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Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why #4684455
03/04/18 07:48 PM
03/04/18 07:48 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,002
OH
fdcg27 Offline OP
fdcg27  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,002
OH
We've had many posts in which members have claimed a sometimes drastic increase in oil consumption when changing brands. PP appears especially prominent in these claims.
I don't think I've ever seen this myself, but there are too many members claiming to have seen this for it to be dismissed as myth or mere anecdote.
I wonder why a change in brand of oil might cause any change in oil consumption?
What technical explanation might there be for this?
Higher volatility?
This would bring only a small increase.
Switching from an oil at the thicker end of the grade to one at the thinner end?
Again, not that much of a difference.
What might cause a very noticeable increase in oil consumption when doing no more than changing brands within the same grade?
Is this real? I think it is based upon the number of longtime members who say they've seen it.
The question is how we can explain this in rational terms.


17 Forester 12K MSS 0W-20
12 Accord LX 92K PP 5W-20
09 Forester 95K M1HM 10W-30
01 Focus ZX3 118K PP 5W-20
96 Accord LX 104K T5 10W-30
95 318i
Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: fdcg27] #4684463
03/04/18 07:56 PM
03/04/18 07:56 PM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,333
Winchester, Indiana
SubieRubyRoo Offline
SubieRubyRoo  Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,333
Winchester, Indiana
I think Mola or some of the other guys have chimed in on this before. Large changes in oil composition and additives can cause some "consumption" as the additives neutralize each other and interact. It's that chemistry stuff, above my head. I saw this when I switched my Forester from RT6 to Mobil1 0W40.

Therefore, I choose to stick all to Pennzoil synthetics. I've exclusively used PUP in my Fusion for the past 100k, and it still does not use any oil whatsoever, even over the last 17.2k OCI. It did thicken up just a hair, but with no top-off that's likely to be expected a little. I may drop back to 15k and not even bother checking UOAs anymore.

Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: fdcg27] #4684469
03/04/18 07:57 PM
03/04/18 07:57 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,651
PNW
ZeeOSix Offline
ZeeOSix  Offline
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,651
PNW
I haven't seen any drastic changes in oil consumption on my cars or trucks, but don't switch oils much. My Hayabusa would use way more Mobil 1 full synthetic motorcycle oil than Valvoline or any other conventional motorcycle oil - same weight used, 10W-40. I'd think high volatility certainly does play a role. One reason I look for oils that have a low NOACK.

Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: fdcg27] #4684479
03/04/18 08:05 PM
03/04/18 08:05 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,794
Florida, Cape Coral
Eddie Offline
Eddie  Offline
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,794
Florida, Cape Coral
I believe that increased oil consumption when changing brands is caused by a new mini-break-in. This can be caused by small difference in viscosity and different levels of different additives. I believe this because the oil consumption usually goes back to it original value after an oil change or two with the new oil. One reason I don't switch brands unless there is a good compelling reason. Ed


CX5 Touring 2.5L :-)
Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: fdcg27] #4684550
03/04/18 09:17 PM
03/04/18 09:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,755
Crawfordville FL
SilverFusion2010 Offline
SilverFusion2010  Offline
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,755
Crawfordville FL
Id be interested in the chemistry stuff going on if one of our formulators could chime in


2010 Ford Fusion SE 3.0L V6, 178k miles M1 HM 10w-30
Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: Eddie] #4684576
03/04/18 09:40 PM
03/04/18 09:40 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Originally Posted By: Eddie
I believe that increased oil consumption when changing brands is caused by a new mini-break-in.


It's caused by the existing "Tribo-Chemical Barrier" being UTTERLY DESTROYED
by the new formulation, and as the new TCB is formed in its place instead!

grin crackmeup LOL grin2


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: Eddie] #4684605
03/04/18 10:04 PM
03/04/18 10:04 PM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,229
Minnesota
philipp10 Offline
philipp10  Offline
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,229
Minnesota
Originally Posted By: Eddie
I believe that increased oil consumption when changing brands is caused by a new mini-break-in. This can be caused by small difference in viscosity and different levels of different additives. I believe this because the oil consumption usually goes back to it original value after an oil change or two with the new oil. One reason I don't switch brands unless there is a good compelling reason. Ed


And what would be this magical oil usage mechanism?

Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: Linctex] #4684607
03/04/18 10:05 PM
03/04/18 10:05 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,595
Taiwan
Ducked Offline
Ducked  Offline
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,595
Taiwan
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Originally Posted By: Eddie
I believe that increased oil consumption when changing brands is caused by a new mini-break-in.


It's caused by the existing "Tribo-Chemical Barrier" being UTTERLY DESTROYED
by the new formulation, and as the new TCB is formed in its place instead!

grin crackmeup LOL grin2


But seriously though, this would make some sense for increased wear. It makes no apparent sense for increased consumption.

(Unless the tribolayer seals leaks, which I don't think it will, much.)

Apart from volatility and viscosity difference, to explain that you'd have to go for something like a negative interaction between the VII's reducing the effective viscosity.

I dunno if there's any experimental evidence for that and if there is I bet it'll be hard to find.

Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: fdcg27] #4684612
03/04/18 10:06 PM
03/04/18 10:06 PM
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 36
MO USA
Larkin Offline
Larkin  Offline
Joined: Dec 2014
Posts: 36
MO USA
I've changed brand of oil in all my cars. Never had a issue!! The cars that use oil i had to add oil. The car that never had to add oil not a drop. Every 10k or 5k My feeling each oil has something to offer in the way of cleaning. Just my input

Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: fdcg27] #4684660
03/04/18 10:52 PM
03/04/18 10:52 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 2,285
Kansan,1911 45ACP fan
Marco620 Offline
Marco620  Offline
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 2,285
Kansan,1911 45ACP fan
I consumed a bit when going from 0w20 Castrol Magnatec to using the "Make The Switch" promo of PUP 0w20 of 1/4 qt over 5k miles and then none after that. Did 9-10k OCI with PUP 0w20 no issue.


15' Civic 179k.0w20 Redline/Archoil9100,Eibach,Yokohama/Borla Exhaust/Tein Suspension/Fu7317/Redline Si-1
Right to work state proud. Non union household
Re: Change in brand brings increase in consumption?Why [Re: fdcg27] #4684703
03/04/18 11:47 PM
03/04/18 11:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 44
Rockies
Konstantine Offline
Konstantine  Offline
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 44
Rockies
I would guess that the HTHS viscosity of the oil in service and the type of engine would be the biggest variables.


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