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#4597289 - 12/07/17 04:23 PM A Day that will live in Infamy
Papa Bear Online   content


Registered: 08/11/05
Posts: 7050
Loc: Leamington, ON, Canada ..... r...
76 yrs ago
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#4597299 - 12/07/17 04:42 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear]
Al Offline


Registered: 06/08/02
Posts: 18035
Loc: Elizabethtown, Pa
Amen. True heroes.
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#4597321 - 12/07/17 05:07 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear]
OneEyeJack Offline


Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 7479
Loc: S California
A walk around survey at a liberal arts college in the LA area found that almost 40% of the enrolled students with history, government or international studies as a major had no idea that there was some significance to the date December 7th, 1941. An addition 18% thought there was something significant but only got the correct answer when prompted by a multiple choice written question and some blatant hints from the pollsters.

At a new construction site on campus putting up a 4 story building, 100% of the people working there knew the significance of that date.

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#4597327 - 12/07/17 05:17 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: OneEyeJack]
gathermewool Offline


Registered: 01/09/09
Posts: 5987
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
A walk around survey at a liberal arts college in the LA area found that almost 40% of the enrolled students with history, government or international studies as a major had no idea that there was some significance to the date December 7th, 1941. An addition 18% thought there was something significant but only got the correct answer when prompted by a multiple choice written question and some blatant hints from the pollsters.

At a new construction site on campus putting up a 4 story building, 100% of the people working there knew the significance of that date.


cite that...

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#4597394 - 12/07/17 06:29 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear]
PimTac Offline


Registered: 03/04/17
Posts: 4285
Loc: Soviet State of Washington
I found the news this week of the discovery of the USS Ward timely and fascinating. The Ward fired the first shot of WW2 for the US when it fired upon and dropped depth charges on a Japanese submarine outside the sub nets at Pearl Harbor. This was just hours before the main attack occurred. The Ward was struck by a kamikaze plane exactly three years later on Dec 7, 1944 and sunk. Paul Allenís research vessel discovered the destroyer in Ormoc bay in the Philippines.

This discovery plus the recent discovery of the USS Indianapolis brings to light the history of WW2 and will be a great teaching tool for further generations. They need to learn why we fought the war and why it ended the way it did, not a revised historical fiction that is being taught today. The US can proudly claim Japan and Germany as true friends and allies, something that would be unbelievable back in the 40ís.


Never forget and learn from these events.
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#4597403 - 12/07/17 06:39 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: PimTac]
bbhero Offline


Registered: 03/20/15
Posts: 4626
Loc: Virginia
Great points PimTac.
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#4597463 - 12/07/17 07:36 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 15696
Loc: OH
What if the many aircraft on site had been out on long range patrols?
They would have been able to detect the approach of this Japanese fleet and there's no way that the Japanese carriers could have launched an aircraft quickly enough to have chased down and destroyed these Americans.
What if the Japanese fleet had faced a determined American opposition with the commander thinking "I've got something for you."
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#4597484 - 12/07/17 08:03 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: fdcg27]
Al Offline


Registered: 06/08/02
Posts: 18035
Loc: Elizabethtown, Pa
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"


Edited by Al (12/07/17 08:04 PM)
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#4597576 - 12/07/17 09:41 PM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Al]
Ducked Offline


Registered: 10/25/12
Posts: 4360
Loc: Taiwan
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"


Of course, those attitudes are no longer tenable...

Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: CT8
Originally Posted By: Ducked
In the US?

Driven by fatter people. Diet Coke demographics.
grin grin grin


Taller and stronger, too...scary enough to keep Taiwan from being absorbed by the mainland.
;^)

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#4597681 - 12/08/17 12:27 AM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: fdcg27]
Uphill_Both_Ways Offline


Registered: 11/06/17
Posts: 63
Loc: Winnipeg
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if the many aircraft on site had been out on long range patrols?


They'd have had to be flying where the Japanese ships were. It's a big ocean.

I doubt such a flight of warplanes would have been loaded; it was peacetime for the U.S. ó for a very short time longer.
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#4597696 - 12/08/17 01:42 AM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear]
02SE Offline


Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 2728
Loc: The Canyons
My parents remember it like it was yesterday. They were both pre-teens. My Mom had relatives that lived within sight of Pearl Harbor, and they watched the attack from their house. They had some very harrowing stories of that day.

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#4597745 - 12/08/17 05:49 AM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Al]
Shannow Offline


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 39858
Loc: 'Stralia
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"


Yep, not for a moment...

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/wor...f0fd2b71be0986d

Nobody, not even designers of buildings ever thought that they'd be hit by planes either.

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#4597768 - 12/08/17 06:39 AM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear]
LoneRanger Offline


Registered: 07/02/07
Posts: 4058
Loc: Midwest USA
It got America in the war to win the war !!
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#4597811 - 12/08/17 07:46 AM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: OneEyeJack]
pandus13 Online   content


Registered: 08/12/11
Posts: 3195
Loc: Chicago,IL,USA
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
A walk around survey at a liberal arts college in the LA area found that almost 40% of the enrolled students with history, government or international studies as a major had no idea that there was some significance to the date December 7th, 1941. An addition 18% thought there was something significant but only got the correct answer when prompted by a multiple choice written question and some blatant hints from the pollsters.

At a new construction site on campus putting up a 4 story building, 100% of the people working there knew the significance of that date.

So (NNot directed at you OneEyeJack, just a request for everybody), what do you teach and tell some small kids (5 and 8 years old)?
They've been told at school something happen and watch some History channel promos about Pacific WWII already.
Much appreciated!
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#4597828 - 12/08/17 08:08 AM Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Al]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 15696
Loc: OH
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"


That then begs the question of why the US maintained a large naval fleet as well as an army air base way out in the Pacific? If there was no threat, then why bother?
For that matter, by December 1941 the capabilities and the ambitions of the Japanese should have been clear.
Surely it wasn't a secret that Japan had built a large blue water navy and that it had also developed and deployed many capable aircraft?
OTOH, many Japanese at the time saw the attack on Pearl as a turning point in the war which would inevitably lead to the destruction of Japan.
They were right.
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