Using BITOG Knowledge on Your Mechanic

[camrydriver111]

For those of you that don't do major service on your own car have you ever had motor oil discussions with your mechanic?

Do you ever get the feeling that you know more about motor oil? They are busy wrenching on cars, they probably don't want to come home to research which synthetic uses Group IV base oils, which oil filter has the best pleats, etc. Of course this is a generalization.

Have you ever impressed anyone with your oil knowledge? Perhaps angered them? Disagreements on oil or OCIs?

What kind of motor oil discussions have you have when you get your car serviced?

 

[JC1]

Don`t have that issue, I do 95% of the repairs on my vehicles. Don`t need to get into a debate with someone else.

It`s scary how little people know about oil changes. At my work probably less than 5% of the guys do their own work on their cars.

People at work ask for advice. One guy has a 1999 Camry lives in an apartment building. Some old lady had some old tires stashed next to her car by some other tennant. She called the Fire Marshall. Fire Marshall did a full inspection of the underground garage and told a co-worker that their car had an oil leak and they had 48 hours to comply.... Guy was scared since he couldn`t get that leak fixed on the weekend.

Went to the Stealership (Toyota), who told him that the repair would be more than $1000. Came and talked to me and I said let`s try some Liqui Moly Motor oil saver and see if the leak slows down. Toyota doesn`t want to help you, then want to pad their pockets.

After a week he was impressed. I told him to clean up the oil on the garage floor with some kitty litter and dish soap. Tell the Fire Marshall to screw off.

 

[deven]

You may know more about motor oil on paper or internet forum but they know more about motor oil from wrenching daily in real life....

 

[JC1]

Originally Posted By: deven
You may know more about motor oil on paper or internet forum but they know more about motor oil from wrenching daily in real life....


Yeah they know how to over-torque every type of drain pan bolt and oil filter for 95% of all vehicles built in the last 20 years ;-)

 

[Chris142]

I mentioned to a guy at the motorcycle shop that I was not using an oil without a pic of a motorcycle on the bottle. Guy went ballistic! Said I'm going to ruin my engine.

 

[IndyIan]

I've had the long OCI conversation once. They would still happily change the oil every 3k miles and I was doing more like 6k at the time. He had the oil is cheap/engines expensive argument , but I just said for my usage I feel fine running a longer OCI and my car will be crushed before the engine wears out, and so far we are both right. He's never lost an engine running 3k OCI's and I've never had one break down running my OCI's.
I haven't and won't mention run the FU for 16-18k miles for two OCI's now.

 

[deven]

Originally Posted By: JC1
Originally Posted By: deven
You may know more about motor oil on paper or internet forum but they know more about motor oil from wrenching daily in real life....


Yeah they know how to over-torque every type of drain pan bolt and oil filter for 95% of all vehicles built in the last 20 years ;-)

With any profession there are guys that are good at their jobs and then there are guys that are bad. ;=)

 

[demarpaint]

Years ago when I sold cars we'd send a large portion of used cars to a local shop to do oil changes, tune ups, etc. to get them ready for sale. I'd often speak with him and talk cars, repairs, oil, etc. he was a nice guy. He swore by Lucas Oil Stabilizer, as a result if I were to have a shop do work on one of my cars it wouldn't have been his.

 

[Sonic]

I stopped in a Walmart I'd not been into before so of course I had to look at the oil. One of the guys who works in the garage came out to see what I needed because he said I looked confused. Right off the bat he acted like he was going to school me in oil since I had been standing there so long. He figured I was totally lost. No, I was just taking in all the pricing on what was available and that's what I told him. He started talking and didn't shut up for about 10 minutes. He must have covered every oil myth in the book and wanted to make sure I understood this all as 'fact'. I kept my mouth shut at first but then calmly started disagreeing with him. Pretty much from that point I kept interrupting him and letting him know he was completely wrong and that some research on his end would do him some good. I ended up having to walk away from him and he was not happy. He was losing his cool.

 

[JC1]

Originally Posted By: deven
With any profession there are guys that are good at their jobs and then there are guys that are bad. ;=)

Aint that the truth. Scary thing is that the same can be said for Doctors.

 

[JohnnyJohnson]

Originally Posted By: deven
With any profession there are guys that are good at their jobs and then there are guys that are bad. ;=)

I don't care where you work there are three kinds of employees
"The Good, the Bad and the Ugly"!

 

[AirgunSavant]

Why would an automotive mechanic be an expert on motor oil when all he has to know is what spec the
manufacturer recommends? When you are in the trenches daily you are not as well read as a 14 yr old who knows all the info but has no practical experience. I was that way as a kid with guns. But you will find most sales staff have a job and many don't know or care about what they sell. It is a job and wages- not good but it is the reality.

Just a comment- nothing on you of course.

 

[bumpasmerc]

Originally Posted By: deven
You may know more about motor oil on paper or internet forum but they know more about motor oil from wrenching daily in real life....


I support that statement based on a conversation with my mechanic. He was working on a late model Chev 3.6 and I asked him if they were a good engine.

He said that they are good if the oil is changed frequently. He explained that the timing chains, guides and tensioners specifically, wear quickly on that engine if the OCI is too long. Also the timing chains stretch more with extended OCIs. He said oil life monitors are a poor indicator of potential wear on certain engines, the Chev 3.6 for example. He recommends 3000 mi OCIs when using conventional oils. I don't know what he recommends for synthetics. My guess would be 5000 mi.

Thinking about his comments, he really is supporting what has been stated often in this forum, and that is that timing chain systems are hard on motor oils because they cause extensive oil shearing. They are among the engine components that cause the worst shearing .

I don't know if he knows what oil shear is, but he does know from experience how damaging long OCIs can be on certain engines. He told me the cost for a timing chain job on that engine (I forget the amount) and it was expensive.

When I told him I was looking at a late model Impala 3.6 he said it could be a risky purchase if the PO had only changed the oil based on the OLM.

 

[AirgunSavant]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Years ago when I sold cars we'd send a large portion of used cars to a local shop to do oil changes, tune ups, etc. to get them ready for sale. I'd often speak with him and talk cars, repairs, oil, etc. he was a nice guy. He swore by Lucas Oil Stabilizer, as a result if I were to have a shop do work on one of my cars it wouldn't have been his.

He probably spoke of it as an upsell product but had no real faith in it.
That in itself would be a reason to go away but I doubt he really believed in it.
Of course if it pours well it's good.

 

[Virtus_Probi]

Originally Posted By: JohnnyJohnson

I don't care where you work there are three kinds of employees
"The Good, the Bad and the Ugly"!

Call me an old softy, but the scene where Clint/Blondie gives the dying young soldier a couple drags off his smoke is one of the greatest in movie history IMHO.
That was also the point where that character picked up his signature poncho after leaving his coat on the kid's body...

I was totally disgusted when I went to change the oil in my daughter's Impreza and either the dealer or Midas had totally mangled the drain plug.
I ended up using my extractor and still need to pick up a new plug for whenever I wrangle that gouged piece of metal off of there.

 

[Subsidy2295]

I have been a dealership mechanic for almost 20 years and can honestly say that the majority of people here know more about oil than dealership service staff. But the thing is, we don't need to know, and it doesn't matter as much as people here make it seem (in my opinion).

At my work, we use Toyota motor oil in 0w-16, 0w-20, and 5w-20. Our 5w-30 is a bulk synthetic blend SN (it has a sticker on the tank which most likely says who makes it, but I keep forgetting to look). We keep bottles of Mobil 1 in case we do an oil change on a GM product that needs dexos. Because these are the only oils we use, knowing the ins and outs of various other oils, while interesting, is not knowledge that helps with the day to day of our jobs. I have never seen anyone at work take a sample of oil and send it out to check its quality. If I am performing diagnostics for a noise or VVT issue and have concerns about what oil is in the engine, I drain the oil and put in the Toyota oil that is specified for the vehicle. If I have concerns about sludge or other signs of oil related problems, I might ask for some oil change receipts, and as long as you can show you have done the bare minimum of service, you are off the hook. You can run 0w-30 in a 0w20 car all you want, it won't cause a problem and I have no way of checking anyway.

In my experience, original oil quality has caused maybe 0-1% of the engine failures I have seen. No oil, no coolant, excessive oil change intervals, and manufacture defects/design flaws are all way bigger hazards to your engine. If you buy a Toyota (or other car) and do the recommended maintenance per your owners manual, using either genuine parts or their equivalent, you don't need to know dittly poop about oil.

This is a fun place to come and talk about oil. But end of the day it really doesn't matter as long as it meets spec.

(I am mostly a diagnostic technician now, but still do a few oil changes a week. I hate over tightened oil drain plugs and filters more that anybody. Don't let a few bad actors make you think that all mechanics suck.)

 

[newbe46]

Originally Posted By: JC1
Originally Posted By: deven
You may know more about motor oil on paper or internet forum but they know more about motor oil from wrenching daily in real life....

Yeah they know how to over-torque every type of drain pan bolt and oil filter for 95% of all vehicles built in the last 20 years ;-)

So true

 

[Kestas]

There's something about motor oil and auto repair that brings out the testosterone in guys. All too often it is not facts and common sense that rule these conversations, but whoever can talk the best talk.

 

[newbe46]

Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: JohnnyJohnson

I don't care where you work there are three kinds of employees
"The Good, the Bad and the Ugly"!

Call me an old softy, but the scene where Clint/Blondie gives the dying young soldier a couple drags off his smoke is one of the greatest in movie history IMHO.
That was also the point where that character picked up his signature poncho after leaving his coat on the kid's body...

I was totally disgusted when I went to change the oil in my daughter's Impreza and either the dealer or Midas had totally mangled the drain plug.
I ended up using my extractor and still need to pick up a new plug for whenever I wrangle that gouged piece of metal off of there.


For the life of me, I don't understand to this day why they have to torque the drain bolt so hard.

Every time I do an oil change on a car that has oil changes done by a shop, dealership or independent, I always have a hard time taking it off. The next is the spin-on oil filter. If you have a drop-in filter, the filter housing is also over torqued. Every [censored] bolt is over torqued.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: AirgunSavant
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Years ago when I sold cars we'd send a large portion of used cars to a local shop to do oil changes, tune ups, etc. to get them ready for sale. I'd often speak with him and talk cars, repairs, oil, etc. he was a nice guy. He swore by Lucas Oil Stabilizer, as a result if I were to have a shop do work on one of my cars it wouldn't have been his.

He probably spoke of it as an upsell product but had no real faith in it.
That in itself would be a reason to go away but I doubt he really believed in it.
Of course if it pours well it's good.


No we discussed it. He actually believed the stuff protected an engine better than oil alone, especially during the cold winter. He said it kept the oil clinging to the engine internals long after it was turned off, this was most important during the cold weather. Oh and it would clean up a dirty engine, and a few other reasons. Those were two that stuck with me. LOL You're correct about the up sell part though. Only this guy actually believed his pitch, and used the stuff by the case.