Recent Topics
Any 'crazy UCL overdose' fans out there?
by addyguy
06/17/18 07:11 PM
Source for Castrol Edge Supercar 5w50 oil?
by Rainier42
06/17/18 06:50 PM
Cherry vs orange hand cleaner
by JHZR2
06/17/18 06:27 PM
Why buy low mileage tires?
by HowAboutThis
06/17/18 05:49 PM
Mercury 35-8M0065104 cut open w/ oil change pics
by dlundblad
06/17/18 05:37 PM
2019 Honda’s miniMOTOs (125cc)
by DuckRyder
06/17/18 05:18 PM
Car Sales Scammers on Letgo
by ZZman
06/17/18 04:18 PM
Air shocks or Timbren for trailer towing ?
by Oldtom
06/17/18 04:10 PM
Which coil for a 2002 Focus Zetec?
by slacktide_bitog
06/17/18 04:07 PM
Blink -Roadside assistance, any experience?
by MoneyJohn
06/17/18 03:22 PM
Some garage art!
by ls1mike
06/17/18 03:12 PM
California Law
by PiperOne
06/17/18 02:37 PM
honda vs tyc a/c condenser?
by researcher
06/17/18 02:31 PM
To all the Fathers out there.
by rollinpete
06/17/18 01:37 PM
'14 Mercedes E350 Coupe - Castrol Edge 0w40
by FlyPenFly
06/17/18 01:08 PM
2007 Chrysler 4.0L SOHC engine - why 10w-30 req'd?
by 92saturnsl2
06/17/18 12:54 PM
you can see my crack when I dismount a tire
by eljefino
06/17/18 12:44 PM
Mobil 1™ Synthetic LV ATF HP
by Cup of Joe
06/17/18 11:44 AM
Coolant Flush - '07 Pacifica 4.0L
by 92saturnsl2
06/17/18 11:34 AM
Pan Drop or Fluid Through Dipstick
by TheLawnRanger
06/17/18 11:32 AM
Newest Members
Piper58, dunlop0078, Truth_Syrup, rjohn37, omatik
65256 Registered Users
Who's Online
88 registered (4WD, 2015_PSD, 69Torino, 2009Edge, 1JZ_E46, 8 invisible), 1469 Guests and 39 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
65256 Members
67 Forums
285482 Topics
4764486 Posts

Max Online: 3590 @ 01/24/17 08:07 PM
Donate to BITOG
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >
Topic Options
#4683467 - 03/03/18 06:13 PM 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating?
ZeeOSix Offline


Registered: 07/22/10
Posts: 17762
Loc: PNW
It's probably been discussed before, but what full synthetic motor oils have the lowest Volatility NOACK rating in 5W-20? I've found that a lot of manufactures don't always show the NOACK number.

Here's a chart I found for GF-5 rated 5W-30 ... but not sure if it would also apply to 5W-20.


Top
#4683502 - 03/03/18 06:45 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
JLTD Offline


Registered: 12/15/17
Posts: 641
Loc: US
I think each oil is different...for example Amsoil's website shows 5.8 NOACK on their 5w20 and 8.5 on their 0w20 - very different than the chart you posted.
_________________________
His: 2015 4Runner SR5 1GR-FE 37k, Amsoil OE 5w20/Wix
Testing vs Amsoil OE 5w30...then longer OCI on SS

Hers: 2008 Jeep Liberty 134k, Amsoil SS 5w30/Amsoil, minimum 10k oci

Top
#4683513 - 03/03/18 06:55 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39820
Loc: 'Stralia
I would intuit that a 5W20 would have a lower NOACK, all other things being equal, as they don't have to "stretch" it so far.

Looking at the PQIA results for same brands in 5W20 versus 5W30, it looks like a wash...maybe a slight edge to the 5W20, but not really enough to state as a fact.

Citgo Supergard - essentially the same.
http://pqiadata.org/CITGO_Supergard_5W30.html
http://www.pqiadata.org/CITGOSupergard5W20.html

Trop Arctic - essentially the same.
http://www.pqiadata.org/Phillips66TropArtic5W30.html
http://pqiadata.org/Phillips66_Trop_Artic_5W20.html

Assuming that they don't play games (like RP lineup having clearly different basestock blends through the range), I'd be comfortable using that chart that you have for choosing a 5W20.

Top
#4683543 - 03/03/18 07:18 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
CT8 Offline


Registered: 10/09/14
Posts: 10920
Loc: Idaho
Why do people worry about the lowest NOACK numbers.
_________________________
"Don't let your preconceived notions get in the way of facts."Geoff Metcalf"

Top
#4683549 - 03/03/18 07:20 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
BrocLuno Offline


Registered: 09/06/15
Posts: 5502
Loc: Kalifornia Kollective
Deposits I guess ...
_________________________
Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.

Top
#4683551 - 03/03/18 07:23 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
wemay Online   happy


Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 8860
Loc: Southeast Florida
Valvoline Full Synthetic lists theirs at 7.6%

https://sharena21.springcm.com/Public/Do...12-ac162d889bd1
_________________________
2017 Hyundai Sonata Sport 2.4L
2013 Hyundai Santa Fe Sport 2.0T

Top
#4683559 - 03/03/18 07:27 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
dailydriver Offline


Registered: 03/14/06
Posts: 9176
Loc: Pennsylbammyvania
I would use the Red Line in my 1.6 GDI EcoBoost, but fear for the high(er) calcium and ZDDP levels (higher moly content of EITHER type actually has been shown to help stave off LSPI), unless Dave can assure me otherwise. wink

The Ravenol 5W-30 DXG Dexos 1, Gen 2 formula I plan to use (once Blauparts has it in stock here in the states), has a NOACK right in there with the Red Line on that chart @ 6.0 (maybe because it has a similar base stock PAO/POE blend shrug and yeah, I know all about the GTL basestocks in the SOPUS products and how it also has low volatility percentage properties).

It is only a little bit thicker than almost any other 5W-20 I would use (@ a 3.1 HTHSV, Red Line is a 3.0 HTHSV), which is fine for a hard driven, summer OCI turbo GDI setup, and it also uses a trick anti-wear, anti-friction add pack of TRIMER moly and tungsten.
All this for about $2.50 less a liter than Red Line, with a detergent/dispersant pack designed specifically for GDI/turbo setups (I'm guessing that they substitute magnesium/boron/whatever for a high calcium content to get even it's modest 8.3 starting TBN, which is about the same as Red Line's anyway?) and their LSPI problems.
_________________________
2016 Ford Fiesta ST
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Amsoil Ea15K51 filter
Motul Gear 300 non-LS 75W-90

Top
#4683566 - 03/03/18 07:32 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: BrocLuno]
dailydriver Offline


Registered: 03/14/06
Posts: 9176
Loc: Pennsylbammyvania
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Deposits I guess ...


There is fairly strong evidence that a higher NOACK percentage helps accelerate/exacerbate back of intake valve deposit buildup on GDI engines, turbo/boosted GDIs even more so (unless they also have a secondary port injection system in conjunction with the DI, like the current Mustang 5.0 Coyote does). frown
_________________________
2016 Ford Fiesta ST
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Amsoil Ea15K51 filter
Motul Gear 300 non-LS 75W-90

Top
#4683573 - 03/03/18 07:38 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
eyeofthetiger Offline


Registered: 11/18/17
Posts: 683
Loc: South Carolina
I was trying to find this information for multiple oils, and settled on Valvoline with 7.6% NOACK. I couldn't find test numbers for half the oils I was looking up Also, the 9.3 TBN is pretty good, and it's only $22/5qts.
_________________________
2017 Ford Fiesta 1.0T - Valvoline SynPower 5W-20, Motorcraft FL910S
1988 GMC K1500 4.3/700R4 - Supertech 15W-40, Fram TG3980
1986 Ford Ranger 2.0 - uhh

Top
#4683591 - 03/03/18 07:55 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
madeej11 Offline


Registered: 06/22/15
Posts: 107
Loc: montreal ,canada
JLTD pretty well got it nailed with the Amsoil SS 5w20 at 5.8. Maybe Red Line might be lower but it may be at the high end as far as thickness goes. Then again I am a little biased towards Amsoil products

Top
#4683594 - 03/03/18 07:59 PM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: eyeofthetiger]
dailydriver Offline


Registered: 03/14/06
Posts: 9176
Loc: Pennsylbammyvania
Originally Posted By: eyeofthetiger
I was trying to find this information for multiple oils, and settled on Valvoline with 7.6% NOACK. I couldn't find test numbers for half the oils I was looking up Also, the 9.3 TBN is pretty good, and it's only $22/5qts.


Is that their 'new formula' "Modern Engine Oil" marketed for T/GDI setups?

Is there an additional Ford oil spec for your engine needed to be compatible with the oil contact timing belt, or is it the same 945-A as they require for my 1.6 which uses a dry timing belt?
_________________________
2016 Ford Fiesta ST
Ravenol REP 5W-30
Amsoil Ea15K51 filter
Motul Gear 300 non-LS 75W-90

Top
#4683866 - 03/04/18 08:29 AM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: CT8]
fdcg27 Online   content


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 15681
Loc: OH
Originally Posted By: CT8
Why do people worry about the lowest NOACK numbers.


A less volatile oil is less likely to bring ring sticking over time and miles.
This is a real concern with many current engines.
OTOH, I wonder what the NOACK numbers would have been for the various oils I used in various engines over the years with no problems?
_________________________
17 Forester 12K MSS 0W-20
12 Accord LX 86K PP 5W-20
09 Forester 95K M1HM 10W-30
01 Focus ZX3 118K PP 5W-20
96 Accord LX 104K T5 10W-30
95 318i

Top
#4683877 - 03/04/18 08:40 AM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
supton Offline


Registered: 11/09/08
Posts: 11909
Loc: NH
Does Noack change with age? Say as it gets some wear and tear. Does evaporation go up?

On the flip side, once the lighter compounds initially present in the oil evaporate off, does evaporation slow down?

In short, is Noack a constant?
_________________________
2011 Toyota Camry, base, 2.5L/6MT, 160k, hers
2010 Toyota Tundra DC, 4.6L/6AT, 143k, ours
1999 Toyota Camry LE, 2.2L/4AT, 181k, his

Top
#4683927 - 03/04/18 09:36 AM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: supton]
fdcg27 Online   content


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 15681
Loc: OH
NOACK is measured by a defined test protocol and represents a snapshot of what you'd see with fresh oil.
What you're really asking is how volatility changes with age.
My guess is that it would decline since the most volatile fractions would be evaporated out early in the OCI leaving behind what should be a less volatile blend.
OTOH, fuel dilution might make for greater volatility with use. Fuel dilution is often measured using flash point, which would depend upon volatility.
I'd love to hear from SOJ on this.
_________________________
17 Forester 12K MSS 0W-20
12 Accord LX 86K PP 5W-20
09 Forester 95K M1HM 10W-30
01 Focus ZX3 118K PP 5W-20
96 Accord LX 104K T5 10W-30
95 318i

Top
#4683956 - 03/04/18 10:08 AM Re: 5W-20 With Lowest Volitility NOACK Rating? [Re: ZeeOSix]
supton Offline


Registered: 11/09/08
Posts: 11909
Loc: NH
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
NOACK is measured by a defined test protocol and represents a snapshot of what you'd see with fresh oil.
What you're really asking is how volatility changes with age.
My guess is that it would decline since the most volatile fractions would be evaporated out early in the OCI leaving behind what should be a less volatile blend.
OTOH, fuel dilution might make for greater volatility with use. Fuel dilution is often measured using flash point, which would depend upon volatility.
I'd love to hear from SOJ on this.


That's what I'm thinking, a "high" Noack oil might settle down. Frequent oil changes with that oil would mean worse oil fumes for the PCV system to deal with.

However, in the past I'd swear that oil usage went up as the oil aged. That was 15-20 years ago on cheap conventional, so very likely not relevant here. But if Noack goes up with age, then frequent changes could fight the effects of a high Noack oil. Or that this oil just isn't worth using.
_________________________
2011 Toyota Camry, base, 2.5L/6MT, 160k, hers
2010 Toyota Tundra DC, 4.6L/6AT, 143k, ours
1999 Toyota Camry LE, 2.2L/4AT, 181k, his

Top
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >