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What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? #4641782
01/21/18 11:22 AM
01/21/18 11:22 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 243
805, Ca
Analyzer Offline OP
Analyzer  Offline OP
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 243
805, Ca
Kevin Cameron delves into this subject in Cycle World magazine in the link below and also includes a video from their YouTube channel as well. It is very informative and takes oil viscosity out of the equation showing the mechanical/engineering reasoning behind it.

Kevin Cameron on Causes of Poor Motorcycle Shifting


2007 Yamaha FZ1
1986 Yamaha FZX700 Fazer
1997 Suzuki RM250
2016 Mazda 3 Sport
1992 Ford Explorer Eddie Bauer 4x4
Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4641851
01/21/18 12:37 PM
01/21/18 12:37 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 2,161
VA
maverickfhs Offline
maverickfhs  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 2,161
VA
Thanks for sharing, I like that guy and video thumbsup


2006 Civic EX 202K/AT
2006 Acura TSX 180K/AT
Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4641910
01/21/18 01:50 PM
01/21/18 01:50 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,152
USA
Reddy45 Online shocked
Reddy45  Online Shocked
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,152
USA
That's just one aspect right? No mention of the shift star or the movement of the forks. Clutch cable tension would also matter.

Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4641965
01/21/18 02:53 PM
01/21/18 02:53 PM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 2,093
Saskatchewan, Canada
Johnny2Bad Offline
Johnny2Bad  Offline
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 2,093
Saskatchewan, Canada
A properly setup sequential transmission is a thing of beauty, a poorly setup one is a thing of pain.


'57 FL Straight 50 wt
'90 Miata 1.8L w/Rotrex Supercharger [Mobil1 0W-40]
'96 Ram 1500 [3.7L Mobil1 0W-20 / 1L 15W-50]
'01 PT Cruiser [Mobil1 0W-40]
Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4641972
01/21/18 03:03 PM
01/21/18 03:03 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,633
Katy, Republic of Texas
blupupher Offline
blupupher  Offline
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,633
Katy, Republic of Texas
Interesting, did not understand 1/3 of what he said, and found the background music annoying.


1994 Honda VT1100: Peak 15w-40/PSL/2500 mile OCI
2002 Ford F150: GTX HM 5w-20/EcoGard Syn/1yr OCI
2012 Scion xB: QSUD 0w-20/CQ Blue/5k OCI

Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4641989
01/21/18 03:23 PM
01/21/18 03:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 18
nj
lego Offline
lego  Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 18
nj
I get a lot of false neutrals on older Ducati if I I do not shift with authority.

Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4642016
01/21/18 03:59 PM
01/21/18 03:59 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,342
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
Chris142 Online content
Chris142  Online Content
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,342
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
I can't find neutral in my z400


02 Wrangler durablend 10w40
87 F250 traveler 15w40
04 Tahoe super-s 10w30
Z400 castrol T 10w40
Can am maveric edge 5w40
57 case tractor 15w40
Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4642036
01/21/18 04:27 PM
01/21/18 04:27 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,160
Deep in the heart of Jersey
BigCahuna Offline
BigCahuna  Offline
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,160
Deep in the heart of Jersey
I don't think that guys "one problem causes all" answer is doing anyone any favors. There was no mention of a worn out, or badly adjusted clutch as being a culprit. Or primary oils being too heavy or thin. Matching engine speed to a given shift point will allow you to shift smoothly without using the clutch.Heavy oil in cold weather causes drag on the clutch plates, and can cause you bike to bang into gear or lurch forward. If your bike uses the same oil for the motor and transmission, as it gets older and shears out of grade, that can cause it to be hard finding neutral. Of course bent or damaged shift dogs or shafts can cause hard shifting,but most of the time the answer is alot simpler to remedy the tearing the motor or trans apart.,,

Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4642085
01/21/18 05:07 PM
01/21/18 05:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,869
The Canyons
02SE Offline
02SE  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,869
The Canyons
I respect Kevin Cameron, but that is an incomplete article. There are numerous contributors to smooth or notchy shifting. Since this is an oil forum, I've had various oils affect shifting smoothness in shared-sump Motorcycles, too many times to count, when the oil was the only change made.

Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4642426
01/21/18 11:56 PM
01/21/18 11:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,744
New Zealand
Silk Offline
Silk  Offline
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,744
New Zealand
He mentioned the Burman gearbox, a better example would be the Triumph gearboxes. The 4 speed had fine dogs, he called them splines, but the Burman had fine dogs like the Triumph gears shown here. They weren't a great shifting box, and false neutrals caused by a shift plate rather than a smaller diameter shift drum.



When Triumph made the 5 speed, they used a wider dog as shown here, you can also see the staggered height dog.



1987 BMW R65 - Penrite V Twin 20/50
2005 Nissan Expert - Gulf Western 10W-40
1996 Volvo T5 - Penrite HPR15 - 15W-60. Ryco syntec filter.
Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4642509
01/22/18 04:55 AM
01/22/18 04:55 AM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,654
PNW
ZeeOSix Offline
ZeeOSix  Offline
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,654
PNW
Anyone recognize the 3 cylinder engine in the video? Old Kawasaki 2-stroke?

Proper shift lever position and clutch adjustment are important for good shifting operation. The oil used can also make a noticable difference.

Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: Analyzer] #4642565
01/22/18 08:02 AM
01/22/18 08:02 AM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,354
Nowhere NM
Smoky14 Offline
Smoky14  Offline
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,354
Nowhere NM
I think Kevin was confining his remarks to things mechanical. Having hand massaged a few race boxes in my day, I found it to be a good basic informational video. Hand lapping and under cutting the dogs can take days if done properly.
Try rebuilding that crankshaft if you think transmissions are difficult.

Smoky


99 Acura 2.3CL 5speed MT
12 Ford Fusion 2.5S 6speed MT
05 Suzuki Bandit 1200.
Re: What Causes Poor Shifting In Motorcycling? [Re: ZeeOSix] #4642944
01/22/18 02:23 PM
01/22/18 02:23 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,869
The Canyons
02SE Offline
02SE  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,869
The Canyons
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Anyone recognize the 3 cylinder engine in the video? Old Kawasaki 2-stroke?

Proper shift lever position and clutch adjustment are important for good shifting operation. The oil used can also make a noticable difference.


He says it's an H1 in his opening statement.


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