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Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: dnewton3] #4662579
02/11/18 09:15 AM
02/11/18 09:15 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 7,206
Michigan
A_Harman Offline
A_Harman  Offline

Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 7,206
Michigan
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
T6 being a group III, there's a giant slug of VIIs in it. That it shears in just about every HDEO application is not unheard of. It's used in motorcycles with shared sumps and it shears greatly there, too. That does not mean it's failing it's job to protect against wear. It's just part of the beast; it seems to shear readily no matter what you put it in, if you run it long enough.


RT6 hasn't been shearing in my Cummins, and there are many UOA's up to 37k miles posted here that show it.


1985 Z51 Corvette track car
2002 Camaro Z28 LS1/6-speed
2001 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel
1972 GMC 1500 shortbed project truck
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: A_Harman] #4662589
02/11/18 09:20 AM
02/11/18 09:20 AM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 411
MD
claluja Offline OP
claluja  Offline OP

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MD
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
I didn't know that the 6.7 had a reputation for shearing oil. I thought that was only for Ford diesels with the HEUI injection system. The 6.7 is HPCR, isn't it? It sheared the RT6 more than 10% twice. And I find it hard to believe that Redline 15w40 would shear at all. And that flashpoint of 415 seems low for RL 15w40. Maybe you have fuel dilution, and Blackstone isn't detecting it?


Yes, I'm getting very concerned about Blackstone fuel dilution analysis. Had seen your long T6 runs without shearing. I'm having fuel dilution problems in other engines, and will probably be switching to Oil Analyzers per recommendations in the below-listed threads unless anyone has a better idea:

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4618805/Best_oil_for_handling_1-3__fue

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthr..._Ya#Post4520553

Last edited by claluja; 02/11/18 09:21 AM.

2014 F250 6.7L PSD
2006 Sequoia 4.7L
2005 E500 5.0L
2018 Jeep Rubicon, Pentastar 3.6L
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: A_Harman] #4663516
02/12/18 07:18 AM
02/12/18 07:18 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,809
Indianapolis, IN
dnewton3 Offline
Global Moderator
dnewton3  Offline
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Posts: 7,809
Indianapolis, IN
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
T6 being a group III, there's a giant slug of VIIs in it. That it shears in just about every HDEO application is not unheard of. It's used in motorcycles with shared sumps and it shears greatly there, too. That does not mean it's failing it's job to protect against wear. It's just part of the beast; it seems to shear readily no matter what you put it in, if you run it long enough.


RT6 hasn't been shearing in my Cummins, and there are many UOA's up to 37k miles posted here that show it.



Two thoughts on your UOAs ... and there's no real way to know, but these are observations
1) they certainly are the exception rather than the rule
2) because your UOAs are so much longer, there's a likelihood that you're seeing two phenomenon at the same time; VII shearing is offset by oxidation/soot thickening
I can't prove or disprove it, but your UOAs are not "normal", as most T6 show shearing
Cummins I-6 such as yours don't seem to shear many fluids in normal use, so that also helps.

Last edited by dnewton3; 02/12/18 07:20 AM.

The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: A_Harman] #4709077
03/27/18 11:16 PM
03/27/18 11:16 PM
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Posts: 411
MD
claluja Offline OP
claluja  Offline OP

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MD
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
I didn't know that the 6.7 had a reputation for shearing oil. I thought that was only for Ford diesels with the HEUI injection system. The 6.7 is HPCR, isn't it? It sheared the RT6 more than 10% twice. And I find it hard to believe that Redline 15w40 would shear at all. And that flashpoint of 415 seems low for RL 15w40. Maybe you have fuel dilution, and Blackstone isn't detecting it?


Turns out it was fuel dilution. Just got back 3.7% fuel dilution (GC measurement) report on most recent analysis from Oil Analyzers. Thanks for suggesting.


2014 F250 6.7L PSD
2006 Sequoia 4.7L
2005 E500 5.0L
2018 Jeep Rubicon, Pentastar 3.6L
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: claluja] #4710638
03/29/18 02:48 PM
03/29/18 02:48 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,244
Ocala, Florida
racin4ds Offline
racin4ds  Offline

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,244
Ocala, Florida
So why so much fuel dilution in a pretty low mileage 6.7?


Just say NO to thin oils and M1!
05 F350 Powerstroke
05 Hyundai Tucson
08 Legacy GT
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: racin4ds] #4722703
04/10/18 12:23 PM
04/10/18 12:23 PM
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Posts: 411
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claluja Offline OP
claluja  Offline OP

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Originally Posted By: racin4ds
So why so much fuel dilution in a pretty low mileage 6.7?


Wish I knew!

Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: claluja] #4805711
07/05/18 10:55 AM
07/05/18 10:55 AM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 411
MD
claluja Offline OP
claluja  Offline OP

Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 411
MD
Latest below. June 2018 UOA in both the Blackstone and Horizon reports is Redline 15w40 HDEO. Both reports analyzed the same oil from this OCI.

In the Blackstone report, 1/18 and 6/18 reports were Redline 15w40 HDEO, 3/18 report was Amsoil SS 5w40 HDEO, and the two 2016 reports with the higher iron were T6 5w40 CJ4.




Last edited by claluja; 07/05/18 10:59 AM.

2014 F250 6.7L PSD
2006 Sequoia 4.7L
2005 E500 5.0L
2018 Jeep Rubicon, Pentastar 3.6L
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: Snagglefoot] #4806877
07/06/18 02:56 PM
07/06/18 02:56 PM
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 210
Virginia, usa
Shata Offline
Shata  Offline

Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 210
Virginia, usa
Originally Posted By: Snagglefoot
Just wondering, how high does the iron ppm have to get before these guys would be concerned?



When there is issue you normally see ALOT of ppm of something and it also doesnt line up to hrs or miles on oil. Like for example 6k mile interval with 390ppm iron. There is definitely issue going on. The few UOA ive seen on engines that have been bad ppm figures were in the 1000+ ppm.


16 Silverado 2500 LML 20k Miles
Rotella 5w-40 T6
ST 75w-90 GL5 Diff.
ST Full Syn Dexron VI ATF
Fram Ultra XG9100, AC Delco Fuel
CAT Coolant, K&N Air, K&N Cabin
Filter Mags: Fuel, Allison, LML
--------
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: claluja] #4910454
10/30/18 08:11 PM
10/30/18 08:11 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 411
MD
claluja Offline OP
claluja  Offline OP

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MD
Latest UOA for RedLine 15w40 in this engine. Surprising jumps in oxidation from 4 to 91, and viscosity, with the same oil. If anyone has any ideas on the oxidation jump, please comment . . . .

As can be seen in this thread, never had high oxidation or this high viscosity in this engine.

Samples 2 and 3 in this pix both RedLine 15w40 HDEO, and Sample 1 was Amsoil SS 5w40 HDEO.

Sorry for the blurry picture.

20181030_204918.jpg
Last edited by claluja; 10/30/18 08:28 PM.

2014 F250 6.7L PSD
2006 Sequoia 4.7L
2005 E500 5.0L
2018 Jeep Rubicon, Pentastar 3.6L
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: claluja] #4910477
10/30/18 08:36 PM
10/30/18 08:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 26,842
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Garak Offline
Garak  Offline

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Posts: 26,842
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Fuel dilution has grown, but just remember not to compare these latest fuel numbers to Blackstone's, since they're not readily comparable in the least. As I mentioned in the other thread, the oxidation numbers on Red Line are customarily high in the first place. If there's any number I'd be wondering about it would be the "4" from June. A VOA of this batch of Red Line 15w-40 would be helpful. Viscosity is up, too, but that's not a huge amount in the least.


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, Wix 57356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: claluja] #4947133
12/09/18 09:40 AM
12/09/18 09:40 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,271
Midwest, Illinois
beanoil Offline
beanoil  Offline

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,271
Midwest, Illinois
Originally Posted by claluja
Originally Posted by racin4ds
So why so much fuel dilution in a pretty low mileage 6.7?


Wish I knew!

Ford injects diesel on the exhaust stroke for regen in the 6.7, so lots of raw fuel in the cylinders that sneaks past the rings. Cummins uses a 7th dedicated injector in the exhaust stream, they naturally do better on fuel dilution.


beanoil: Tough under heat, real dirty afterwards.
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: DoubleWasp] #4949878
12/12/18 11:33 AM
12/12/18 11:33 AM
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Posts: 13,275
Canyon County Idaho
CT8 Offline
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Posts: 13,275
Canyon County Idaho
Originally Posted by DoubleWasp
Redline sure knocked down your iron on this longer OCI. Whether it's moly or gerbil urine that's in the oil, its clearly working for you. I wouldn't change a thing.

The Redline oil is a 15w-40.


2015 Ford F150 2.7
2018 Ford F350 6.2
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: CT8] #4950114
12/12/18 03:37 PM
12/12/18 03:37 PM
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MD
claluja Offline OP
claluja  Offline OP

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MD
Originally Posted by CT8
Originally Posted by DoubleWasp
Redline sure knocked down your iron on this longer OCI. Whether it's moly or gerbil urine that's in the oil, its clearly working for you. I wouldn't change a thing.

The Redline oil is a 15w-40.



The Red Line 15w40 significantly lowered iron compared to T6.

And the 3/22/18 Amsoil 5w40 lowered iron even more.

The 5w40 T6 clearly had the highest iron wear, Amsoil 5w40 the lowest iron number, and the Red Line 15w40 is in the middle. Don't think the "15w" part of the equation was the determining factor here.

Last edited by claluja; 12/12/18 04:02 PM.

2014 F250 6.7L PSD
2006 Sequoia 4.7L
2005 E500 5.0L
2018 Jeep Rubicon, Pentastar 3.6L
Re: Red Line 15w40 HDEO 2014 F250 6.7 PSD 9400 miles [Re: claluja] #4966396
12/31/18 07:21 PM
12/31/18 07:21 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 7,206
Michigan
A_Harman Offline
A_Harman  Offline

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Posts: 7,206
Michigan
Originally Posted by claluja
Latest UOA for RedLine 15w40 in this engine. Surprising jumps in oxidation from 4 to 91, and viscosity, with the same oil. If anyone has any ideas on the oxidation jump, please comment . . . .

As can be seen in this thread, never had high oxidation or this high viscosity in this engine.

Samples 2 and 3 in this pix both RedLine 15w40 HDEO, and Sample 1 was Amsoil SS 5w40 HDEO.

Sorry for the blurry picture.


When I got VOA's of Redline 5w30 some years ago, oxidation showed 108. I would say your 91 oxidation number is OK.


1985 Z51 Corvette track car
2002 Camaro Z28 LS1/6-speed
2001 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel
1972 GMC 1500 shortbed project truck
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