Castrol Edge 5W30 A3/B4 - 9564 km 2006 Forester

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Here's my UOA that I finally had done. Not sure why they didn't provide me with a TBN. That was my main goal with getting the UOA so I emailed them about that. Silicon looks high, I might change air filter soon or take a look at it.

All city driving. Approx 17 months in service. Many short trips.

N/A engine, Automatic, and 103,000kms.

UOAforester.jpg
 
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Hey KL31,

Just on 6000 miles giving 15 ppm Iron looks OK to me. The copper at 13 ppm could be a touch high, but I don't know these engines and how they handle lots of short tripping, it could be normal. I agree with you about the silicon at 34 ppm, time to take a look at the air filter.

But a big thanks for doing this UOA of the Aussie Edge 5W30 A3/B4 as this is my first look at it's add pack:
Ca ~ 2730 ppm
Mo ~ 70 ppm
Zn ~ 1060 ppm (API SL)
B ~ 40 ppm (but this can deplete with usage, so it may have started higher)

No Ti or TBN, which is a shame, but I've seen enough to be happy with that add package.

The viscosity is still in grade with KV100 = 10.4 cSt, but according to the Castrol data sheet it's starting viscosity was 12.0 cSt, with a starting TBN of 10.2 with a HTHS of 3.6 cP.

Thanks again
 
Yeah noticed the KV100 and KV40 are lower than what's on castrol's data sheets. Could just be some dilution from previous oil fill. I had Subaru do the one before this and they might have used 0W20, not sure. They didn't state what grade.

But if whatever clings to the engine is still a 20 grade and that mixes a little with the Edge, then it could be what caused it to lower a tad.

OR they mixed my results up with someone else. Didn't know Edge A3/B4 had moly in it??
 
I have reported here on BITOG good UOA's with heavier oils in our Forester.

I'd run Castrol 0w30 in the winter and M1 5w40 TDT in the summer. UOA's always looked stellar.
 
Looking at some of the other Castrol Edge UOA, they do have moly too. Funny that there's no titanium reading. They specifically say on their website that it's one of the metals they test for. I'll ring them up today and query that along with TBN.

If they don't the do TBN, then I'm not sure how they're in business. Surely big machinery would rely on a TBN reading?

@ Phishing, the Edge A3/B4 is pretty close to a 40 gradeto begin with, mine ended up thinner but could be a little oil dilution from previous mix and lab error margin too. Don't really have a cold winter here either so 0w is not needed. Could run 15W oil without issue all year around.
 
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With 'low' sulfur fuel, OCI could be extended to 15000 km or more though Fe/Cu appears a tad high but fine, I suppose.
 
Originally Posted By: KL31
@ Phishing, the Edge A3/B4 is pretty close to a 40 gradeto begin with, mine ended up thinner but could be a little oil dilution from previous mix and lab error margin too. Don't really have a cold winter here either so 0w is not needed. Could run 15W oil without issue all year around.

Note that the North American view of A3/B4 is kind of skewed, since a 0w-XX version is the most common, and they're almost all marketed as premium synthetics. Finding a 5w-30 A3/B4 can be a bit of a chore here, so you're using a bit of a unicorn to us.
wink.gif
I can get that Castrol 5w-30 A3/B4 off the shelf here, but Wakefield doesn't let grass grow under their feet in Canada.
 
I rang up and they were vague but apparently you have to request TBN on the paperwork. The bloke said they needed to use chemicals and different equipment and whatnot to test the TBN. They're doing it for free but it's usually $30 extra... bit pricey. Should get result on Monday.
 
Originally Posted By: Garak
Finding a 5w-30 A3/B4 can be a bit of a chore here, so you're using a bit of a unicorn to us.
wink.gif
I can get that Castrol 5w-30 A3/B4 off the shelf here, but Wakefield doesn't let grass grow under their feet in Canada.


It's good you can get the same stuff in Canada.

The Castrol Edge 5W30 A3/B4 is very common here, it's a Group III synthetic but rated A3/B4, MB 229.5 and BMW LL-01. Lots of people use it around here in their non-Euro cars even though it's "only" API SL due to it's elevated zinc levels. It regularly goes on sale here and I was lucky to get some at $25 for 5L, which is a very good price here.

I'm coming up to an oil change soon, and I have some Edge 5W30 A3/B4 in my stash, but also some on the new full synthetic Magnatec 5W30 (SN & A3/B4) and some of the new Castrol Edge 10W30 (SN & A5/B5). I assume they are all Group III synthetics, which I am very fine with. I'm not too sure which of these three to use next.
 
Got my TBN result today. Was 3.1 and I'll update the report picture later today.

Not sure how much longer it could be run as TBN depletion is not always linear. I do use regular 91 RON instead of 98. Not sure of that would make much of a difference. Was in the engine for almost 18 months so maybe I'll try 11,000 or 12,000 next.

But 18 months is a good effort, probably 250 - 300 hours of driving time. If that was all an average of 80kmph I'd be getting 20000 to 24000 kms. But in mostly city traffic with 50-60 km speed limits and stop go situations it's more like 30-40 kmph average.
 
Personally, I wouldn't go further.

My vehicles are apparently driven similarly to yours in terms of mileage in the given time and hours.

When I've pushed time / mileage so that TBN falls below 3, I've just felt too much of a difference between new oil and the old oil.

In fact, once, it was actually the feeling of roughness that prompted me to do the oil change.

There are reputable sources that say a TBN of 3 or 35% of virgin is the cut off point.

I've settled on that and comments from SonofJoe about possible negative effects of consecutive lengthy ocis have also influenced me.
 
Probably the first 6 months of the OCI I wasn't driving the car as much but now it's getting almost daily driven 20km each way to work. I calculate that I can do just over 10,000kms in 12 months. I'll see where I end up by the end of the year and UOA again if I'm over 10,000. See if I can detect any air leaks too with that silicon. Very rarely I will get a slight uneven idle and I wonder if there's a small leak somewhere around the intake track. There have been a lot of dusty road works too though, so could be anything but worth a look!

FYI charlie, I didn't note any difference between old oil and new but 100% have felt that in an old Renault I used to flog around in!
 
Apart from TBN, you've also got the viscosity, oxidation, sulfation and nitration to consider.

Do you know what the limit on viscosity drop would be? The others are below 20 so ok I believe.

But you could overall be very close to 3 measures that say change oil ie sulfation, viscosity and TBN.
 
Here's the UOA with TBN. Charlie, do you know what the limits of Oxidation, Nitration and Sulfation are and if I'm close? I don't see those on the Blackstone UOA's here so no idea how to interpret them.


UOATBN.jpg
 
Originally Posted By: KL31
Got my TBN result today. Was 3.1 and I'll update the report picture later today.

I do use regular 91 RON instead of 98.

Thanks KL31 for the TBN update, you just talked me out of using C3 oil.

In Australia the fuel standard says a max of 150 ppm sulphur for regular ULP (91 RON) and a max of 50 ppm sulphur for PULP ( 95 & 98 RON). This is the max, and I've seen figures that show less than this for many name brand products. However the PULP always shows less sulphur than the regular ULP.

So my guess would be if you ran it on 95RON then you would show more retained TBN.
 
Too bad the 95 and 98 are almost 20 cents more though. Maybe I'm exaggerating but it's definitely more than 10 cents per L more. Better off using 91 and changing oil more often. Wonder how bad c3 would get beat up with 91 octane especially when the TBN is often in the 6-7 range to start with.
 
Yeah PULP is more expensive, but my car responds to changes in fuel octane and advances the ignition to take advantage of it. According to the original reviews published, I get about 3% more power going from 91 RON (ULP) to 95 RON (PULP). So I mostly run 95 and it does feel a little more perky and seems to return a little better fuel economy. So for me I feel it's worth it. But if your car doesn't take advantage of the higher octane fuel, it's probably not worth the price increase. For me 98 RON isn't worth it, only the 95 RON.

These are all ethanol free fuels. However you can get an E10 that is 94RON I believe, and quite cheap. Not sure is this is a good idea or not. Sure more octane for less coin, but I hear ethanol reduces the energy density of the fuel. I just don't know.
 
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