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#4746591 - 05/03/18 11:16 AM Engine Noise vs Wear Protection
dogememe Offline


Registered: 04/15/17
Posts: 816
Loc: SF BAY AREA, CA
So, I made a thread yesterday about Motorcraft oil being noisy in my 2.5L Escape and how VAS/SynPower made it noticeably quieter. What I didn't mention is that whatever bulk oil came in my Vic was quieter while after putting in the same oil as the Escape (VAS/SynPower) it's a tad noisier. I was planning to standardize my oil across all three vehicles but I haven't changed the oil in the Suburban yet since I pretty much don't drive it, though I'm tempted to because I'd be curious if the VAS/SynPower makes any difference in noise in that one compared to the Chevron Supreme that's in there now. I just want to minimize how much oil I have on hand and I picked VAS/SynPower because it's name brand, quality, and available for about $22 on Walmart or Amazon and always in stock.

TL;DR: What really I want to know is if less engine noise = better wear protection, or just that different oils have different properties that change the noise.


Edited by dogememe (05/03/18 11:17 AM)
_________________________
2007 Crown Vic P71 4.6 ~124K Miles, Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 5W-30, Royal Purple Filter, Daily Driver.
2010 Escape FWD 2.5 ~78K Miles, Castrol Edge EP 5W-30, Wix Filter, Rented on Turo.

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#4746597 - 05/03/18 11:26 AM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
PimTac Offline


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 4950
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
Generally the quieter a engine runs the better but it depends on the source of the noise. Obviously noise from valvetrains or bearing noise would not be a good sign.

I think you cannot equate the two.
_________________________
2017 Mazda CX-5 Grand Touring

Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Mobil 1 M108A EP filter


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#4746632 - 05/03/18 12:14 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
Camprunner Offline


Registered: 02/19/08
Posts: 1044
Loc: MA.
My 2013 Mustang 5.0 V8 was noticeably quieter running Valvoline Synthetic than Motorcraft oil.

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#4746636 - 05/03/18 12:19 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: Camprunner]
dogememe Offline


Registered: 04/15/17
Posts: 816
Loc: SF BAY AREA, CA
Originally Posted By: Camprunner
My 2013 Mustang 5.0 V8 was noticeably quieter running Valvoline Synthetic than Motorcraft oil.


So, Motorcraft is noisy, but what I'm trying to understand is if the noise is actually wear occurring in the engine, and quieter engines are wearing less, or the noise is just a noise.
_________________________
2007 Crown Vic P71 4.6 ~124K Miles, Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 5W-30, Royal Purple Filter, Daily Driver.
2010 Escape FWD 2.5 ~78K Miles, Castrol Edge EP 5W-30, Wix Filter, Rented on Turo.

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#4746649 - 05/03/18 12:32 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
racin4ds Offline


Registered: 05/07/10
Posts: 1046
Loc: Ocala, Florida
IMO as a long time mechanic any additional noise is no good! The quieter an engine is, the smoother and better it is running. Mechanical noise can never be a good thing! Think about it... if you have piston slap, rocker arm noise, lifter tapping, cam chain noise whatever and it gets quieter with a certain oil, that oil is protecting better, cushioning the part and dampening the sound.

Noise is the sole reason I won't use Mobil 1...


Edited by racin4ds (05/03/18 12:32 PM)
_________________________
Just say NO to thin oils and M1!
05 F350 Powerstroke
05 Hyundai Tucson
08 Legacy GT
2008 Kawasaki Ninja 650R

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#4746667 - 05/03/18 12:50 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: racin4ds]
AirgunSavant Offline


Registered: 07/22/15
Posts: 3772
Loc: MD
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
IMO as a long time mechanic any additional noise is no good! The quieter an engine is, the smoother and better it is running. Mechanical noise can never be a good thing! Think about it... if you have piston slap, rocker arm noise, lifter tapping, cam chain noise whatever and it gets quieter with a certain oil, that oil is protecting better, cushioning the part and dampening the sound.

Noise is the sole reason I won't use Mobil 1...


Same with airguns- usually a mechanism will tell you what it likes and what it doesn't.
The problem is that the most vocal naysayers are usually half deaf.

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#4746670 - 05/03/18 12:53 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: racin4ds]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 9686
Loc: Upper Midwest
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
IMO as a long time mechanic any additional noise is no good! The quieter an engine is, the smoother and better it is running. Mechanical noise can never be a good thing! Think about it... if you have piston slap, rocker arm noise, lifter tapping, cam chain noise whatever and it gets quieter with a certain oil, that oil is protecting better, cushioning the part and dampening the sound.

Noise is the sole reason I won't use Mobil 1...

That of course is only conjecture as I've used Mobil 1 products almost exclusively in all my cars since new. I have neither excessive wear nor abnormal UOAs when I've done them, and everything is still running fine at their advanced miles. So my conclusion is that if this "excessive noise" which I personally haven't experienced actually exists, it means nothing.
_________________________
1994 BMW 530i, 228K
1996 Honda Accord, 263K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 398K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 267K

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#4746688 - 05/03/18 01:26 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 12127
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
I don't like noisy engines, it ruins the experience; though Sometimes quieter is MORE powerful sometime not. Ive run overly viscous oil that made an engine VERY quiet but it revved slowly and ruined the driving experience.

Most noise problem i've had in the past decade have gone to filter design or viscosity out of range LOW (and were immediately corrected by substituting the offending part or material.
_________________________
2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#9 41392mi-QSUD10W30 + M110A CHAMP Filter; 2017 Subaru Crosstrek CVT OC#2 ?? mi-SOA/Idemitsu 0w20 + SOA Filter

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#4746717 - 05/03/18 01:52 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
burla Offline


Registered: 11/07/16
Posts: 257
Loc: sonoma
In order to answer that question you would need an engine with somewhere around 70k so the wear numbers are stabilized and to do 2 uoa's on two equal runs on either oil (maybe a clean oil flush before both runs), multiplied by a control group of around 10 or better to see trends. Anything else on either side is just a shot in the dark. We have been trying to come up with answers on this for over 5 years in hemi forums, and we have also been trying to see trends just 5w20 versus 5w30 and wear. The fact is after 5 years and some people giving it a yeomens try, the only thing we have been able to ascertain are some oils will quiet engines more then others, as in zero doubt on that. However, being able to discern anything else meaningful has been elusive. I find it very interesting people throw in the information that it makes zero difference as a matter of fact. I would like to see proof before ever saying that. In fact if anything, I believe the opposite, but I'm not willing to commit to that w/o proof. The fact is many manufacturers are going up in weight because of widespread damage of trying to go "thin". FCA eco diesel is a perfect example, why would they go up in weight if it doesn't matter? So back to the point, do some oils the same weight protect better and would a sign of that be engine noise? It is at least possible.

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#4746725 - 05/03/18 01:57 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
ridgerunner Offline


Registered: 01/14/09
Posts: 818
Loc: PA
I have a 94 Ford Ranger w 4.0 OHV engine that is known for valvetrain noise. I have used lots of different oils and weights of oils to help with noise. I’ve tried lots of x-30 and some 10w-40 in dino and synth. Even added some Shaffers Moly EP. It calls for 5-30. I am now running Amsoil 0-20 SS in it and it is quieter now than ever go figure.

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#4746731 - 05/03/18 02:10 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: kschachn]
4WD Offline


Registered: 09/21/10
Posts: 6891
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
IMO as a long time mechanic any additional noise is no good! The quieter an engine is, the smoother and better it is running. Mechanical noise can never be a good thing! Think about it... if you have piston slap, rocker arm noise, lifter tapping, cam chain noise whatever and it gets quieter with a certain oil, that oil is protecting better, cushioning the part and dampening the sound.

Noise is the sole reason I won't use Mobil 1...

That of course is only conjecture as I've used Mobil 1 products almost exclusively in all my cars since new. I have neither excessive wear nor abnormal UOAs when I've done them, and everything is still running fine at their advanced miles. So my conclusion is that if this "excessive noise" which I personally haven't experienced actually exists, it means nothing.


Ditto. … no noise in 3 decades and not one technical theory offered how lubricants with the same properties produced noise …
And when I tested PUP louder than M1 … did not change my opinion of that oil …
So what do they call the SAE noise test … want to look up that database

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#4746757 - 05/03/18 02:40 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 9686
Loc: Upper Midwest
Remember though, the question isn't whether some oils make more noise than others. It is whether that noise is detrimental and indicates diminished "wear protection."
_________________________
1994 BMW 530i, 228K
1996 Honda Accord, 263K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 398K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 267K

Top
#4746785 - 05/03/18 03:10 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
JLTD Offline


Registered: 12/15/17
Posts: 933
Loc: US
Originally Posted By: dogememe
So, I made a thread yesterday about Motorcraft oil being noisy in my 2.5L Escape and how VAS/SynPower made it noticeably quieter. What I didn't mention is that whatever bulk oil came in my Vic was quieter while after putting in the same oil as the Escape (VAS/SynPower) it's a tad noisier. I was planning to standardize my oil across all three vehicles but I haven't changed the oil in the Suburban yet since I pretty much don't drive it, though I'm tempted to because I'd be curious if the VAS/SynPower makes any difference in noise in that one compared to the Chevron Supreme that's in there now. I just want to minimize how much oil I have on hand and I picked VAS/SynPower because it's name brand, quality, and available for about $22 on Walmart or Amazon and always in stock.

TL;DR: What really I want to know is if less engine noise = better wear protection, or just that different oils have different properties that change the noise.


Speculation without data. Do a couple of UOAs with each oil and see if there is a difference in wear metals.
_________________________
Hers: 2008 Jeep Liberty 138k, AMSOIL® SS 5w30/Amsoil

His: 2015 4Runner 41k, AMSOIL® OE 5w20/Wix

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#4746854 - 05/03/18 04:13 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
deven Offline


Registered: 06/28/05
Posts: 3433
Loc: Massachusetts
The sole reason why I use Royal Purple HPS in my cars is because it runs the quietest and smoothest. Plus it really improves my driving experience as I put quietness at the forefront and the reason why I drive the RLX.
_________________________
Proud user of ROYAL PURPLE products!

2016 Acura RLX Sports Hybrid(Royal Purple HPS 5w30 + M1-110 oil filter)

KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID. IT'S ONLY OIL

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#4746873 - 05/03/18 04:30 PM Re: Engine Noise vs Wear Protection [Re: dogememe]
BAJA_05 Offline


Registered: 02/04/18
Posts: 411
Loc: Chester County/Pa.
To the OP -- if you like quiet -- do an oil change with QSUD. Still cheaper then VSP.
_________________________
2017 VW Jetta SE TSI 1.4L Turbo (hers)
M1 Euro 0W40 & FU (19K)
2008 Acura TL 3.2L QSHM 5W20 & FU (103K)
2005 Subaru Baja AWD 2.5L N/A 5spd.
Rotella T6 5W30 & Wix (91K)

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