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A Day that will live in Infamy #4597289
12/07/17 05:23 PM
12/07/17 05:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,137
Leamington, ON, Canada ..... r...
Papa Bear Offline OP
Papa Bear  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 7,137
Leamington, ON, Canada ..... r...
76 yrs ago


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Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear] #4597299
12/07/17 05:42 PM
12/07/17 05:42 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 18,230
Elizabethtown, Pa
Al Offline
Al  Offline
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 18,230
Elizabethtown, Pa
Amen. True heroes.


Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear] #4597321
12/07/17 06:07 PM
12/07/17 06:07 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
OneEyeJack Offline
OneEyeJack  Offline
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,485
S California
A walk around survey at a liberal arts college in the LA area found that almost 40% of the enrolled students with history, government or international studies as a major had no idea that there was some significance to the date December 7th, 1941. An addition 18% thought there was something significant but only got the correct answer when prompted by a multiple choice written question and some blatant hints from the pollsters.

At a new construction site on campus putting up a 4 story building, 100% of the people working there knew the significance of that date.

Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: OneEyeJack] #4597327
12/07/17 06:17 PM
12/07/17 06:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,206
New England
gathermewool Offline
gathermewool  Offline
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,206
New England
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
A walk around survey at a liberal arts college in the LA area found that almost 40% of the enrolled students with history, government or international studies as a major had no idea that there was some significance to the date December 7th, 1941. An addition 18% thought there was something significant but only got the correct answer when prompted by a multiple choice written question and some blatant hints from the pollsters.

At a new construction site on campus putting up a 4 story building, 100% of the people working there knew the significance of that date.


cite that...


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Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear] #4597394
12/07/17 07:29 PM
12/07/17 07:29 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,484
...
PimTac Offline
PimTac  Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,484
...
I found the news this week of the discovery of the USS Ward timely and fascinating. The Ward fired the first shot of WW2 for the US when it fired upon and dropped depth charges on a Japanese submarine outside the sub nets at Pearl Harbor. This was just hours before the main attack occurred. The Ward was struck by a kamikaze plane exactly three years later on Dec 7, 1944 and sunk. Paul Allenís research vessel discovered the destroyer in Ormoc bay in the Philippines.

This discovery plus the recent discovery of the USS Indianapolis brings to light the history of WW2 and will be a great teaching tool for further generations. They need to learn why we fought the war and why it ended the way it did, not a revised historical fiction that is being taught today. The US can proudly claim Japan and Germany as true friends and allies, something that would be unbelievable back in the 40ís.


Never forget and learn from these events.



Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: PimTac] #4597403
12/07/17 07:39 PM
12/07/17 07:39 PM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,040
Virginia
bbhero Offline
bbhero  Offline
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 5,040
Virginia
Great points PimTac.


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Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear] #4597463
12/07/17 08:36 PM
12/07/17 08:36 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,027
OH
fdcg27 Online content
fdcg27  Online Content
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,027
OH
What if the many aircraft on site had been out on long range patrols?
They would have been able to detect the approach of this Japanese fleet and there's no way that the Japanese carriers could have launched an aircraft quickly enough to have chased down and destroyed these Americans.
What if the Japanese fleet had faced a determined American opposition with the commander thinking "I've got something for you."


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Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: fdcg27] #4597484
12/07/17 09:03 PM
12/07/17 09:03 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 18,230
Elizabethtown, Pa
Al Offline
Al  Offline
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 18,230
Elizabethtown, Pa
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"

Last edited by Al; 12/07/17 09:04 PM.

Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Al] #4597576
12/07/17 10:41 PM
12/07/17 10:41 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,640
Taiwan
Ducked Online content
Ducked  Online Content
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,640
Taiwan
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"


Of course, those attitudes are no longer tenable...

Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted By: CT8
Originally Posted By: Ducked
In the US?

Driven by fatter people. Diet Coke demographics.
grin grin grin


Taller and stronger, too...scary enough to keep Taiwan from being absorbed by the mainland.
;^)

Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: fdcg27] #4597681
12/08/17 01:27 AM
12/08/17 01:27 AM
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 113
Winnipeg
Uphill_Both_Ways Offline
Uphill_Both_Ways  Offline
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 113
Winnipeg
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if the many aircraft on site had been out on long range patrols?


They'd have had to be flying where the Japanese ships were. It's a big ocean.

I doubt such a flight of warplanes would have been loaded; it was peacetime for the U.S. ó for a very short time longer.


2008 Impala 3.5
Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear] #4597696
12/08/17 02:42 AM
12/08/17 02:42 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,891
The Canyons
02SE Offline
02SE  Offline
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,891
The Canyons
My parents remember it like it was yesterday. They were both pre-teens. My Mom had relatives that lived within sight of Pearl Harbor, and they watched the attack from their house. They had some very harrowing stories of that day.

Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Al] #4597745
12/08/17 06:49 AM
12/08/17 06:49 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 40,944
'Stralia
Shannow Online content
Shannow  Online Content
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 40,944
'Stralia
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"


Yep, not for a moment...

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/wor...f0fd2b71be0986d

Nobody, not even designers of buildings ever thought that they'd be hit by planes either.

Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Papa Bear] #4597768
12/08/17 07:39 AM
12/08/17 07:39 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 4,216
Midwest USA
LoneRanger Offline
LoneRanger  Offline
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 4,216
Midwest USA
It got America in the war to win the war !!



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Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: OneEyeJack] #4597811
12/08/17 08:46 AM
12/08/17 08:46 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,346
Chicago,IL,USA
pandus13 Offline
pandus13  Offline
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,346
Chicago,IL,USA
Originally Posted By: OneEyeJack
A walk around survey at a liberal arts college in the LA area found that almost 40% of the enrolled students with history, government or international studies as a major had no idea that there was some significance to the date December 7th, 1941. An addition 18% thought there was something significant but only got the correct answer when prompted by a multiple choice written question and some blatant hints from the pollsters.

At a new construction site on campus putting up a 4 story building, 100% of the people working there knew the significance of that date.

So (NNot directed at you OneEyeJack, just a request for everybody), what do you teach and tell some small kids (5 and 8 years old)?
They've been told at school something happen and watch some History channel promos about Pacific WWII already.
Much appreciated!


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Re: A Day that will live in Infamy [Re: Al] #4597828
12/08/17 09:08 AM
12/08/17 09:08 AM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,027
OH
fdcg27 Online content
fdcg27  Online Content
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 16,027
OH
Originally Posted By: Al
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
What if ....
What if....

The short answer is the U.S. did not for a moment think Japan would be able to mount a serious threat against the U.S. And yes they viewed Japan as a bunch of backwards "Yellow People"


That then begs the question of why the US maintained a large naval fleet as well as an army air base way out in the Pacific? If there was no threat, then why bother?
For that matter, by December 1941 the capabilities and the ambitions of the Japanese should have been clear.
Surely it wasn't a secret that Japan had built a large blue water navy and that it had also developed and deployed many capable aircraft?
OTOH, many Japanese at the time saw the attack on Pearl as a turning point in the war which would inevitably lead to the destruction of Japan.
They were right.


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