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#4692522 - 03/12/18 02:40 PM Low Ash Content
RogerBacon Offline


Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 98
Loc: Ontario
If a diesel requires a low ash content oil because of the DEF filter, would it matter what the ash content was if the motor did not burn any oil? My Mercedes requires 229.51 which is hard to find and expensive. It does not burn ANY oil, so why does it need it. I will still run the good oil but I was just wondering.

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#4692550 - 03/12/18 03:09 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
dbias Offline


Registered: 12/24/14
Posts: 123
Loc: USA
It still matters as a modern diesel recycles exhaust gas with the EGR to lower O2 content to try and help with the Nox. The DPF only burns off soot not the ash. Ash can only be physically removed and the soot that burns off becomes ash so yes ash content matters and an extra buck on oil is way cheaper than replacing a DPF/
_________________________
2011 VW JETTA Castrol Edge 0W-40
2012 FORD TRANSIT CONNECT Castrol Edge 5W-20
2016 HONDA CIVIC COUPE Castrol Edge 0W-20
2017 AUDI A4 Ravenol SSL 0W-40

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#4692561 - 03/12/18 03:23 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
CT8 Offline


Registered: 10/09/14
Posts: 10733
Loc: Idaho
You for some reason you bought a Mercedes and the recommended oil is to expensive? Am I missing something
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Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity, we shall prevail

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#4692578 - 03/12/18 03:43 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
weasley Online   content


Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 735
Loc: UK
Theoretically if no oil goes down the exhaust then no ash will accumulate in the DPF and all is good. However, despite what you think, some oil IS being burnt and the ash IS accumulating in the DPF. It might not be much, but it IS happening (it is an inevitable process). Having a lower ash-forming oil will extend the time it takes to block the DPF, hopefully beyond the useful life of the car.
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#4692610 - 03/12/18 04:17 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: weasley]
d00df00d Online   content


Registered: 10/20/05
Posts: 11155
Loc: PA
Originally Posted By: weasley
Theoretically if no oil goes down the exhaust then no ash will accumulate in the DPF and all is good. However, despite what you think, some oil IS being burnt and the ash IS accumulating in the DPF. It might not be much, but it IS happening (it is an inevitable process). Having a lower ash-forming oil will extend the time it takes to block the DPF, hopefully beyond the useful life of the car.

^ This.
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#4692617 - 03/12/18 04:25 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
Kamele0N Offline


Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 2006
Loc: Slovenia
Originally Posted By: RogerBacon
My Mercedes requires 229.51 which is hard to find and expensive.


you have many DPF specs wich are almost side by side...

Quote:
GM Dexos 2
The GM Dexos 2 specification is meant to be the replacement for both GM-LL-A-025 (gasoline) and GM-LL-B-025 (diesel) specifications for the European market. Oils meeting GM Dexos 2 are required for vehicles manufactured from MY2011 onward but they are also backward compatible with older models. This specification is built on the ACEA C3 standard but also contains elements from the ILSAC GF-4 deposit formation test and low-temperature sludge build-up test.


Quote:
BMW Longlife-04 (BMW LL-04)
Special BMW approval for fully synthetic long-life oil. Viscosities are SAE 0W-30, 0W-40, 5W-30 and 5W-40. Usually required for BMWs equipped with a diesel particulate filter (DPF). Can also be used where a BMW Longlife-98 or BMW Longlife-01 oil is recommended.


Quote:
MB 229.51
Low SAPS Long Life engine oil for diesel engines with particle filter meeting emission EU-4 -> standards.


VAG is a little different and above other standards....it has stringest norms regarding wear and piston deposits....especially @LL interval

Quote:
VW 507.00
Low SAPS oils suitable for Euro 4 engines and almost all VAG diesel engines from 2000 onwards with extended service intervals, unitary injector pumps and also Pumpe-Düse ("PD") engines. Excludes V10, R5 engines and VW Commercial vehicles without fitted DPF (diesel particulate filters) – these must use a 506 01 specification oil.


https://www.oilspecifications.org/

So if you can get any other oil with specs above you can easily go away with that....especially that will not be a problem because you tend to change your oil sooner over the pond smile
_________________________
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1997 Toyota Landcruiser KZJ95 3.0 TD various 10w40

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#4692628 - 03/12/18 04:35 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 35728
Loc: Great Lakes
Originally Posted By: RogerBacon
My Mercedes requires 229.51 which is hard to find and expensive.
Canadian Tire carries Pennzoil Euro L 5w-30 which meets this spec, but yeah, not exactly cheap.
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#4692889 - 03/12/18 08:14 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: CT8]
Linctex Offline


Registered: 12/31/16
Posts: 5954
Loc: Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: CT8
You for some reason you bought a Mercedes and the recommended oil is to expensive? Am I missing something


You just described 80% of the M-B owners in Waco

Bald tires,
busted turn signal and headlight lenses,
huge scratches -
but HEY -
"I'm rollin' in a BENZ!"
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"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."

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#4692894 - 03/12/18 08:16 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: Quattro Pete]
Linctex Offline


Registered: 12/31/16
Posts: 5954
Loc: Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Canadian Tire carries Pennzoil Euro L 5w-30 which meets this spec, but yeah, not exactly cheap.


Walmart was selling 5 quart jugs the other day for $13 each. I grabbed three.
_________________________
"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."

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#4692897 - 03/12/18 08:18 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
Linctex Offline


Registered: 12/31/16
Posts: 5954
Loc: Waco, TX
_________________________
"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."

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#4692977 - 03/12/18 09:25 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: CT8]
RogerBacon Offline


Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 98
Loc: Ontario
"You for some reason you bought a Mercedes and the recommended oil is to expensive? Am I missing something"

Yes you are. I did not say it was too expensive, I said it was expensive. My question was why does it matter if the engine does not burn oil.


Edited by RogerBacon (03/12/18 09:37 PM)

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#4692979 - 03/12/18 09:27 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
Linctex Offline


Registered: 12/31/16
Posts: 5954
Loc: Waco, TX
I seriously doubt it matters if it doesn’t use oil.

Lots of cars burn a quart of oil every few thousand miles,
& still have catalytic devices that function perfectly
_________________________
"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."

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#4692992 - 03/12/18 09:43 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: Quattro Pete]
RogerBacon Offline


Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 98
Loc: Ontario
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
[quote=RogerBacon] My Mercedes requires 229.51 which is hard to find and expensive.
Canadian Tire carries Pennzoil Euro L 5w-30 which meets this spec, but yeah, not exactly cheap.
[/q

This seems to be a pretty good oil but I can not find the sulphated ash spec. Mobile 1 ESP is the best I found at .6

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#4692994 - 03/12/18 09:45 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: Linctex]
d00df00d Online   content


Registered: 10/20/05
Posts: 11155
Loc: PA
Originally Posted By: Linctex
I seriously doubt it matters if it doesn’t use oil.

Literally all cars burn some oil. The difference between one that "uses oil" and one that "doesn't" is just whether it burns enough to be noticed or require a top-off during the OCI.


Originally Posted By: Linctex
Lots of cars burn a quart of oil every few thousand miles,
& still have catalytic devices that function perfectly

I'm assuming by "function perfectly" you just mean "never degrade enough to trigger a CEL before the car gets junked". On that assumption, I agree.

Either way, the problem with catalytic converters is poisoning. The problem with DPFs is clogging. Those are two different things.
_________________________
2011 Mazda RX-8 R3
Mobil Super 5w-20

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#4692996 - 03/12/18 09:53 PM Re: Low Ash Content [Re: RogerBacon]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 35728
Loc: Great Lakes
Originally Posted By: RogerBacon
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
[quote=RogerBacon] My Mercedes requires 229.51 which is hard to find and expensive.
Canadian Tire carries Pennzoil Euro L 5w-30 which meets this spec, but yeah, not exactly cheap.
[/q

This seems to be a pretty good oil but I can not find the sulphated ash spec.

You need oil meeting mb 229.51 spec, and it does. Everything else is splitting hair - BITOG specialty.
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'02 530i (Edge 0W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T (Edge 5W-40)
'18 Charger SRT (FF)

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