responded to the first UOA noting I had never seen a Honda engine with nickel reported as a wear metal and asking if a lab error was possible. They immediately ordered a retest and I received the results the following day.

Wear metals on the retest remained the same, so the nickel mystery remains. But lots of credit to OAI for indulging the concerns of a very small client. Nice people to do business with.

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#4754116 - 05/11/18 11:17 AM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: HondaBroMike]
OVERKILL Offline


Registered: 04/28/08
Posts: 36602
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.
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#4754164 - 05/11/18 12:11 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: OVERKILL]
tig1 Offline


Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 13720
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.

I fully agree.
_________________________
2007 Ford Fusion 228,000 miles
M1 0-20 EP
2017 Ford Fusion 52K
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10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF and MC LV
M1 10-30 in all OPE
MC filters


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#4754965 - 05/12/18 10:50 AM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: OVERKILL]
PimTac Online   content


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 4615
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.




Iím surprised anyone would say their oil filter gave them more power. HBM is just fishing for reaction. Kids like to do that.
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter


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#4755448 - 05/12/18 10:19 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: PimTac]
HondaBroMike Offline


Registered: 11/02/17
Posts: 312
Originally Posted By: PimTac
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.


You look like a kid, thunktac. Your valvoline ain't doing squat for you, much less what I get with the Ideitsu, JUNIIOR_mints.



Iím surprised anyone would say their oil filter gave them more power. HBM is just fishing for reaction. Kids like to do that.
_________________________


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#4767429 - 05/24/18 10:01 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
Artem Offline


Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 5131
Loc: Florida
Oil change making car faster

Not sure what some of you are yappin' about. It's been proven that fresh oil performs better then old oil. Just because you can't feel a 5hp increase with your old poorly calibrated butt dyno, doesn't mean someone else can't either.
_________________________
2014 Mazda 3 Hatch 2.0L & 6spd - Idemitsu 0w20 Synthetic @ $0.75 a quart. (thanks Advance Auto Parts for the awesome deal)

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#4767589 - 05/25/18 07:35 AM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Artem]
OVERKILL Offline


Registered: 04/28/08
Posts: 36602
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: Artem
Oil change making car faster

Not sure what some of you are yappin' about. It's been proven that fresh oil performs better then old oil. Just because you can't feel a 5hp increase with your old poorly calibrated butt dyno, doesn't mean someone else can't either.


A manual car driven at different times under uncontrolled conditions is hardly what I'd call scientifically sound data to support your posit.
_________________________
2018 RAM 1500 Big Horn EcoDiesel
2016 Grand Cherokee SRT

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#4768067 - 05/25/18 05:03 PM Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh]
Artem Offline


Registered: 10/30/10
Posts: 5131
Loc: Florida
Agreed, but that's just one example. I've seen dyno runs as well which showed more power on fresh Lube. I'll let you google that one up, if it's a subject of interest.

My cars always feel more peppy with new one, even if the drained oil only had 3,000 miles on it.
_________________________
2014 Mazda 3 Hatch 2.0L & 6spd - Idemitsu 0w20 Synthetic @ $0.75 a quart. (thanks Advance Auto Parts for the awesome deal)

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