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Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? #4634968
01/14/18 07:10 PM
01/14/18 07:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
monster1 Offline OP
monster1  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
I've pretty much decided fram ultra are the best readily available filters for all my engines. My volvo penta 4.3gxi is no exception. I've been running an ultra xg30 with Chevron or Rotella 15w-40 hdeo oil. I'm getting ready to do an annual service to the engine. The engine logged 50 hours of moderate use. I've read the ultra are good for 20,000 miles. This one is probably no even broken in and the oil is still a dark amber color. Should I change the oil and reuse the filter or being on a marine application should I change the filter every time?

Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4634983
01/14/18 07:34 PM
01/14/18 07:34 PM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 717
Canada
i_hate_autofraud Offline
i_hate_autofraud  Offline
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 717
Canada


if the filter is good for 20K miles, that's 400 hours at 50 MPH, I think you can go longer unless the engine manual says otherwise.

Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4634992
01/14/18 07:40 PM
01/14/18 07:40 PM
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,086
US-WA
Dyusik Offline
Dyusik  Offline
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,086
US-WA
Using my 5k toyota interval for the IS, at 20mph avg, I'm getting 1k hours for the life of the Ultra. Only one way of looking at it.


95 Cherokee 190K DELO 10W30,XG8
07 IS250 98K Napa 10w30,FULL
04 YZF-R1 19K DELO 15w40,XG7317
99 HD XL1200S 18K VR1 20w50,1515
14 RX450h 32k PP MIX,NAPAG
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635008
01/14/18 07:52 PM
01/14/18 07:52 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
Linctex Offline
Linctex  Offline
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 6,226
Waco, TX
I guess you could go with an XG5 (longer) if it fits.


Originally Posted By: monster1
Should I change the oil and reuse the filter or being on a marine application should I change the filter every time?


Run it for two years/seasons in normal recreational use.


"The evidence demands a verdict".
(Re:VOA)"it's nearly impossible to actually know the particular additives that are in there at what concentrations."
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635103
01/14/18 09:10 PM
01/14/18 09:10 PM
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 5,839
Kalifornia Kollective
BrocLuno Offline
BrocLuno  Offline
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 5,839
Kalifornia Kollective
Have you had a UOA done on the oil? 50 hours is pretty short. It's your motor, but I never change short of 100 hours. Usually between 100 and 200 for any engine the runs well.

Carb'd engines running rich is another matter ...

Last edited by BrocLuno; 01/14/18 09:11 PM.

Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635120
01/14/18 09:24 PM
01/14/18 09:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,795
Florida, Cape Coral
Eddie Online sleepy
Eddie  Online Sleepy
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 9,795
Florida, Cape Coral
Since marine engines usually run at a much higher RPM than an auto, I'd be careful applying the same criteria. What does the Volvo manual suggest as to hours for an oil & filter change.


CX5 Touring 2.5L :-)
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635145
01/14/18 09:41 PM
01/14/18 09:41 PM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,363
Fort Lauderdale, FL
DoubleWasp Offline
DoubleWasp  Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,363
Fort Lauderdale, FL
We've put so many XG5 filters on these thinhs that I can't even remember.

Unless an engine is being UOA'd, we never carry a filter over. If there is water contamination we don't know about, we'd be inadvertently carrying some over. Possible carry over of fuel dilution is another concern. Life and death concern? Probably not, but I'd personally and professionally rather see on the side of caution.

Most marine engine companies recommend 50 hours for conventional and 100 hours for synthetic.


07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635174
01/14/18 10:19 PM
01/14/18 10:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
monster1 Offline OP
monster1  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
I think off the top of my head the manual says oil change every 100 hours. I've read from top marine mechanics say every 50 due to fuel delution. I'm right at 50 hours. I figure I spend the majority of run time at 3500 rpm doing about 32mph. So figure I traveled 1500 miles conservatively.

Last edited by monster1; 01/14/18 10:21 PM.
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635225
01/14/18 11:37 PM
01/14/18 11:37 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,654
PNW
ZeeOSix Offline
ZeeOSix  Offline
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,654
PNW
Originally Posted By: monster1
I figure I spend the majority of run time at 3500 rpm doing about 32mph. So figure I traveled 1500 miles conservatively.

If that was a car going down the highway in high gear it would be more like around 110~115 MPH.

Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: i_hate_autofraud] #4635248
01/15/18 12:10 AM
01/15/18 12:10 AM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 11,819
Idaho
CT8 Offline
CT8  Offline
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 11,819
Idaho
Originally Posted By: i_hate_autofraud


if the filter is good for 20K miles, that's 400 hours at 50 MPH, I think you can go longer unless the engine manual says otherwise.
Up to 20.000 miles.


"Don't let your preconceived notions get in the way of facts."
Geoff Metcalf
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635280
01/15/18 01:13 AM
01/15/18 01:13 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 542
Texas (south)
FermeLaPorte Offline
FermeLaPorte  Offline
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 542
Texas (south)
I would change it every 6 months if I was you


Always Mobil 1
2014 1.6L Nissan Versa Sedan, 5 spd, 5k OCI.
2011 3.5L Chevrolet Impala, Automatic, 5k OCI.
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635286
01/15/18 01:34 AM
01/15/18 01:34 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,363
Fort Lauderdale, FL
DoubleWasp Offline
DoubleWasp  Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,363
Fort Lauderdale, FL
Originally Posted By: monster1
I think off the top of my head the manual says oil change every 100 hours. I've read from top marine mechanics say every 50 due to fuel delution. I'm right at 50 hours. I figure I spend the majority of run time at 3500 rpm doing about 32mph. So figure I traveled 1500 miles conservatively.


In second gear, going uphill, towing a boat, with flat tires.

FD is one. These engines also shear oil like Edward Scissorhands. They make a lot of metal too. Expect 50-80ppm iron for that 50 hour run.

FD is mostly a concern for trollers and people with a lot of no wake zones. Imagine starting your car and leaving it idling for hours.

100 hours is fine with a stout synthetic lube. If you have no oil cooler, your oil is getting hotter than stolen car with the heat stuck on in Arizona in July. If VP ever built a 4.3 with an oil cooler, I've not seen it.

FD can be funny though. When my old 454 had the garbage Weber carb that ran so fat under any adjustment that it turned my plugs black, and I had to cross an hour of manatee zones to hit the ocean, and only breathers with no PCV, I never turned up even a full percent of FD. Weird.

Using RT6 to 108 hours on that engine, I beat the iron universal average for 48 hours use, and still had about 7 TBN.

We've done even better using high HTHS 20w50 and SAE60 synthetics on these GM based engines.


07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: DoubleWasp] #4635344
01/15/18 04:19 AM
01/15/18 04:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
monster1 Offline OP
monster1  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
RT6?
TBN?
HTHS?

Sorry I'm not up on my acronyms with oil speak. I do remember you being quite knowledgeable about what filters and oil to run in these engines. Are the fram ultra and 15w-40 Rotella T6 a good match?

Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: monster1] #4635349
01/15/18 04:53 AM
01/15/18 04:53 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,363
Fort Lauderdale, FL
DoubleWasp Offline
DoubleWasp  Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,363
Fort Lauderdale, FL
RT6 = Rotella T6

TBN = Total Base Number. The higher the number, an indicator that the oil's additive package is still valid. 7+ is a very high number to have remaining at the end of an OCI. Typically, you'd find 4 or less. Below 2 is where it gets touchy. Ideally, this should be compared with the TAN (Total Acid Number), but with 7+ TBN, it is extraordinarily unlikely to be an issue.

HTHS = High Temperature / High Shear. The HTHS number basically tells you the oil's viscosity under very high temperature and load (like you'd find in the main and rod bearings). A higher HTHS viscosity is good for these marine engines, because getting the oil hot as a beast under high loads is what these engines do when not equipped with an oil cooler, and in some cases, even with.

RT6 did a lot better than VPs recommended fill by a wide margin, so I'd say you'll be fine with it.

VP later updated their spec in a TSB where they now recommend 40 weight diesel oil, so you're barking up the right tree with RT6.


07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio
Re: Fram ultra change interval in marine engine? [Re: DoubleWasp] #4636226
01/15/18 11:04 PM
01/15/18 11:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
monster1 Offline OP
monster1  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 124
ca
Thank you DoubleWrap. Rock solid response.

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