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Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List #4643848
01/23/18 09:19 AM
01/23/18 09:19 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
Looking to stock up more this year (during sales) for more 5w-40 for 6.7. Ford list shows Valvoline Premium Blue Extreme 5w-40 and Shell Rotella 5w-40, which doesn't say CK4 or CJ4. Looked up Valvoline Premium Blue Extreme 5w-40 CK4 and it does have Ford's WSS-M2C171-F1. However, Shell Rotella 5w-40 spec sheet shows Ford's Ford WSS-M2C171-E spec, but not Ford WSS-M2C171-F1. Thought Shell was going to meet Ford WSS-M2C171-F1? What are you guys using in 6.7 for 5w-40? Still have 2 more changes with Delvac 5w-40 CJ4.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4643942
01/23/18 10:25 AM
01/23/18 10:25 AM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 21,084
Upstate NY
Donald Offline
Donald  Offline
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 21,084
Upstate NY
I am still finding lots of Delo 400LE 5W40 CJ-4 at Walmart.

Last edited by Donald; 01/23/18 10:28 AM.

2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT
2015 Ford F250 w/Powerstroke
2016 Subaru Crosstrek CVT (wife's)
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4644017
01/23/18 11:39 AM
01/23/18 11:39 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
I hear ya. My Walmart has all CK4 now.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4644243
01/23/18 05:21 PM
01/23/18 05:21 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
2015_PSD Offline
2015_PSD  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
Originally Posted by mbacfp
However, Shell Rotella 5w-40 spec sheet shows Ford's Ford WSS-M2C171-E spec, but not Ford WSS-M2C171-F1. Thought Shell was going to meet Ford WSS-M2C171-F1? What are you guys using in 6.7 for 5w-40?
Though Rotella T6 is on the Ford approved list, I have never found a bottle with the new Ford specification, nor have I found it on any Shell PDS. I am using Delo 5W-40; still plenty of it in the wild in my area.

Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4644255
01/23/18 05:37 PM
01/23/18 05:37 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
Thanks. No CJ4 in my area anymore (Walmart). Guess will stick with Valvoline 5w40 or Mobil Turbo Diesel 5w-40 at cheapest price point. Take care all.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4644658
01/24/18 06:44 AM
01/24/18 06:44 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,612
Indianapolis, IN
dnewton3 Offline
dnewton3  Offline
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,612
Indianapolis, IN
Originally Posted By: mbacfp
Thanks. No CJ4 in my area anymore (Walmart). Guess will stick with Valvoline 5w40 or Mobil Turbo Diesel 5w-40 at cheapest price point. Take care all.


there are a LOT of cheaper options than those ...

Here's Ford's official list:
https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/additionalinfo/dieseloilsWSSM2C171F1.pdf

There are plenty of dino options on there; no one "needs" to buy a syn. If you "want" to, that's fine. But don't think for a second that you "must" buy some expensive lube to be compliant with the Ford spec.

There are plenty of CK-4 approved lubes on that list. Many of which have "CK-4" right in their product name.

ALL CJ-4 lubes meet Ford's intent.
Some CK-4 lubes meet Ford's requirements, if they have phos >1000ppm.

I'm sure, for one, that good ol' Rotella R4 is cheaper than M1TDT and others. There are approved house brands on there, too.


The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4644829
01/24/18 10:18 AM
01/24/18 10:18 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
Thanks dnewton. Good point. I am still on the 5w-40 train as I have been getting it so cheaply. Looks like my NAPA Delvac 5w-40 sale at $19.99 with $12 Delvac rebate is no more (since CK4 changes). Would like to stay with 5w-40 if possible, but understand dino 15w-40 or 10w-30 is more than adequate for my usage. Thanks to all again.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: dnewton3] #4658139
02/06/18 03:30 PM
02/06/18 03:30 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 315
MD
claluja Offline
claluja  Offline
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 315
MD
Originally Posted By: dnewton3


Wrong list. There have been numerous updates since then.


2014 F250 6.7L PSD
2006 Sequoia 4.7L
2005 E500 5.0L
2018 Jeep Rubicon, Pentastar 3.6L
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4658265
02/06/18 05:31 PM
02/06/18 05:31 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
Thanks Claluja,

Thought I had the right one.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: claluja] #4658267
02/06/18 05:33 PM
02/06/18 05:33 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 315
MD
claluja Offline
claluja  Offline
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 315
MD
Originally Posted By: claluja
Originally Posted By: dnewton3


Wrong list. There have been numerous updates since then.


11/27/17 is the latest version I've seen. May be at that link?


2014 F250 6.7L PSD
2006 Sequoia 4.7L
2005 E500 5.0L
2018 Jeep Rubicon, Pentastar 3.6L
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: dnewton3] #4658392
02/06/18 07:34 PM
02/06/18 07:34 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
2015_PSD Offline
2015_PSD  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
there are a LOT of cheaper options than those ...There are plenty of dino options on there; no one "needs" to buy a syn. If you "want" to, that's fine. But don't think for a second that you "must" buy some expensive lube to be compliant with the Ford spec.
Depends on what you are doing with the truck and if you like your warranty. If you have no warranty, I agree, but if you are in the severe service category as defined by Ford and do not want to worry about your warranty, then I would be running a 5W-40 synthetic.

Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4659697
02/08/18 06:03 AM
02/08/18 06:03 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,612
Indianapolis, IN
dnewton3 Offline
dnewton3  Offline
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,612
Indianapolis, IN
We've been over this hundreds of times it seems ...

What is required for compliance with Ford's warranty coverage is a lube that meets their spec; the Ford spec for lubricants (currently the F1).
What is "recommended" for a service factor is NOT the deciding factor regarding warranty, despite all the shenanigans to the contrary.
For anything that meets the Ford spec (dino or syn or semi), the burden of proof for any warranty claim denial would be upon Ford.

If Ford had a different spec for different grades, unique to each grade, and then required those via the service factor severity, I would agree with you. But they don't; the official spec (F1 level) does not delineate grades; they are all approved under one license spec. Hence, any lube meeting Ford's spec will assure warranty coverage.

If you used a licensed F1 spec'd 10w-30 and had an engine issue during "severe" use, the burden of a warranty denial would be upon Ford to show why your use of a licensed product was unacceptable to an arbiter, and then explain why the licensed product was not delineated by grade. Grade recommendations are only that; they are suggestions. Suggestions are not "licensed", and therefore not enforceable in court or arbitration.

Using this direct link:
https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/product.asp?product=Diesel Motor Oils Meeting Ford WSS-M2C171-F1&category=Motor Oil
Note that the previous link I had, to the F1 list, was dated 11-27-17, and that is the same one using this parent link to their site.
To the best of my knowledge, the F1 current release is dated 11-27-17 as of today (2-8-18).


Side note:
In fact, unless Ford officially mailed you a formal statement, specific to your VIN as the current registered owner (it must be printed on the letter by name and VIN), your only obligation for your 2015 PSD for Warranty coverage would be to use a lube that met the "former" (E) rated spec level. Ford cannot legally require you to use an "updated" spec lube AFTER the sale, unless they send you a letter specifically changing the official warranty requirement, which is based upon the printed materials at the time of publication at sale, and get your agreement. If you're ever received a "recall" notice, you'll always see that both the registered owner's name, and VIN, are on those letters. For them to change a warranty requirement AFTER the time of sale, they would have to legally advise you of such, to your specific address and by specific VIN, and then actually offer you a choice of accepting the "new" warranty conditions, or allowing for a refund (prorated). Any time they would "extend" or "improve" a warranty after sale, your consent is not required. But if they alter or limit the warranty in a more restrictive manner, they must get your consent or offer an out (at prorated level). Multiple consumer case-law decisions have found this is the case. Just because you are aware of the F1 changes, you are not obligated to follow them, unless you were notified formally and subsequently agreed to them.

Because the "E" spec level is essentially akin to CJ-4, it's not a big deal to you. Or, using a lube meeting the F1 spec would be OK too. But the grade has NOTHING to do with the license spec of the former E level or current F1 level and would be a moot topic in court or arbitration.

Last edited by dnewton3; 02/08/18 06:10 AM.

The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4659737
02/08/18 07:06 AM
02/08/18 07:06 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
Curiously enough, the Ford Truck Service center that did my upper oil pan repair carried no 5w-40 or 15w-40. All they use is 10w-30 as I requested 5w-40 replacement oil after warranty repair. Surprised Ford's severe recommendations are not followed by a shop most likely to service vehicles in that category.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: dnewton3] #4659793
02/08/18 08:28 AM
02/08/18 08:28 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
2015_PSD Offline
2015_PSD  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,594
Planet Earth
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
We've been over this hundreds of times it seems [...]
Agreed; but unless one is prepared to "fight with Ford" the cost difference between non-synthetic and synthetic (particularly with the sales that happen) is frankly a mere pittance compared to the cost of loss of the use of the vehicle while arbitration takes place or losing the arbitration. Ford WILL ALWAYS BE in a better position than the purchaser to hold out over a dispute and while the burden of proof may be on them--the purchaser WILL SUFFER through the process. I would rather not go there so I will continue to use 5W-40.

Re: Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 Approved List [Re: mbacfp] #4659914
02/08/18 10:43 AM
02/08/18 10:43 AM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
mbacfp Offline OP
mbacfp  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 882
California
I am (trying) to err on the side of caution with what I thought were "serious" Ford service recommendations. Whatever I can do (at a reasonable cost) to hedge any warranty issues and increase longevity on my vehicle was my main goal. Seeing Ford Truck centers (who work and warranty trucks with massive idling, towing, etc.) use 10w-30 makes me wonder if it really matters. UOAs show it doesn't also, so I guess it has now become an emotional feel good reason why I am using 5w-40.


2014 F-550 PSD..........M1 Delvac ESP 5w-40 + OEM
2018 Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat
2012 Toyota Sienna LTD 3.5L V6
2003 Dodge Durango R/T 4x4 5.9L V8
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