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2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 #4615091
12/26/17 08:38 PM
12/26/17 08:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 625
FL
BeerCan Offline OP
BeerCan  Offline OP
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 625
FL
Not to much towing this round. Fill is actually 5qt's Castrol 0w40 and 1 qt 0w30



2017 Ford F250 6.7 PS
2016 Ford F150 3.5 EB
2015 Hyundai Genesis 5.0
2012 Hyundai Genesis 3.8
2015 Ford Mustang 2.3 EB
My car list is getting long smile
1999 F350 7.3L PSD
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615142
12/26/17 09:16 PM
12/26/17 09:16 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
MParr Offline
MParr  Offline
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
Iíve noticed the high fuel dilution as well. The test facility noted abnormal to critical in your samples. I would have to say, you are pushing your OCIs out too far and you are not changing the filter at every oil change. I would suggest you change the oil and filter at 5,000 miles. DO NOT rely on the oil life monitor, just reset it when you do your 5,000 mile oil change. Try a high quality 5W30 blend or synthetic.


2013 KIA Optima EX 2.4L. Now: QSUD 5W30 & STP S2808ML
2017 Ford Escape SE 2.0T Now: Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 & Motorcraft 910s
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615220
12/26/17 10:51 PM
12/26/17 10:51 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 542
Texas (south)
FermeLaPorte Offline
FermeLaPorte  Offline
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 542
Texas (south)
Turbocharged direct injection engines shouldn't go past 4k OCIs. Keep pushing your luck.


Always Mobil 1
2014 1.6L Nissan Versa Sedan, 5 spd, 5k OCI.
2011 3.5L Chevrolet Impala, Automatic, 5k OCI.
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: FermeLaPorte] #4615228
12/26/17 10:58 PM
12/26/17 10:58 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
MParr Offline
MParr  Offline
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
Heíll be OK out to 5,000 miles and anything after that is luck pushing. Oil and filters are cheap, engines arenít.


2013 KIA Optima EX 2.4L. Now: QSUD 5W30 & STP S2808ML
2017 Ford Escape SE 2.0T Now: Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 & Motorcraft 910s
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615237
12/26/17 11:18 PM
12/26/17 11:18 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 128
CA
209paulc Offline
209paulc  Offline
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 128
CA
Oil held up!!! Fuel dilution is not a issue in these engines. I too use Edge 0w40 in my 2.7 Ecoboost and have used the oil since the very first oil change. I've stuck with 5k OCIs for the first 30k miles but I'm currently extending this interval out to 10k and your UOAs are proof this oil is up to the task. Fuel dilution is even less of a issue with the 2.7s so I'm not concerned one bit.


2016 Ford F150 2.7L Ecoboost 50k Miles
Mobil 1 0W-40 & Archoil 9100 10k OCI

2016 Ford Fusion 1.5L Ecoboost 37k Miles
Mobil 1 0W-40 10K OCI
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: FermeLaPorte] #4615245
12/26/17 11:28 PM
12/26/17 11:28 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 128
CA
209paulc Offline
209paulc  Offline
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 128
CA
Name one manufacturer that recommends anything less then a 5k OCI under normal driving conditions for a turbo/DI equipped application.

Last edited by 209paulc; 12/26/17 11:32 PM.

2016 Ford F150 2.7L Ecoboost 50k Miles
Mobil 1 0W-40 & Archoil 9100 10k OCI

2016 Ford Fusion 1.5L Ecoboost 37k Miles
Mobil 1 0W-40 10K OCI
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615286
12/27/17 01:01 AM
12/27/17 01:01 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,387
Fort Lauderdale, FL
DoubleWasp Offline
DoubleWasp  Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,387
Fort Lauderdale, FL
That FD would have me spooked too.

But the wear metals reflect a very respectable performance.


07 Lincoln Navigator M1 0w-40/FU
68 Charger R/T / Supercharged 440 VR1/DBL7349
07 Ram 3500 4x4 / Cummins 6.7 /DBL7349
17 Maserati GranTurismo Cabrio
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615287
12/27/17 01:02 AM
12/27/17 01:02 AM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 367
Washington, USA
Onug Offline
Onug  Offline
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 367
Washington, USA
Fuel dilution is very common with the EB motors here on BITOG, especially the 3.5. I have yet to experience it myself, but my guess is it will start showing up as I add up the miles.

The one thing I miss from the Polaris Lab reports are the universal averages. But I donít see anything alarming with these numbers since youíre running a full OCI. My OCD would go nuts with this level of fuel and Iíd drop to a 5,000 mile interval...but honestly, without a spike in wear metals, thereís no evidence Fordís computer isnít accurate for your driving habits.


2016 F-150 3.5L Ecoboost
Current Oil: Castrol Magnatec 5W-30 and Fram Ultra filter
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615295
12/27/17 01:23 AM
12/27/17 01:23 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 128
CA
209paulc Offline
209paulc  Offline
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 128
CA
I agree fuel dilution is common in these engines but its not a issue that translates to higher wear numbers. Now would I recommended 10k miles with your standard 5w30 blend or synthetic...No way!! But I do trust any Euro 0w40 (especially Castrol) to handle 10k miles with ease in these Ecoboosts....yes!


2016 Ford F150 2.7L Ecoboost 50k Miles
Mobil 1 0W-40 & Archoil 9100 10k OCI

2016 Ford Fusion 1.5L Ecoboost 37k Miles
Mobil 1 0W-40 10K OCI
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615366
12/27/17 07:09 AM
12/27/17 07:09 AM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
MParr Offline
MParr  Offline
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
What is gasoline? It is a solvent. It thins out oil. You are gambling with the proper lubrication of your engines. A used oil sample only warns of problems down the road. You can use them as a warning or you can use them to justify extended oil change intervals. A little blast from the past is in order.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OHug0AIhVoQ


2013 KIA Optima EX 2.4L. Now: QSUD 5W30 & STP S2808ML
2017 Ford Escape SE 2.0T Now: Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 & Motorcraft 910s
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615379
12/27/17 07:36 AM
12/27/17 07:36 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 7,442
Jupiter, Florida
Cujet Offline
Cujet  Offline
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 7,442
Jupiter, Florida
OCI's are far too long. While it's wonderful to think that all wear metals AND PARTICULATES show up in the UOA, that's simply not so. Fuel dilution has LONG BEEN ASSOCIATED WITH EXCESSIVE WEAR AND DEPOSITS, PERIOD. Oil changes are the only way to drain out contaminates.

The EB is a tough engine, designed to take all sorts of abuse. However, we must always remember that there is risk in pushing limits. If I were to predict which direction this will go, I'd say timing chain wear, phaser wear, carboned up piston rings, intake valve deposits and turbo coking.

Also remember that very large quantities of fuel are required to create such dilution, this leaves behind all sorts of components that ARE NOT FUEL, and ARE NOT OIL. Gums, varnish, and so on. As most of the fuel evaporates, what 5% means is that much of your oil is not oil. BTW, the industry norm states that 5% fuel dilution renders the oil unable to protect.

Here is an example form a 2013 Ecoboost 3.5L from 2450 miles of driving:



This was spun in a centrifuge and analysed. 70% acid water, 23% raw fuel, and 7% oil saturated with abrasive particulate matter.


I've done some testing years ago on my 3.5EB. I came to the conclusion that 5K OCI's are about the limit.

Last edited by Cujet; 12/27/17 07:49 AM.

People who count on their fingers should maintain a discreet silence.
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: Cujet] #4615390
12/27/17 07:53 AM
12/27/17 07:53 AM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
MParr Offline
MParr  Offline
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 637
Georgia
Thank you, Cujet. Donít forget rod bearings.

Last edited by MParr; 12/27/17 07:56 AM.

2013 KIA Optima EX 2.4L. Now: QSUD 5W30 & STP S2808ML
2017 Ford Escape SE 2.0T Now: Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 & Motorcraft 910s
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615395
12/27/17 08:06 AM
12/27/17 08:06 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,509
Indianapolis, IN
dnewton3 Offline
dnewton3  Offline
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,509
Indianapolis, IN
Fuel is about "normal" for what we have come to expect from EBs.

However, show me that it matters. Not by whining about the condition of the lube, but rather, show me that it actually has some detrimental effect in wear. Go on ... I double-dog dare you ...

Fe is around 2.1 ppm/1k miles. That is NOT, by ANY stretch of the imagination, a bad wear rate. Many, many engines that run incredibly long lives run wear rates at, or higher, than that. The other metals are fine as well.

When will some of you learn that conditions of the lube (vis, FP, Fuel, TBN/TAN) are only PREDICTORS of a POTENTIAL for wear trend changes? Wear rates are determined by the wear metals, not the input conditions of the lube.

10k mile OCIs are perfectly fine here, and these successive UOAs prove it.


Last edited by dnewton3; 12/27/17 08:15 AM.

The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615399
12/27/17 08:10 AM
12/27/17 08:10 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 9,400
Kendall, FL
wemay Offline
wemay  Offline
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 9,400
Kendall, FL
dexos1 Gen2 specifically addresses timing chain wear (along with LSPI), i doubt this spec will slow down dilution, so the add pack is where the protection takes place even as we cringe at the levels of fuel. I would trust a uoa to warn of excessive wear in this area.


'18 KIA Sportage LX AWD 2.4L: MSS 10w30
'13 Hyundai Santa Fe Sport 2.0T: EDGE 5w30
Re: 2016 Ford 3.5EB 10K miles castrol 0w40 [Re: BeerCan] #4615423
12/27/17 08:37 AM
12/27/17 08:37 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,509
Indianapolis, IN
dnewton3 Offline
dnewton3  Offline
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 7,509
Indianapolis, IN
For comparison, consider this ...
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthr...5_3#Post4610564
here's another UOA, shorter OCI at 4k miles, and the Fe is at 8ppm. So, the exact same wear rate exists (2.x ppm/1k miles).
And the engine here has a very low fuel content, so you cannot blame fuel here, can you? This engine isn't even DI.
So why is it that no one complains about a MPI engine running 4k mile OCIs resulting in Fe at 2ppm/1k miles,
But every freaks out at a GDI engine running 10k mile OCIs resulting in Fe at 2ppm/1k miles?

I'll tell you why ... ignorance and/or arrogance. Bitog lube bigotry. Bench racing emotions rather than using intellect.


Here's another example
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/4600134/'03_Hyundai_Santa_Fe_2.7L_V6_-#Post4600134
2.2ppm / 1k miles. OCI at 3k miles. Using PUP lube.
No one complained about the lube or wear in this UOA. No one mentioned fuel because it's fine. No one mentioned a shorter OCI because it's already at 3k miles.
All the "inputs" were exactly where an anal-retentive BITOGer would want them to be, but the Fe wear was still identical to the EB engine in the host thread here.


You can go on and on finding other examples such as these.
Any engine that is averaging less than 3ppm/1k miles is doing fine, regardless of how long or short the OCIs are, or how much fuel they have, etc.


This isn't just one UOA for the EB engine here; there are six successive UOAs showing the wear data is fairly steady. Certainly I agree that using a cautious approach is prudent here. The fuel MIGHT, at some point, cause a wear trend shift. But so far, it's abundantly clear that these OCI durations are NOT resulting in damage. The EB engine in this thread is doing just fine, despite all the fear mongering.


QUIT LOOKING AT INPUTS AND START FOCUSING ON RESULTS!

Last edited by dnewton3; 12/27/17 08:40 AM.

The act of preventative maintenance, in and of itself, is FAR MORE important than brand/grade/base choices among lubes and filters.
- under maintaining something is akin to abuse/neglect; that can kill equipment by shortening the lifespan
- over maintaining something has never been proven to be anything but a waste of time and money
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