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#4672614 - 02/20/18 11:56 PM Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK?
gfh77665 Offline


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 3789
Loc: Southeast Texas
Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK?

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#4672622 - 02/21/18 12:23 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
Garak Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 24574
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Some are on SAE J300 or have been proposed for it. Others haven't. wink
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Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, NAPA Gold 7356
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#4672628 - 02/21/18 12:38 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
Ducked Offline


Registered: 10/25/12
Posts: 4325
Loc: Taiwan
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK?


16, 8, and 4 are completely pointless.

We like completely pointless in these here parts, stranger.

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#4672629 - 02/21/18 12:40 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
Silk Offline


Registered: 07/26/03
Posts: 4549
Loc: New Zealand
7.5 exists in motorcycle fork oil, but that's an application where 0.5 can be noticed...by those who can notice these things.
_________________________
1987 BMW R65 - Penrite V Twin 20/50
2005 Nissan Expert - Gulf Western 10W-40
1996 Volvo T5 - Penrite HPR15 - 15W-60. Ryco syntec filter.

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#4672630 - 02/21/18 12:42 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
das_peikko Offline


Registered: 01/01/18
Posts: 496
Loc: San Antonio, TX
It's 7.25 not 7.5 and I know plenty of carpenters that make a perfectly good living off the 7.25 blade.

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#4672641 - 02/21/18 01:15 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
Reddy45 Offline


Registered: 08/15/08
Posts: 2962
Loc: USA
Who on earth would make a pizza in 7.5" diameter when you can easily make it 8" (or 16" or 4")?

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#4672652 - 02/21/18 01:51 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: Reddy45]
das_peikko Offline


Registered: 01/01/18
Posts: 496
Loc: San Antonio, TX
You mean we're talking about pizzas? In that case I would agree; the 16 inch would be far more preferable.

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#4672654 - 02/21/18 02:02 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39838
Loc: 'Stralia
The SAE J300 "W" viscosity specs are in ranges...0W, 5W, 10W, 15W, 20W, and 25W....Everything that you mix will fall into ONE of those groups.

SAE (operating temperture) grades now include 8, 12, and 16 as of the last few years, along with 20, 30, 40, 50, and 60...again, everything between 4 and 26.1Cst at 100C falls into one of those grades.

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#4672674 - 02/21/18 04:31 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
gfh77665 Offline


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 3789
Loc: Southeast Texas
Clearly arbitrary. Its OK to conjure up the 4, 8, 16 system "just because", but not a "7.5".

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#4672677 - 02/21/18 04:41 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39838
Loc: 'Stralia
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Clearly arbitrary. Its OK to conjure up the 4, 8, 16 system "just because", but not a "7.5".


You could call it "blue whisper" if you wanted to make up a grade, to sell to your friends...go your hardest, and call it 7.49998W, but don't link it to J300.

But if you want to use J300 as a reference, then use it as a reference, and it's either 5W or 10W...no one is making up the 8 and 12 (where is your 4 ?)...grades which didn't exist until recently, as they all fell into the "20" in it's original definition, but then fell out of it into no-man's land until a working group made them exist.

You can mark up your speedo in parsecs/millenium, then paint speed limit "bands" onto your speedo too if you like...the speed signs on the highwway will still be in MPH.

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#4672681 - 02/21/18 04:59 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
KL31 Offline


Registered: 06/03/16
Posts: 549
Loc: South OZ
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK?


Because it's just a grade and not the actual viscosity measurement in cSt. Or are we talking pizza? Because a 4" pizza is definitely too small and 7.5 is an odd size grin2


Edited by KL31 (02/21/18 04:59 AM)
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95 MX-3 2.5L|Shell Helix Ultra 5W40|Wix 51356
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#4672690 - 02/21/18 05:33 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
JeepWJ19 Offline


Registered: 09/09/15
Posts: 932
Loc: PENNSYLVANIA
Because floating point precision is silly for a viscosity grade
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TG8A | 2.5" lift | 148k miles

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#4672695 - 02/21/18 05:47 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: JeepWJ19]
Shannow Online   content


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39838
Loc: 'Stralia
Here's Honda's offerings when they weren't happy with J300....
https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/t-joy/item/hondaoil_4rin-012/
Honda "Ultra Next"

https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/t-joy/item/hondaoil_4rin-009/
Honda "Ultra Green Hybrid".

I'm proposing a different system.
VIBGYOR for the low temperature end.
V for Violet, being the coldest end of the spectrum, and Red obviously the hottest...calibrated to Earth, so it's sort of a -40C to +40C thing

Will still use HTHS as the second part of the grading, time 10 to make it meaningful.

So an oil that will start at -40C, and have an HTHS of 3.2 would be a V32. A summer oil here could well be a R32, dropping to a G32 or a Y32 in winter.

Of course a cold snap in Canada or Alaska might need better than a V rating, so there will be a -V for those eventualities.

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#4672732 - 02/21/18 07:01 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: Shannow]
Virtus_Probi Offline


Registered: 06/25/15
Posts: 3966
Loc: New England
Originally Posted By: Shannow
...

I'm proposing a different system.
VIBGYOR for the low temperature end.
V for Violet, being the coldest end of the spectrum, and Red obviously the hottest...calibrated to Earth, so it's sort of a -40C to +40C thing

Will still use HTHS as the second part of the grading, time 10 to make it meaningful.

So an oil that will start at -40C, and have an HTHS of 3.2 would be a V32. A summer oil here could well be a R32, dropping to a G32 or a Y32 in winter.

Of course a cold snap in Canada or Alaska might need better than a V rating, so there will be a -V for those eventualities.


I second this proposal, let's bring it to a BITOG floor vote and hopefully we will see oils with these markings in Walmart by March.

But, rather than having -V in a future standard update, I propose to turn the V upside down and make a lambda...
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#4672735 - 02/21/18 07:02 AM Re: Why is "7.5" scoffed at, but 16, 8, and 4 are OK? [Re: gfh77665]
kjbock Offline


Registered: 09/23/13
Posts: 237
Loc: NC
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Clearly arbitrary. Its OK to conjure up the 4, 8, 16 system "just because", but not a "7.5".


You should think of the W rating like a standard grading system in school (with no + or -), i.e. 90-100 is an A, 80-89 is a B, etc.

So if you score a 90, you get an A and if you score a 100, you still get an A, there are no AB's, AA's, A+, A-, etc. Just A, B, C, D or F.

So not arbitrary. You get a W rating based on the test score, simple as that.
_________________________
2013 BMW 128i - Castrol 0W-40, Mann HU 816X oil filter
2015 Acura MDX - M-1 0W-20 AFE, M-1 M-110
2009 Honda Fit - PUP 5W-20, Fram Ultra XG7317

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