Removing water from tractor transmission-hydaulic

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Hello!

I have a Ford-New-Holland 4430 orchard tractor (100% made by Fiat) that keeps getting water in the tranny. Did a complete flush last year (multiple rinse with diesel).

So far this time, I have fill and drained the transmission twice with diesel (and driving the tractor around the barn to mix it up). Keeps getting out milky as ...!!

I am sure that 47 rinse cycles will fix it but I would like to reduce the time and expense.

Any suggestion that would speed up this process?

And no, no water get in through the shifter boots. It has a cab. The fill opening is threaded good and tight. Can't figure out where all that water is coming from... grr.


Francis
 
Yes, forgot to mention it. I did add some Methyl Hydrate in the second flush...

There are some many nooks and crannys in those castings... Did I mentionned the FOUR drain plugs?

aaargh.
 
Are you sure that it is water? I heard a tractor tech suggest to a customer to let the tractor sit so that the water would separate to the bottom. Then just drain off the water after they added some contaminated fluid. Personally, I would just drain it, change the filters and refill it with good oil and let it ride.
 
Once the water is emulsified it will not separate for a long time.

The problem is taht there is enough water in the oil that it freeze over and jams the pump, the loader valve, etc.
 
Get some PCV and insert a couple of rolls of toilet paper in one end and plug the centers. Stand it up and pour the hydraulic fluid down through the pipe, through the TP and into a clean catch pan. Water will not pass through. Just be patient, it will take some time.
 
Originally Posted By: Francis4344
Once the water is emulsified it will not separate for a long time.

The problem is taht there is enough water in the oil that it freeze over and jams the pump, the loader valve, etc.

I just don't see how it is possible that there could be that much water left after a flush. Unless there is a leaking oil cooler like mentioned above.
 
It's a tractor guys, no oil cooler! Big tranny. 10 gallons of oil. After Christmas, I will get back to it. More diesel, more flushing.

I was hoping for a miracle product/technique that wolud help grab/adsorb/coalesce the water, short of putting a boiler under the tractor to boil it off!
smile.gif
 
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/index.php


Head over on here. There Is it separate section for each make and I’m sure somebody there Will know exactly what you’re dealing with. It sounds pretty odd to me that you keep flushing this thing and keep coming up with more water. Are you sure it’s not coming in somewhere ??? That water continuously showing up just doesn’t seem right with the conditions you’re describing. Have you tried calling the Ford dealer and talking to the mechanic or counter guy? Sometimes they know the little oddities a particular models that you wont readily hear about because after all they probably seen it before .
 
Originally Posted By: Francis4344
Once the water is emulsified it will not separate for a long time. .


How many gallons?

I use a turkey fryer burner to heat a large can (4-5 gallons at a time) - with an oil fryer thermometer.

Once you hit 250*F - all the water will be gone and the oil will look perfect again.
 
Accidentally submerged a motorcycle once. Once extracted the crankcase was pretty full of water. Used what ever clean plastic bottles we could find to hold the contaminated oil. Then cooked it a couple of cups at a time over a small camp stove.

Rode the bike out. It was fine.

Rod
 
1) How fast does the fluid get contaminated?
2) How often does the tractor get used? (I'm guessing a lot.)

I'm wondering, depending on those 2 factors, if you could just keep two sets of trans fluid: one in the tractor and one in jugs in the barn, separating out naturally. The water should fall to the bottom within a week.

Obviously the first thing to do is diagnose the water intrusion or start talking to other 4430 owners online.
 
Originally Posted By: Ethan1

I'm wondering, depending on those 2 factors, if you could just keep two sets of trans fluid: one in the tractor and one in jugs in the barn, separating out naturally. The water should fall to the bottom within a week.


Nope.

Not in hydraulic fluid - it gets emulsified and STAYS that way.

Only heat will boil the water out.
 
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Originally Posted By: Ethan1

I'm wondering, depending on those 2 factors, if you could just keep two sets of trans fluid: one in the tractor and one in jugs in the barn, separating out naturally. The water should fall to the bottom within a week.


Nope.

Not in hydraulic fluid - it gets emulsified and STAYS that way.

Only heat will boil the water out.

Hydraulic specification-oils demulsifies, unlike engine oils that emulsifies.
Ethan1 could be right.
 
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We have a 2940 JD that is used to grind and mix feed, it's basically stationary, only moving from one feed bin to the next. It is ran at WOT while mixing feed, but the transmission doesn't get hot enough to get rid of the moisture the hydraulic fluid accumulates. I drained the transmission (3 drain plugs and a little over 15 gallons) in October, I'm not sure how long this oil had been in service, but I'm guessing 4-5,000 hours, my PS and Hydraulics were not functioning well if at all on cold days.... or warm days in some cases. The strainer was nasty and the oil looked like pond water. I changed both hydraulic filters and cleaned the suction screen, then refilled with 15 gallons of new hydraulic oil. Then we had the dealership put a new pto bearing and seal in, they drained it again and refilled with new. They noted on the invoice that the hydraulic oil (which had been in service 1 day) was extremely contaminated. I haven't changed it again since, but it's been about 30-35 hours and the hydraulics have been better since I changed it than I ever remember them being. The hydraulics are still weak, but the 2940's aren't known for having real robust hydraulics to begin with. Plus it has over 12,000 original hours.

 
Assuming you are using a universal tractor hydraulic fluid, it will probably stay emulsified for a while. The chemistry of a UTHF is going to be different from a "regular" hydraulic fluid in that the UTHFs (that I have seen anyway) typically have a detergent/dispersant similar to a motor oil.

Typically a regular non-contaminated (as in contaminated by something that emulsifies like motor oil) is specified to separate out pretty much completely in a 50/50 mix in about 30 minutes.

It may separate some, but it is unlikely to separate completely.
 
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