Hyundai/Kia Theta II oil pump?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Apr 10, 2016
Messages
1,255
Location
Campbellsville, KY
I have a '11 Kia Sportage in the shop with barely any oil pressure; 182K, Theta II 2.4L MPI engine if my research is right. It came in because the owner was complaining of a noise that, by his description, I thought was going to be a bad belt tensioner, but I've not gotten it to make any noise since I've had it; however, the low oil light would come on after running just a couple minutes, afterward coming on any time the engine dropped to at or near idle. Only DTC was P0014 "Camshaft B timing over-advanced" - I figure this is a result of the low oil pressure. Hooked up a manual gauge at the low press. sensor fitting and it read 2-3 PSI on cold start. Replaced oil filter (Napa Gold both times), no change. I've done the last two OC's with Maxlife in decent proximity to one another - currently the oil looks fairly clean and right at the full mark. Next step, check the pickup screen - pulled the pan and it's clean. No debris in the pan but there's plenty of varnish on the pump and bottom of the bed plate.

My plan was to inspect (in order) the pickup screen, bypass valve, then the pump itself. The drive chain off the crank is intact and appears fine.

I can't find any information on how the pump is designed or where the relief valve is - anybody here with some pointers? It's part of the "balance shaft module" and it's not as simple as a couple bolts to pop it off so if the relief valve can be inspected without removing that assembly that would be preferable.

FYI, the engine still sounds and runs fine so I believe it's still solid and finding/fixing the oil pressure problem will yield a good repair.
 
Worn main bearings can also cause low oil pressure. 2-3 psi cold is really low.

Here is a part and basic diagram This is for a 2.0 , i'm looking for a 2.4


https://www.wholesalekiaparts.com/oem-pa...AiABEgIww_D_BwE

53606ef9bca58b93aef06b9c39f7dd3d.png
 
Last edited:
I found this on ebay, but i can't cross reference the numbers to factory numbers.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-OEM-PUMP-ASSY-OIL-For-Tucson-10-13-Sportage-10-13-213102F301/152794984505?fits=Year%3A2011%7CMake%3AKia%7CModel%3ASportage&hash=item23934a7039:g:0gEAAOSwPDBaEXfT
 
Probably the main bearings, at 182k I'd quote a short block or used motor. Chances of it being the oil pump are near zero.
 
Originally Posted By: Alex_V
Hmmmm... duly noted. So it's possible the mains could be too loose to hold oil pressure but still not make any noise?




Yes and very likely.
 
Last edited:
That 2.4 is covered in the fustercluck that is the Hyundai/Kia engine recall

I'd give it a fresh oil change, and limp it into the nearest Kia dealer to get on the waiting list for a new engine

Even though it's past the 15y/150k cut off, they've been good willing them left right and center for the sake of customer satisfaction
 
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher
That 2.4 is covered in the fustercluck that is the Hyundai/Kia engine recall

I'd give it a fresh oil change, and limp it into the nearest Kia dealer to get on the waiting list for a new engine

Even though it's past the 15y/150k cut off, they've been good willing them left right and center for the sake of customer satisfaction



If Hyundai/Kia goodwilled an engine on a vehicle with 182K I'd be very impressed....I just don't see it happening.
 
Originally Posted By: pbm
Originally Posted By: michaelluscher
That 2.4 is covered in the fustercluck that is the Hyundai/Kia engine recall

I'd give it a fresh oil change, and limp it into the nearest Kia dealer to get on the waiting list for a new engine

Even though it's past the 15y/150k cut off, they've been good willing them left right and center for the sake of customer satisfaction



If Hyundai/Kia goodwilled an engine on a vehicle with 182K I'd be very impressed....I just don't see it happening.


Search around, I heard of them putting a long block in a 400k '11 Sonata, didn't even flinch

TBF, these engines pop like popcorn, they should learn from there mistakes
 
Pretty sure this was one of the engines that they installed the rod bearings backwards in. Can't remember anything being said about the mains, but if it's anything to do with the bottom end on that engine at all, I'd run it by a dealer. There might be a new engine or at least a short block in your near future and I doubt they're going to quibble about mileage. This is a PR nightmare for them.
 
Last edited:
I put it back together today and advised the owner of the situation, and that he take it to a dealer to see about an engine. It's in generally good shape but the tranny is making a little noise - so IMHO anything more than a free engine relegates it to selling as-is. (Doesn't make sense to spend the money on a reman engine and leave the noisy transmission, but to buy/install both would cost more than it's worth.) With VML 10w40 in it the oil pressure jumped to about 12 on startup, but crept back down to 3-4 pounds. After running 4-5 minutes I observed pressure increase and it was pretty linear up to about 50 PSI at 3,000 RPM but the low pressure light still came on at idle.

If the dealer won't do anything for him I honestly think he should run it until it gets noisy then cut his losses - maybe 2 weeks, maybe 6 months?

Is having an OEM filter on it really going to make a diference at the dealer, vs. a Napa Gold?
 
Last edited:
In my inexperienced opinion, an OEM filter is hope against hope. Napa Gold is about as good as it gets.

I think he should try for a new engine under warranty, and if that works, get it back and sell it. If he can't get a new engine now, sell it now while it drives normally. Unless he's deeply in love with it.
 
Did this affect the 1st gen 2.4 as well? Read about this the other day and thought to myself I have not seen an 5th gen '06-10 Sonata in quite some time so I have kept my eyes peeled on my daily 30 minute commute, I have seen exactly 1 5th gen Sonata over the past 3-4 days. Mind you I have probably seen 25-30 97-02 Camry's and way more '02-'XX Camry's than I can count over the same time frame.

10/100k warranty - seems like the cars are just thrown straight in the garbage, even after the Phoenix rising rebirth of Hyundai/Kia that started around '05. Looking at it how many of the 2 gens ago bubble ('07-10) Elantras do you see out in the wild, I can probably count on one hand how many I have seen in the last 3 months.

Mind you I get them all the time as rental cars and while they are nothing spectacular they seem well built and they perform adequately in rental duty (Sonata 2.4 HWY mileage is WAY overstated), never imagined them being junkyard ready at such low miles.
 
In good concience I can't advise him to sell it as a supposedly solid car (for a solid-car price) when the engine may come to a literal grinding hault at any time.

From the skimming I did online about these engines and their problems, it seems to me the problem wasn't just "mfg. process error" in not properly cleaning and finishing the rotating assembly - the nature of the failures (and that it seems it takes most of them quite a while to fail) would suggest it's a fundamental shortcoming in design or metallurgy. I've heard Kia dealer ads on the radio for years, raving about their incentives and "best trade-in offers" - to me that ads up to them being able to net less per car, which means less of something, somewhere in the vehicle. Design? Parts quality? Kia and Hyundai may get good reviews and be nice when new, but I've yet to come across information that changes my mind about what's really under their skin.
 
Originally Posted By: HoosierJeeper
In my inexperienced opinion, an OEM filter is hope against hope. Napa Gold is about as good as it gets.

I think he should try for a new engine under warranty, and if that works, get it back and sell it. If he can't get a new engine now, sell it now while it drives normally. Unless he's deeply in love with it.


Using an OE filter may help make it easier to get consideration for a replacement engine under the recall and to avoid dealer hassles. There's a TSB about aftermarket filters potentially causing low oil pressure or other lubrication issues, and it states to change the oil and filter for vehicles brought in with these concerns. In reality, a quality aftermarket filter specified for the engine won't cause these issues... and the NAPA Gold is definitely a quality filter I would use with confidence. However I also understand Hyundai/Kia not wanting to be responsible for diagnosing issues with aftermarket parts (such as an incorrect filter installed by another shop) under warranty. Changing the oil filter is cheap and could fix things like startup rattle in the case of a failed ADBV.

Obviously in this case it is a more serious mechanical issue. 180,000 miles is a lot... modern engines should last longer but these engines do have known issues, and maintenance history / driving conditions can also be a major factor. Changing the oil filter won't help the issue, but it is just a matter of playing the game to get the best shot at success working with the dealer. It is already a long shot since it is past the mileage limits on the recall... might as well not give them any other reasons to reject the warranty claim.
 
Very good point, I didn't know they were paying that much attention to oil filters. I'd throw an OEM one on too.
 
I would doubt that an MPI 2.4L would be on the recall list. I have only seen and replaced GDI engines under recall SC147.
 
Originally Posted By: jim302
Originally Posted By: HoosierJeeper
In my inexperienced opinion, an OEM filter is hope against hope. Napa Gold is about as good as it gets.

I think he should try for a new engine under warranty, and if that works, get it back and sell it. If he can't get a new engine now, sell it now while it drives normally. Unless he's deeply in love with it.


Using an OE filter may help make it easier to get consideration for a replacement engine under the recall and to avoid dealer hassles. There's a TSB about aftermarket filters potentially causing low oil pressure or other lubrication issues, and it states to change the oil and filter for vehicles brought in with these concerns. In reality, a quality aftermarket filter specified for the engine won't cause these issues... and the NAPA Gold is definitely a quality filter I would use with confidence. However I also understand Hyundai/Kia not wanting to be responsible for diagnosing issues with aftermarket parts (such as an incorrect filter installed by another shop) under warranty. Changing the oil filter is cheap and could fix things like startup rattle in the case of a failed ADBV.

Obviously in this case it is a more serious mechanical issue. 180,000 miles is a lot... modern engines should last longer but these engines do have known issues, and maintenance history / driving conditions can also be a major factor. Changing the oil filter won't help the issue, but it is just a matter of playing the game to get the best shot at success working with the dealer. It is already a long shot since it is past the mileage limits on the recall... might as well not give them any other reasons to reject the warranty claim.


For the Kia 2.0T recall at least, the official deal is unlimited miles and 15 years (whichever occurs first) which gets you the full long block replacement will all the corrections/modifications if yours dies during that time. Pretty sweet deal IMHO.
 
check to see if its under the recall ---if thats the same motor as the sonata, it may be inder the recall for machining which can ruin bearings----- they sent notice to use about our 13 sonata
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top