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#4598991 - 12/09/17 12:54 PM Motor oil recommendations are not requirements.
wemay Online   happy

Registered: 04/04/12
Posts: 8382
Loc: Southeast Florida
Lets take Hyundai for instance.

2015-present, turbo recommendation is to use ACEA A5. Yet all previous (my 2013 included) are status quo SM/GF4. Back to the A5 recommendations... In every Hyundai owner's manual, Quaker State is the recommended oil, yet there is no QS product that currently carries A5 approval. Finally, if a certain approval were "required", they would need to use that as dealer fill. They do not. What's used is Conventional. If you are like thousands of owners that only want the dealership to carry out service, your engine will never see A5. And if that engine should suffer an oil related failure (exceedingly rare but used for arguments sake), there'd be no way for them to come after the owner if oil level os correct.

Again, most Owner's Manuals only recommend and do not require.
17 Hyundai Sonata 2.4 | RP 5w20 | OEM | WIX
13 Hyundai Santa Fe 2.0T | PP 5w30 | OEM | WIX (Wife)
18 Honda HR-V 1.5, CVT | FF 0w20 | OEM | OEM (Mom)

#4598997 - 12/09/17 01:01 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
Pajero Offline

Registered: 05/05/12
Posts: 774
Loc: Rio Rancho, NM
You make an excellent point. I just referenced my OM and sure enough it states "Recommended oil."


Always remember "Planned obsolescence."

1994 Montero SR 3.5 DOHC, 128,xxx
Fram Ultra/ Snorkel with Pre-filter

#4598999 - 12/09/17 01:04 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
GSCJR Offline

Registered: 01/20/13
Posts: 1040
Loc: Ontario, Canada
I knew a car salesman who was driving a second hand Porsche Boxster back in the late 90's. I asked him how often he changed the oil in it and he said he doesn't; because according to him oil changes were only recommended by Porsche. Go figure.

Edited by GSCJR (12/09/17 01:05 PM)
Edit Reason: Add info.
03 3.0L 1MZ-FE QSGB 5w-30 ProSelect 21348 248KM
10 3.5L 2GR-FE CEB 0w-20 ProSelect 27047 155KM

#4599003 - 12/09/17 01:15 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
Merkava_4 Offline

Registered: 01/30/07
Posts: 17501
Loc: Clovis, CA
It's easier to make a claim against the car manufacturer, motor oil company, oil filter company, or the store you bought everything from if something goes wrong and you are using the correct viscosity and oil filter.

#4599025 - 12/09/17 01:45 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
Rand Offline

Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 12405
Loc: NE,Ohio
bah its all semanics.. but if they say your oil caused the issue.. spending 10000 on a lawyer is alot more expensive than just using the right oil.

Jeep says
Engine Oil Viscosity (SAE Grade) — 3.2L Engine
MOPAR SAE 5W-20 engine oil or equivalent Pennzoil or
Shell Helix is recommended for all operating tempera-

but they ALSO SAY
Lubricants which do not have both the engine oil certi-
fication mark and the correct SAE viscosity grade num-
ber should not be used.

You may use synthetic engine oils provided the recom-
mended oil quality requirements are met, and the recom-
mended maintenance intervals for oil and filter changes
are followed.
Synthetic engine oils which do not have both the engine
oil certification mark and the correct SAE viscosity grade
number should not be used.

That is about as clear as mud.. what is an engine oil certification mark?

What is the recommended oil quality requirement?

they list NO required, just recommended. It basically boils down to
lawyerese designed to protect them and screw you IMO.

So what oil will I use?
I will use 5w20 syn that is an approved ms-6395 oil and pay 2 bucks per quart.

And I'll pass on arguing about recommended for doesnt mean required.
and all the phony oil words like
recommended for, meets and exceeds,

I will just buy a product that says ms-6395 period.
2017 Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk V6

#4599037 - 12/09/17 02:02 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
bullwinkle Offline

Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 7337
Loc: Cincinnati, OH, USA
Oil certification mark is the API donut, and any MS-6395 oil is going to carry it. I would just keep the receipts for oil & filter changes, and pray that Chrysler Fiat/FCA doesn't have to repair it!
06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4(FG Venturi), 93 GMC C3500 6.2, 89 F-450 7.3, 98 XJ 4.0(XG8A), 05 xB(XG3600), 15 Transit 3.7, 03 Merc Grand Marquis 4.6 2V(XG2)

#4599041 - 12/09/17 02:07 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
Bjornviken Online   content

Registered: 12/06/17
Posts: 80
Loc: Finland
Amsoil have ACEA A5

#4599049 - 12/09/17 02:19 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
BrocLuno Offline

Registered: 09/06/15
Posts: 5062
Loc: Kalifornia Kollective
All of this is to make us sleep better. If we think following the OM is the thing that makes us happy - so be it. If we think running HDEO in everything works for us, then that's what happens. If we do track days, then something off the Porsche A40 list will prolly make us happier smile

Since I have not owned anything with a warranty since the 1970's, I could give a rat about required... I look at conditions (Driving and engine) and decide. Sometimes I switch it up for some reason ...

Folks who buy vehicles with warranties loose so much money in the fist 25K, that they could have paid for the repairs 2X if they'd have bought nice clean used one with 90K, and just driven into the sunset laugh
Formerly in marine engineering. In an earlier life I owned my own petroleum tank truck, and hauled for the majors and independent's.

#4599082 - 12/09/17 02:50 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
SilverSnake Online   content

Registered: 05/29/13
Posts: 534
Loc: Florida
You might want to also look at the warranty information book for the car or truck you own.

For example, the warranty book for my 2016 Charger Scat Pack states: "Your warranties don't cover the costs of repairing damage or conditions caused by any of the following:" One of the "following" states: "using any fluid that doesn't meet the minimum recommendations of your Owner's Manual."

To me these statements are crystal clear. The minimum recommendations are, in fact, requirements. The bottom line: If you care about your warranty, then use the recommended oils (at least for FCA products and I suspect for most other manufacturers as well). If you don't then use whatever you want.

Edited by SilverSnake (12/09/17 02:56 PM)
2016 Charger, 6.4L-485 HP (PUP 0W-40)
2017 BMW 330i, 2L-248 HP (BMW 0W-20)
2018 Jeep GC, 3.6L-295 HP (PUP 0W-20)
2008 20KW Generac (Amsoil 10W-30/30)

#4599095 - 12/09/17 03:06 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
slacktide_bitog Offline

Registered: 03/20/08
Posts: 5616
Loc: USA
The only A5/B5 oil still available in the US is PP (and if you can find it, PUP). Castrol said they were going to change their formula of Edge a bit to meet A5/B5 again.

QSUD used to claim A5-02 when they still used the clear bottles.

You can (and probably should) write to both Hyundai and QS and explain this to them, that QS is FF and recommended by Hyundai, but there are no QS-brand oils that even meet A5.

#4599119 - 12/09/17 03:33 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
Errtt Offline

Registered: 11/14/10
Posts: 2776
Loc: California
For my DD SUV, the manual recommends Quaker State, and 5w-20 which is also on the fill cap.
So I use PYB 5w-30. (Do have a jug of MagaTec 5w-20 I have yet to try).

My Honda mower and generator, recommends 10w-30. I use Rotella 15w-40 (5w-40 a few times) since bought new.

#4599143 - 12/09/17 04:05 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
Charlie2015 Offline

Registered: 04/24/15
Posts: 205
Loc: Georgia
The Hyundai/Kia dealer near me is dishonest, so even though you could jump through hoops like using ACEA A5 and changing the oil on time, they would still try to fool you out of a warranty repair. No engine should fail using quality oil (conventional or synthetic) and changing every 3-5k miles.
1998 Honda Accord EX 2.3L

#4599156 - 12/09/17 04:22 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
Bryanccfshr Offline

Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 5625
Loc: Durango, Co
This is telling
For my 4 runners
■ Engine oil selection
 Except for Puerto Rico
“Toyota Genuine Motor Oil” is used in your Toyota vehicle. Use Toyota approved “Toyota Genuine Motor Oil” or equivalent to sat- isfy the following grade and viscosity.
Oil grade: ILSAC GF-5 multigrade engine oil
Recommended viscosity: SAE 0W-20
SAE 0W-20 is the best choice for good fuel economy and good starting in cold weather.
If SAE 0W-20 is not available, SAE 5W-20 oil may be used. However, it must be replaced with SAE 0W-20 at the next oil change.this is the CAFE compliance language
Oil viscosity (0W-20 is explained here as an example):
• The 0W in 0W-20 indicates the characteristic of the oil which allows cold startability. Oils with a lower value before the W allow
for easier starting of the engine in cold weather.
• The 20 in 0W-20 indicates the viscosity characteristic of the oil
when the oil is at high temperature. An oil with a higher viscosity (one with a higher value) may be better suited if the vehicle is operated at high speeds, or under extreme load conditions. This is what the designers think but they cannot put it up top to comply with the CAFE legal requirements.

How to read oil container label:
The International Lubricant Specification Advisory Committee (ILSAC) Certification Mark is added to some oil containers to help you select the oil you should use.

Then there is the same vehicle in Puerto Rico..also seen across the Caribbean.
Same difference

For Puerto Rico
“Toyota Genuine Motor Oil” is used in your Toyota vehicle. Use Toyota approved “Toyota Genuine Motor Oil” or equivalent to satisfy the following grade and viscosity.
Oil grade:
0W-20, 5W-20, 5W-30 and 10W-30:
API grade SL “Energy-Conserving”, SM “Energy-Conserving” or SN “Resource-Conserving”; or ILSAC multigrade engine oil
API grade SL, SM or SN multigrade engine oil
Recommended viscosity (SAE):
If you use SAE 10W-30 or a higher viscosity engine oil in extremely low temperatures, the engine may become difficult to start, so SAE 0W-20, 5W-20 or 5W-30 engine oil is recom- mended.

Good best practice temperature and service chart

Check this out
How to read oil container labels:
Either or both API registered marks are added to some oil contain- ers to help you select the oil you should use.
1 API Service Symbol
Top portion: “API SERVICE SN” means the oil quality designa- tion by American Petroleum Institute (API).
Center portion: “SAE 0W-20” means the SAE viscosity grade. Lower portion: “Resource-Con- serving” means that the oil has fuel-saving and environmental protection capabilities.
2 ILSAC Certification Mark
The International Lubricant Specification Advisory Committee (ILSAC)
Certification Mark is displayed on the front of the container.

Seems like the engine is not that picky to me.
They recommend ILSAC oils because that is what the engine was designed to run on but you don’t have to.

Edited by Bryanccfshr (12/09/17 04:26 PM)
2017 Trd Pro 4Runner
2018 Trd Pro 4Runner 0w20 winter, 5-10w30 summer.
2012 BMW 328i Castrol 0w40
2007 f150 4.6 4x4 Motorcraft 5w20

#4599159 - 12/09/17 04:30 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
skyactiv Online   content

Registered: 03/02/13
Posts: 4026
Loc: The Midwest
Maybe Hyundai should create their own oil spec like a lot of other vehicle manufactures have been doing for years.
I'll just make up a few new specs for Hyundai approved motor oils: Hyundai G1-L for thin low viscosity oils and
Hyundai G1-T for turbo applications. Are you listening Hyundai? If it makes the oil cost more, I hope not.
Wife: 15' Audi A4 quattro 6 speed manual
Me: 13' VW GTI 3 door 6 speed manual

#4599196 - 12/09/17 05:14 PM Re: Motor oil recommendations are not requirements. [Re: wemay]
MParr Offline

Registered: 10/28/17
Posts: 414
Loc: Georgia
Our local Hyundai dealership uses Quaker State 5W30 blend, exclusively.
2013 KIA Optima EX 2.4L. Now: Castrol Magnatec GTX 5W30 synthetic &OE filter
2017 Ford Escape SE 2.0T Now: PennPlt 5w30 syn FL-910s

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