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#4656522 - 02/05/18 01:09 AM Fram Ultra flow restrictive?
ZraHamilton Offline


Registered: 01/15/18
Posts: 92
Loc: Tennessee, United States
I am wondering if the extreme efficiency of the fram ultra (99% @ 20, 94% @ 10, and I even heard someone say 80% @ 5 microns) would create a large pressure differential and cause it to bypass often. The bypass valve is extremely flimsy and easy to push because of the weak spring and plastic valve. This seems like the biggest weakness of the ultra. If it bypasses often, that 99%+ becomes 0% lol.

Also, wouldn't the Wix XP have the lowest pressure differential of nearly any filter? (with fiberglass media and 50% @ 20 micron efficiency). If so, you get the filtering efficiency of many OEM filters, but with excellent flow, and the toughest construction.

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#4656524 - 02/05/18 01:11 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
901Memphis Offline


Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 12893
Loc: Northern Kentucky
No, the media is microglass, so the flow is higher AND more efficient than cellulose. The fram rep has posted flow charts before for specific part numbers and they are pretty much good enough to use for race applications.
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#4656525 - 02/05/18 01:18 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
ZraHamilton Offline


Registered: 01/15/18
Posts: 92
Loc: Tennessee, United States
Race applications without bypassing?

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#4656527 - 02/05/18 01:20 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
ZraHamilton Offline


Registered: 01/15/18
Posts: 92
Loc: Tennessee, United States
And isn't microglass just another way to say fiberglass spun into filter media?

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#4656530 - 02/05/18 01:28 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
ZeeOSix Offline


Registered: 07/22/10
Posts: 17771
Loc: PNW
Does your car's oil pump put out over 15 GPM? If not, don't worry about it.

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#4656565 - 02/05/18 05:26 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: 901Memphis]
Trav Offline


Registered: 11/20/06
Posts: 18856
Loc: MA, Mittelfranken.de
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
No, the media is microglass, so the flow is higher AND more efficient than cellulose. The fram rep has posted flow charts before for specific part numbers and they are pretty much good enough to use for race applications.


Yet a filter made specifically for racing uses a Synthetic-Polymer/Cellulose-Fiber blend media.

https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/CM-6731-FL1A


popcorn
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#4656573 - 02/05/18 05:56 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
Mr Nice Offline


Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 21185
Loc: Orlando, FL
No worries about oil flow.

Of course engineers at Fram tested before manufacturing millions of Fram Ultra filters.

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#4656574 - 02/05/18 05:57 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 7389
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Originally Posted By: ZraHamilton
I am wondering if the extreme efficiency of the fram ultra (99% @ 20, 94% @ 10, and I even heard someone say 80% @ 5 microns) would create a large pressure differential and cause it to bypass often. The bypass valve is extremely flimsy and easy to push because of the weak spring and plastic valve. This seems like the biggest weakness of the ultra. If it bypasses often, that 99%+ becomes 0% lol.

Also, wouldn't the Wix XP have the lowest pressure differential of nearly any filter? (with fiberglass media and 50% @ 20 micron efficiency). If so, you get the filtering efficiency of many OEM filters, but with excellent flow, and the toughest construction.



1) oil filters RARELY go into bypass; read Jim Allen's trials please
2) oil filters flow well more than the oil pumps put out; show me any data to prove otherwise
3) the Wix/NG and Wix XP are rated at same flow volumes for equivalent applications; go check their website
4) what makes you think the BP valve is "extremely flimsy and easy to push because of the weak spring and plastic valve" (As opposed to the bazillions of others just like it in other brands?) What makes the plastic "flimsy" and the spring "weak"?


This thread is just a new version of the old (unfounded) complaint regarding the PureOne filters being "too restrictive"; a totally uneducated view that if it's efficient, it must also be too restrictive because one's brain cannot conceive that the product can be both efficient and flow well

Where do some of you get these ridiculous ideas, anyway? crzy



Edited by dnewton3 (02/05/18 06:00 AM)
_________________________
The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money

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#4656589 - 02/05/18 06:39 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: dnewton3]
wemay Offline


Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 8864
Loc: Southeast Florida
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
.......one's brain cannot conceive that the product can be both efficient and flow well

Where do some of you get these ridiculous ideas, anyway? crzy



In a nutshell, what's been said about K&N air filters for years.
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#4656590 - 02/05/18 06:41 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: wemay]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 29747
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
.......one's brain cannot conceive that the product can be both efficient and flow well

Where do some of you get these ridiculous ideas, anyway? crzy



In a nutshell, what's been said about K&N air filters for years.


Only UOA data posted here typically shows increased wear metals using K&N air filters.
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#4656591 - 02/05/18 06:43 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: dnewton3]
oil_film_movies Offline


Registered: 06/13/16
Posts: 2553
Loc: MN
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Where do some of you get these ridiculous ideas, anyway? crzy
Its OK to question if something with great efficiency has too high of a flow resistance. Thats not a stupid question.
Intuitively, you might think a filter is more restrictive the smaller the flow path porosity is.
Flow any liquid into a smaller pipe and you'll see the pressure drop go up, of course.

In this case, the Fram Ultra isn't too restrictive at all. It can hold more dirt than most other filters.
The physical reality of smaller, more consistently sized synthetic fibers is what makes the Ultra work.

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#4656600 - 02/05/18 06:58 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
edwardh1 Offline


Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 2941
Loc: Coastal South Carolina
maybe k and k just does not filter much
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#4656606 - 02/05/18 07:06 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: oil_film_movies]
zrxkawboy Offline


Registered: 11/30/04
Posts: 1761
Loc: SD
Originally Posted By: oil_film_movies
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Where do some of you get these ridiculous ideas, anyway? crzy
Its OK to question if something with great efficiency has too high of a flow resistance. Thats not a stupid question.


Nah, we allow questions here. We just jump all over a newcomer who asks questions, as opposed to politely answering them like you just did. What were you thinking??
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#4656608 - 02/05/18 07:06 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
oil_film_movies Offline


Registered: 06/13/16
Posts: 2553
Loc: MN
Originally Posted By: ZraHamilton
Also, wouldn't the Wix XP have the lowest pressure differential of nearly any filter? (with fiberglass media and 50% @ 20 micron efficiency). If so, you get the filtering efficiency of many OEM filters, but with excellent flow, and the toughest construction.

That is possible. No evidence it flows more.
Actually, pressure drop is rarely a problem with properly engineered oil filters anyway.
Any difference between brands would be small. Oil pumps are positive displacement, meaning they would consume a little more power in a more restrictive flow path, yet still deliver about the same mass flow rate anyway.


This could be important in a racing application where you don't want parasitic power losses in the oil pump at high RPMs when it counts. Data would be needed on oil filter restriction in that case.

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#4656611 - 02/05/18 07:11 AM Re: Fram Ultra flow restrictive? [Re: ZraHamilton]
Old Mustang Guy Offline


Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 967
Loc: Rockwall, Texas
I think it is a concern. That's one reason I like OE.

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