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2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro #4752027
05/09/18 01:16 PM
05/09/18 01:16 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,782
.
Danh Offline OP
Danh  Offline OP
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,782
.


This was the carís third oil change since new, the last being very short because of an upcoming trip.

Two comments:

The oil is Idemistu Zepro 0w-20 with Molybdenum. Havenít seen this in a UOA before, so thought it would be of interest. And the 625ppm of Moly says the label doesnít lie.

My primary reason for the UOA was looking for fuel dilution, which is an issue with the other Honda K24W engine in our household. But 2.3% dilution is truly negligible for a DI engine and Iím happy with that. Viscosity is hanging in there, too.

Questions:

Nickel is an unexpected finding. My other K24W showed none in any UOA and this has me puzzled: is nickel even used in Honda K24s? I donít recall ever hearing nickel was an oil additive. Admittedly 4ppm is not much, but any ideas?

Aluminum is still on the high side, but as the car only had 3,700 miles or so when this fill was added I guess this could still be residue from break in and some additional break-in wear. Given some copper is still showing up, might break-in be the answer?

This sample included quite a few highway miles and the OLM said 70% oil life remaining (60-70%) at the time of sampling. With the TBN of 5.67, this seems about right.

So, while Iím happy with the fuel dilution and other wear metals, any general comments or on nickel and aluminum would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Last edited by Danh; 05/09/18 01:34 PM.
Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4752037
05/09/18 01:34 PM
05/09/18 01:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,480
Soviet State of Washington
PimTac Online content
PimTac  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,480
Soviet State of Washington
Isnít nickel used in bearings?


2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter

Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4752047
05/09/18 01:52 PM
05/09/18 01:52 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 597
Canada
nap Offline
nap  Offline
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 597
Canada
Nickel: fuel pump -> fuel dilution -> UOA

Far fetched but not impossible.

Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4752112
05/09/18 03:25 PM
05/09/18 03:25 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,480
Soviet State of Washington
PimTac Online content
PimTac  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,480
Soviet State of Washington


2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter

Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4752127
05/09/18 03:49 PM
05/09/18 03:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,211
Rabbit Creek, Alaska
jayg Offline
jayg  Offline
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Posts: 1,211
Rabbit Creek, Alaska
Nickel could be valvetrain, wrist pins, but on a newer Honda with only 4 ppm I'd bet on some tiny amount of residual factory anti-seize.




Watch it but don't sweat it. If you still have some after a few more oil changes, switch oil and see what happens.


Ď17 Ram 1500 Ecodiesel- RT6 5w40
'15 Prius C Napa 0w20
'73 240Z 10w30 VWC from '73
'73 Triumph Tiger 750 M1 5w50
'67 BSA 441 Victor Special M1 5w50




Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: jayg] #4752169
05/09/18 04:35 PM
05/09/18 04:35 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,782
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Danh Offline OP
Danh  Offline OP
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,782
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Originally Posted By: jayg
Nickel could be valvetrain, wrist pins, but on a newer Honda with only 4 ppm I'd bet on some tiny amount of residual factory anti-seize.




Watch it but don't sweat it. If you still have some after a few more oil changes, switch oil and see what happens.


Thanks for the thought. I have yet to see a Honda that didnít report 0 for nickel, so it would seem it isnít used in engines or in anti-seize compounds. But maybe there was a short-term anti-seize change at the engine manufacturing facility or maybe the dealer had to fix something in the 6 months the poor thing sat unloved on the lot. Or maybe itís a lab error.

But Iíll try a different oil and resample. Engine works great otherwise:no measurable oil consumption, terrific fuel economy, more than adequate power, etc. And minimal fuel dilution for a DI Honda. Easily the best new car Iíve owned.

Last edited by Danh; 05/09/18 04:36 PM.
Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4753654
05/11/18 12:47 AM
05/11/18 12:47 AM
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 312
HondaBroMike Offline
HondaBroMike  Offline
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 312
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.



Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4753948
05/11/18 09:06 AM
05/11/18 09:06 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,782
.
Danh Offline OP
Danh  Offline OP
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,782
.
Want to take the opportunity to compliment Oil Analyzers/Polaris, the source of this UOA.

I responded to the first UOA noting I had never seen a Honda engine with nickel reported as a wear metal and asking if a lab error was possible. They immediately ordered a retest and I received the results the following day.

Wear metals on the retest remained the same, so the nickel mystery remains. But lots of credit to OAI for indulging the concerns of a very small client. Nice people to do business with.

Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: HondaBroMike] #4754116
05/11/18 11:17 AM
05/11/18 11:17 AM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 37,187
Ontario, Canada
OVERKILL Offline
OVERKILL  Offline
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 37,187
Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.


2018 RAM 1500 Big Horn EcoDiesel
2016 Grand Cherokee SRT
Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: OVERKILL] #4754164
05/11/18 12:11 PM
05/11/18 12:11 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 13,837
Illinois
tig1 Offline
tig1  Offline
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 13,837
Illinois
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.

I fully agree.


2007 Ford Fusion 232,000 miles
M1 0-20 EP
2017 Ford Fusion 55K
M1 0-20 EP
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF and MC LV
M1 10-30 in all OPE
MC filters

Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: OVERKILL] #4754965
05/12/18 10:50 AM
05/12/18 10:50 AM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,480
Soviet State of Washington
PimTac Online content
PimTac  Online Content
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,480
Soviet State of Washington
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.




Iím surprised anyone would say their oil filter gave them more power. HBM is just fishing for reaction. Kids like to do that.


2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter

Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: PimTac] #4755448
05/12/18 10:19 PM
05/12/18 10:19 PM
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 312
HondaBroMike Offline
HondaBroMike  Offline
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 312
Originally Posted By: PimTac
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: HondaBroMike
I just put in IDemitsu 0w-20 SN and its giving me more power in combo with the Tough Guard oil filter!! SUrprisingly, the FE isn't any more or any less but the power seems to be up across al range but better power before 2000 RPM.


No it isn't.

There's no way two oils of the same grade are going to yield power differences enough to be felt (which is roughly around 20HP, IIRC). This is all in your head.


You look like a kid, thunktac. Your valvoline ain't doing squat for you, much less what I get with the Ideitsu, JUNIIOR_mints.



Iím surprised anyone would say their oil filter gave them more power. HBM is just fishing for reaction. Kids like to do that.



Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4767429
05/24/18 10:01 PM
05/24/18 10:01 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,287
Florida
Artem Offline
Artem  Offline
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,287
Florida
Oil change making car faster

Not sure what some of you are yappin' about. It's been proven that fresh oil performs better then old oil. Just because you can't feel a 5hp increase with your old poorly calibrated butt dyno, doesn't mean someone else can't either.


2014 Mazda 3 Hatch 2.0L & 6spd - Idemitsu 0w20 Synthetic @ $0.75 a quart. (thanks Advance Auto Parts for the awesome deal)
Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Artem] #4767589
05/25/18 07:35 AM
05/25/18 07:35 AM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 37,187
Ontario, Canada
OVERKILL Offline
OVERKILL  Offline
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 37,187
Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: Artem
Oil change making car faster

Not sure what some of you are yappin' about. It's been proven that fresh oil performs better then old oil. Just because you can't feel a 5hp increase with your old poorly calibrated butt dyno, doesn't mean someone else can't either.


A manual car driven at different times under uncontrolled conditions is hardly what I'd call scientifically sound data to support your posit.


2018 RAM 1500 Big Horn EcoDiesel
2016 Grand Cherokee SRT
Re: 2017 Acura TLX 2.4L, 4,441 Miles Idemitsu Zepro [Re: Danh] #4768067
05/25/18 05:03 PM
05/25/18 05:03 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,287
Florida
Artem Offline
Artem  Offline
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,287
Florida
Agreed, but that's just one example. I've seen dyno runs as well which showed more power on fresh Lube. I'll let you google that one up, if it's a subject of interest.

My cars always feel more peppy with new one, even if the drained oil only had 3,000 miles on it.


2014 Mazda 3 Hatch 2.0L & 6spd - Idemitsu 0w20 Synthetic @ $0.75 a quart. (thanks Advance Auto Parts for the awesome deal)
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